I Can't Even Look Away
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04-05-2013, 02:46 AM
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
I think you might enjoy a book called Illusions by Richard Bach, also Jonathan Livingstone Seagull, same author. Back when I was half and half about religion he made a lot of sense to me - he's got the same semi-mystical sort of feel to him as I get from your posts. Very enjoyable read. Also The Prophet by Khalil Gibran and of course the Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam - probably available free via something like project Gutenberg.

You might have read all of them already - they're pretty famous. But if you haven't, check them out Wink
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04-05-2013, 02:50 AM (This post was last modified: 04-05-2013 03:04 AM by fstratzero.)
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
I wonder if a unitarian church would help him out...

wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarian_Universalism

Unitarian Universalists do not
share a creed; rather, they are unified by
their shared search for spiritual growth and
by the understanding that an individual's
theology is a result of that search and not a
result of obedience to an authoritarian
requirement. Unitarian Universalists draw
from all major world religions and many
different theological sources and have a wide
range of beliefs and practices.


These groups have many many people of faith as well as atheist sermons. Very awesome group of people. For them theology is a playground. Which I think is a great idea for people who have non-mainstream concepts of god.

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The atheist is a man who destroys the imaginary things which afflict the human race, and so leads men back to nature, to experience and to reason.
-Baron d'Holbach-
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04-05-2013, 12:52 PM
 
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
(04-05-2013 02:46 AM)morondog Wrote:  I think you might enjoy a book called Illusions by Richard Bach, also Jonathan Livingstone Seagull, same author. Back when I was half and half about religion he made a lot of sense to me - he's got the same semi-mystical sort of feel to him as I get from your posts. Very enjoyable read. Also The Prophet by Khalil Gibran and of course the Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam - probably available free via something like project Gutenberg.

You might have read all of them already - they're pretty famous. But if you haven't, check them out Wink

I'll have to check out the others. I'd like to check out "Illusions" first. I read Jonathan Livingston Seagull a few times. Thanks for the tips. Bowing
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04-05-2013, 12:59 PM
 
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
(04-05-2013 02:50 AM)fstratzero Wrote:  I wonder if a unitarian church would help him out...

wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarian_Universalism

Unitarian Universalists do not
share a creed; rather, they are unified by
their shared search for spiritual growth and
by the understanding that an individual's
theology is a result of that search and not a
result of obedience to an authoritarian
requirement. Unitarian Universalists draw
from all major world religions and many
different theological sources and have a wide
range of beliefs and practices.


These groups have many many people of faith as well as atheist sermons. Very awesome group of people. For them theology is a playground. Which I think is a great idea for people who have non-mainstream concepts of god.

Thanks, Fstratzero, for the great idea, but I really want nothing to do with Church. If I could go back to any one, I'd go back to the Spiritualist church I went to when I lived in England. I am most in line with their concepts, I think. But no more churches for me. I don't care what anyone else's theology is unless I'm interpreting a dream or chart for them. At the same time, I'm not going to be pushing my personal theology around either.

Today is a better day. I woke up feeling better anyway.
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04-05-2013, 01:18 PM (This post was last modified: 05-05-2013 12:48 AM by Atheist_pilgrim.)
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
(04-05-2013 12:52 PM)Egor Wrote:  I'll have to check out the others. I'd like to check out "Illusions" first. I read Jonathan Livingston Seagull a few times. Thanks for the tips. Bowing

Go walk the Camino de Santiago in Spain, dude! That will clear your mind like nothing else, and it's cheap as heck. Plus you'll lose weight, get in shape, eat great food, drink fine vino (and orujo), meet cool people, and see beautiful scenery. Best therapy ever...Chase

Plus, with your medical training, you can help out a lot of pilgrims with foot problems, bug bites, heat exhaustion, and so on. That might lead you to become a volunteer at an albergue (pilgrim hostel) down the line - some former pilgrims do that year after year for two-week terms. Think it over - the high season kicks off in June (I started my trek in early July and it took me 40 days to reach Santiago, counting some break days)!

Here's a link to a great Camino website with lots of good info:

http://www.caminodesantiago.me/

Buen Camino!
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04-05-2013, 01:29 PM
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
(04-05-2013 12:59 PM)Egor Wrote:  
(04-05-2013 02:50 AM)fstratzero Wrote:  I wonder if a unitarian church would help him out...

wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarian_Universalism

Unitarian Universalists do not
share a creed; rather, they are unified by
their shared search for spiritual growth and
by the understanding that an individual's
theology is a result of that search and not a
result of obedience to an authoritarian
requirement. Unitarian Universalists draw
from all major world religions and many
different theological sources and have a wide
range of beliefs and practices.


These groups have many many people of faith as well as atheist sermons. Very awesome group of people. For them theology is a playground. Which I think is a great idea for people who have non-mainstream concepts of god.

Thanks, Fstratzero, for the great idea, but I really want nothing to do with Church. If I could go back to any one, I'd go back to the Spiritualist church I went to when I lived in England. I am most in line with their concepts, I think. But no more churches for me. I don't care what anyone else's theology is unless I'm interpreting a dream or chart for them. At the same time, I'm not going to be pushing my personal theology around either.

Today is a better day. I woke up feeling better anyway.

