I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
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02-11-2010, 07:44 AM (This post was last modified: 02-11-2010 07:53 AM by TheSixthGlass.)
I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
We have lots of mid-term elections here in the U.S. today. I won't be voting, and I thought I'd share my reasons with you all here, instead of starting up some crap on facebook. Smile

Number one, I have experienced a big paradigm shift in the last two years. I no longer believe in a god of any kind. I no longer believe in ghosts or spirits. I love science instead of distrusting it. There's lots of other statements I could make here, but I think you get the idea.

Now, where this comes into play in politics - I was a semi-right winger. I considered myself more of a Libertarian, but I listened to (and agreed with) quite a bit of right-wing talk radio. And while I was probably more socially liberal than your average Republican, I have gotten much more socially liberal in the last two years. And you might recognize that as a vague statement, which it is. Which brings me to my next reason.

Number two, I'm completely uninformed. I hate to say it, but my interest in politics has really gone downhill since the presidential election. We have a gubernatorial race here, but I'm not even sure what other races I'd be voting in, let alone who I'd actually vote for. I'm not even sure where I stand politically, because now I want to know the ins and outs of each candidate and each issue on an individual basis before making any sort of decision. I think I'll get back into politics sooner or later, because it does interest me, but right now I just don't care. And I don't believe in this "if you don't vote, you can't complain" stuff, that's just silly. The fact is I would much rather be a non-voter than an uninformed voter. Even if the majority of those voting today are uninformed voters.

What are your thoughts? Will you be voting today? Why or why not?

edit: And also to clarify: I didn't start this thread to try to persuade anyone to vote or not vote. I just thought this might be an interesting discussion.

Our brains deceive us on a regular basis, so we have to find ways to fight back.
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02-11-2010, 12:30 PM
 
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
I won't be voting today because I am not old enough to, but even if I was, I wouldn't.

I will not be voting because I refuse to participate in a fundamentally flawed process, at least at the state and national level. When you vote, you basically have a choice between two parties- the Democratic candidate and the Republican candidate. Any independent thoughts/ideas are suppressed by the institution simply because they lack adequate funding. Politics basically comes down to money- who has it and who doesn't. Those who have money may invest in ridiculously stupid campaign advertising which basically amounts to pure bullshit and propaganda. The American people, being as stupid as they are, will then believe this advertising and make informed decisions based upon it. The more money you can pump into filling airwaves with your factually incorrect bullshit, the higher your poll numbers.

And it isn't just the candidates with the money. Since the Citizens United decisions by the Supreme Court, corporations are able to put unlimited amounts of money into campaign advertising. Thus, since they have the deepest pockets out of anyone, they can and will dominate the shouting contest and thus make all other conform to their will or risk being attacked.

Then there is the media, which....well, it is the media (sorry don't have time to articulate).

Once in office, this demagogue who stands with American families and American voters will then proceed to suck the cock of special interest groups who help fund his next re-election. To even have a voice in the legislation that is passed in Washington, one must have money to legally bribe these people. Either way, Democrat or Republican, you are going to get a candidate who who either has no ideas, bad ideas, or ideas supplied to him by his real constituents- moneyed interests. Obviously there are local exceptions, but they are incapable of changing a deeply entrenched system.

And finally, no candidate out there in my area is nearly liberal enough to satisfy my ideals, so I refuse to choose the lesser evil.

I'll just leave you with Carlin who may explain it better than anyone-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIraCchPDhk
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02-11-2010, 12:46 PM
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
Quote:"if you don't vote, you can't complain"
''Sometimes one just has to choose between a giant douche and a turd sandwich'', and the vote goes to the least worse. But of course one has to have the right to complain about bad decisions, no matter if the one voted or not; it doesn't change the badness of decisions. And how could one vote if the one hasn't gotten into the candidates? Just randomly pick someone and later find out that s/he's a commie or somethingä?

Me? I would vote in every election I care about (if I'd have to choose the least worst, I'd rather not), but I'm still 2 years too young. It was proposed that the voting age in Finland should be lowered, but I would not give a right to vote to people of my age. Most of us are too young and stupid.
But I could vote in the church elections 15.10.2010, since I'm still a member of the evangelic Lutheran church of Finland, although I never joined it.Smile I would vote for anyone who would give a right for gays to get married, but I'm not sure if I'd feel good about taking part in the voting, 'cause I'm not a Christian. And the ''sex neutral marriage law'' is pretty surely going to be accepted by the parlament, so maybe I'd rather let the Christians decide if they want church marriage for gays or not.

