I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
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01-06-2014, 01:35 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(31-05-2014 12:06 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(31-05-2014 11:51 AM)catgoblin Wrote:  I'm new here, so I'm sorry if this has already been covered, but has anyone read this book?
[Image: 41iOxFVRGtL.jpg]

http://www.amazon.com/Enough-Faith-Athei...4H2JQ2QN36


My dad (a minister) sent this to me and I promised to read it Drinking Beverage

I'm about 1/3 of the way through and am pretty mystified--not sure what to think (not that I'm close to being reconverted to Christianity)

I wasn't familiar with the Cosmological or Kalam Cosmological Argument before I read this book. From my perspective, it seems pretty easy to dismiss this defending the God of the Bible, but what about a deistic God? The best thing I've thought of (so far) is that the assumption that the universe needing a sentient creator is unnecessarily complex, but from a teleological perspective, I don't see that going over very well.

I'm anticipating a pretty lengthy debate with my dad when I finish this, so I'd like to gather all the ammunition I can before then Wink

I read it. I agree with most of what is written within it. It requires blind faith to be an atheist.

or rather let me rephrase that:

in order to be an atheist, one must believe certain things that are simply not rationally defensible.

Strange....I always thought not believing in any gods made me an atheist. Hmmm Consider what do I need to believe to qualify as an atheist?

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Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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01-06-2014, 01:54 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 01:35 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  
(31-05-2014 12:06 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I read it. I agree with most of what is written within it. It requires blind faith to be an atheist.

or rather let me rephrase that:

in order to be an atheist, one must believe certain things that are simply not rationally defensible.

Strange....I always thought not believing in any gods made me an atheist. Hmmm Consider what do I need to believe to qualify as an atheist?

FUCK, yeah.



Jermy, Answer the Fookin' Question.



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01-06-2014, 06:07 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(31-05-2014 11:33 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(31-05-2014 11:31 PM)ThePaleolithicFreethinker Wrote:  Can't go wrong with hispanics. Once I live in japan, nothing but Asians for me. I would be like that black spot in the crowd. Plus I am big. So I would be a big black dot.

If I remember right, there is a considerable proportion of Brazilians in Japan.
Just saying...

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01-06-2014, 06:34 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 01:35 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  
(31-05-2014 12:06 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I read it. I agree with most of what is written within it. It requires blind faith to be an atheist.

or rather let me rephrase that:

in order to be an atheist, one must believe certain things that are simply not rationally defensible.

Strange....I always thought not believing in any gods made me an atheist. Hmmm Consider what do I need to believe to qualify as an atheist?

that the universe either created itself a la Dan Dennett, or it popped into existence without a cause from nothing.

take your pick. neither is rationally defensible.
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01-06-2014, 06:41 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 06:34 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 01:35 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Strange....I always thought not believing in any gods made me an atheist. Hmmm Consider what do I need to believe to qualify as an atheist?

that the universe either created itself a la Dan Dennett, or it popped into existence without a cause from nothing.

take your pick. neither is rationally defensible.

Or what's behind Door #3: "I don't know how the universe began." Vwah-lah! Atheist.

We have enough youth. How about looking for the Fountain of Smart?
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01-06-2014, 06:57 AM (This post was last modified: 01-06-2014 07:02 AM by Losty.)
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 06:34 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 01:35 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Strange....I always thought not believing in any gods made me an atheist. Hmmm Consider what do I need to believe to qualify as an atheist?

that the universe either created itself a la Dan Dennett, or it popped into existence without a cause from nothing.

take your pick. neither is rationally defensible.

Why do I have I believe that to be an atheist? If I believe the universe was created by unicorns because they both start with uni, then couldn't I still be an atheist?



I don't think being an atheist has anything to do with what you believe about the universe. Being an atheist means you do not believe in any gods. I could believe that I am the only thing that exists and there is no universe except in my imagination, and I'd still be an atheist.

I can choose to believe or not believe in anything accept for gods and still be an atheist. Atheism does not require a belief in anything. It's just a lack of belief in gods. That's all it is.

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Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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01-06-2014, 07:02 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 06:57 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 06:34 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  that the universe either created itself a la Dan Dennett, or it popped into existence without a cause from nothing.

take your pick. neither is rationally defensible.

Why do I have I believe that to be an atheist? If I believe the universe was created by unicorns because they both start with uni, then couldn't I still be an atheist?

you can believe that too. it is just not rationally defensible. heck, you can believe your big toe created the universe if you want to, its just not rationally defensible thats all.
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01-06-2014, 07:04 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 07:02 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 06:57 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Why do I have I believe that to be an atheist? If I believe the universe was created by unicorns because they both start with uni, then couldn't I still be an atheist?

you can believe that too. it is just not rationally defensible. heck, you can believe your big toe created the universe if you want to, its just not rationally defensible thats all.

The only rational explanation for the universe is, I don't know. I think anyone who pretends to know, without a doubt, how the universe was created is a moron.

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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01-06-2014, 07:04 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 06:41 AM)Thinkerbelle Wrote:  
(01-06-2014 06:34 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  that the universe either created itself a la Dan Dennett, or it popped into existence without a cause from nothing.

take your pick. neither is rationally defensible.

Or what's behind Door #3: "I don't know how the universe began." Vwah-lah! Atheist.

if you choose option #3 you deny yourself the opportunity to say God did not cause the universe to exist because if you do not know how it began, you do not know that God did not create it.

vwah-lah
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01-06-2014, 07:05 AM
RE: I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist
(01-06-2014 06:34 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  that the universe either created itself a la Dan Dennett, or it popped into existence without a cause from nothing.

take your pick. neither is rationally defensible.

It is rationally defensible to base hypotheses on available evidence and to then test whether or not they are correct as part of the scientific method.

It is not rationally defensible to argue from ignorance which is what you are doing.
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