That's understandable. I never fit into any church either when I was a believer.

As an atheist now, church is an annoying experience.

Member of the Cult of Reason

The atheist is a man who destroys the imaginary things which afflict the human race, and so leads men back to nature, to experience and to reason.
-Baron d'Holbach-
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04-05-2013, 01:55 PM
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
(04-05-2013 01:12 AM)Egor Wrote:  So, I believe in God, or more accuratley, "The Divine." I'm not trying to save it. It's always there.

All my Christian notions have died. What I can tell you about the Divine that became more clear in all of this, is that it doesn't care. I get from it that it doesn't even particularly care if I'm depressed about it. I think it wants me depressed. Maybe there's something restorative about it.

Ed, this sounds very much like Deism except for the part that it wants you depressed.

Maybe Deism is the belief system for you. In many respects it is a position that is more tenable than theism. I'm sure you don't need the following but I'll put it up anyway for the forum:

Deism is the belief that reason and observation of the natural world are sufficient to determine the existence of God, accompanied with the rejection of revelation and authority as a source of religious knowledge. Deism gained prominence in the 17th and 18th centuries during the Age of Enlightenment—especially in Britain, France, Germany and America—among intellectuals raised as Christians who believed in one god, but found fault with organized religion and could not believe in supernatural events such as miracles, the inerrancy of scriptures, or the Trinity

Something else you may want to consider is to take some time off before you go searching for the next belief system or group to join. I would bet your emotions and psche are raw at the moment, hard to see things clearly and make good decisions in that state.

You can always hang around here and bounce off ideas or get support while the dust settles...there really isn't a time table for this, life is journey not a destination.

Hope you find inner peace.

FC

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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04-05-2013, 02:06 PM
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
Don't go to the dream interpretation groups and such. Just another dissapointment. That's no more real than god. Remember. . . You have already been dead. Before you were born. Nothing to fear. Also, remember that athiests are people. I am an alcholic myself. Still drinking. Many of us may pretend that we don't suffer, but we suffer as much as any christian. We realise that the solution to our problems is in our own hands. As a simple human, I may not have all the answers for you. But if you need someone to talk to, you can talk to me. I'm not an expert in anything, but (despite being an athiest) I care about people.
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04-05-2013, 02:29 PM
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
I don't think there is anything wrong with having "Your own personal relationship with god" Ed. "god" is a strong word though and whilst others may see it as an outside force some see it as themselves or simply nothing.

When you started your own church I am guessing that you had the best intentions... as in you believed that this was a good way of viewing and operating within the world and you simply wanted to show others how you lived and felt, what it brought into your life (positive wise).

There is nothing wrong in this but I think where you made a mistake (your not the only one, we all do it to some degree over every subject known to humanity) is you became abrasive to people who didn't follow/agree/empathise with your beliefs at that time.

Talking of beliefs I also think it is a very brave thing of you believe it or not to actually question yourself as we all like to rely on our rock solid foundations of how we view the world and when those foundations are shaken, we either blindly re-enforce them or we re-build them.

For me personally I had a realisation a long time ago that my beliefs have and will change over time so what does that say about my current beliefs? I describe it myself now as viewing things in "third person" as in given yin and yang for example.....

[Image: yin-yang.jpg]

.... sure I can focus on yin and in this I may oversee/disbelieve aspects of yang because of my beliefs/bias. I could focus on Yang and oversee/disbelieve aspects of yin because of my beliefs/bias.... OR.... I can focus on both and see the complete picture, with the realisation that my beliefs have changed in the past and will more than likely change again.

Your spirituality is a big part of you Ed... I believe that it shapes a big aspect of who you are and who you identify yourself as and plays a big part in your life on a daily basis. There is nothing wrong with this in my eyes as we all have our own personal beliefs but in your new realisations/personal insights I think you are strong enough to define your own religion so why not simply continue doing so, evolving it with new information about the world and how you see yourself within.

With regards to your depression I understand how you feel, that is why I have said in the past on other posts that if you can concentrate on yourself within and find peace, then it sort of shows on the outside world and everything else will fit into place. So I wish you luck in identifying and filling this gap with something that makes you feel happy and brings you peace.

Questioning brings epiphany's... those are the moments I live for Thumbsup

Not that a number or rep on a simple forum actually means fuck all in the bigger picture but Ill reset my rep of you to in some small way show my support to you. I only negged repped you for your behaviour and attitude towards others, not for your personal beliefs and I wish you luck in finding and identifying with your spirituality in a more meaningful way to yourself that brings you happiness.

I love Mooji... I don't see what he says as "right or wrong" its the decisions and questions that I come to myself through inner reflection that counts more than anything he says, he is merely a road to take, I arrive at the destination myself.

Maybe its relevant at this time, maybe not, maybe one day, or never.




For no matter how much I use these symbols, to describe symptoms of my existence.
You are your own emphasis.
So I say nothing.

-Bemore.
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04-05-2013, 06:18 PM
RE: I Can't Even Look Away
Hey Igor!

I see from the link in your sig to your blog that you're still promoting your fraudulent pseudo-gospel.

I can definitely say fraudulent now, because you have all but admitted it here.

Shame on you.

Nonsense is nonsense, but the history of nonsense is a very important science.
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