Correct me when I'm wrong.
Accept me or go to hell.
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02-11-2010, 12:52 PM
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
I live in Ohio, and I voted today. We had libertarians, Constitutionalists, republicans and democrats on the ballot in several races. A few court races were between two justices with neither having a party affiliation. There were also ballot slots for write-in candidates. Also there were levies and sometimes (not today) we vote on issues such as gay marriage and drinking ages.

Party control dictates such things as redistricting, funding, etc. If you don't vote because you don't think you are getting the message, well, there are sites we can go to that tell us the various candidates and their platforms. Also there are public forums sponsored by such groups as the league of women's voters and the chamber of commerce.

The system's fine. The problem is voter apathy. Get involved. Facilitate change. Quit bitching.
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02-11-2010, 01:15 PM
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
Quote:When you vote, you basically have a choice between two parties- the Democratic candidate and the Republican candidate.
I'm sure you have more parties than 2, isn't the US a democracy or do I have a wrong definition of 'democracy'? I can't believe how such a big group of people could survive with just 2 parties.
Quote:Politics basically comes down to money- who has it and who doesn't.
In the US, campaings are completely funded with money from private sources? So the smaller the party is, the less it gets money, which means less visibility.
Here parties get campaing money from the state, but not equally; the bigger the party is, the more money it gets. But that's gonna change soon.
Another unequality of parties in Finland I want to share: the bigger the party is, the easier it is to get to the parlament. For example: a candidate from Vihreät, the green party, got over 8000 votes, but didn't get to the parlament. Meanwhile, a candidate of Kokoomus could get to the parlament with under 2000 votes.
The system goes something like this: All the votes of a party are summed and the more votes the party has, the more parlament places it will get (the percentage of votes determine how many parlament places the party gets. If it gets, for example, 10% of the votes, and there are 100 parlament places, the ten candidates of the party who got the most votes will get a parlament place.

Correct me when I'm wrong.
Accept me or go to hell.
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02-11-2010, 02:40 PM
 
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
There are more than 2 parties, but none of them have any chance. Campaigns are funded completely by private institutions in the US. Things would be much better if campaigns were publicly financed, but it simply won't happen.
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02-11-2010, 05:00 PM
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
I voted. I always try to learn what I can about the candidates but this time I was not quite as informed as I like to be. Still, I did the best I could and voted.

I disagree with the reasons for not voting. The reason we have a two party system that controls pretty much everything is because we allow it. Third parties can run and independent candidates do win. Not all the time, but they do. I'm a big believer in the philosophy of you're either part of the solution or you're part of the problem.

Aside from that, voting is a privilege that a lot of people and fought, and died, to grant and to preserve. I don't buy this crap about how the terrorists "hate us for our freedoms" but I do believe that part of what creates these types of people is dictatorial regimes that do grant a right to vote and self determination to its citizens.

So, I vote.

Shackle their minds when they're bent on the cross
When ignorance reigns, life is lost
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02-11-2010, 11:51 PM
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
(02-11-2010 02:40 PM)TruthAddict Wrote:  There are more than 2 parties, but none of them have any chance. Campaigns are funded completely by private institutions in the US. Things would be much better if campaigns were publicly financed, but it simply won't happen.

Ralph Nader has called the U.S. a two party dictatorship. I see his point, but I also know that two parties are hundreds of times better than one. Canada has three basic parties, not including the small and the independent parties that don't have a chance. I think that three parties is not enough to have a true democracy. I also see private sector money as an unfair power bids by rich companies. Maybe if these big companies had to pay a tax for campaign funding which would be spread equally to all parties and that any monies for parties was made completely illegal, then things could be a bit better.
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03-11-2010, 06:48 AM
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
Ralph Nader is responsible for the Gore/Bush debacle, so who gives a rat's ass what he says.

The only way a "true democracy" as you describe it could work is if we had a primary election, an intermediary election and then a general election. We'd need an intermediary election to weed out the chaff. Otherwise, in the general election we'd choose representatives and leaders based on who has support from the biggest minority.
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03-11-2010, 08:51 AM
 
RE: I Won't Be Voting Today. Will You?
Well first of all without getting wordy, or preachy I'm saddend by anyone who chooses not to vote for whatever reason. Sure the system is broken, and sure most polititians are douchebags, but you are given a very precious thing in your right to vote you really should exercise it! Fight the power with your last breath, but deciding not to vote makes not point whatsoever IMHO.

Secondly the two party system is not the problem. MONEY is the problem. The money that these campaigns cost is astronomical, and the PARTY controls most of the money. In reality you should be a Dem or Rep in ideology but have your own opinions that may veer one way or the other from core party beliefs. However with the money situation being as it is it's party line or die! Thus we have these other parties popping up that are only slightly disimilar to the main two parties. Fix money and the two party system is much more managable.
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