I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
11-01-2015, 08:30 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:22 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(10-01-2015 09:47 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  Challenge my beliefs.
This is a bit of an oxymoron isn't it?
How can I possibly challenge your beliefs when you have closed your mind to the alternatives?

To have a belief one must recognise that there are plausible alternatives otherwise one wouldn't be touting their position as one from belief.
The believer must have chosen, presumably using faith (a.k.a. optimistic wishful thinking), their favourite option and decided to close their mind to the plausible alternatives.

Belief = close mindedness.



You are the only person that can "challenge" your own beliefs. To do so you would need to open your mind and investigate the alternatives. It would be a process of discovery. We live in the Information age. The internet is at your finger tips, all you need is an open mind, some enthusiasm for information and discovery, and some diligence to evaluate the strengths of each position whilst trying to avoid your own presuppositions, conditioning and propensity towards confirmation bias.

I do empathise with you. I know it can be an extremely difficult task to look beyond one's own beliefs, especially long established ones. No doubt you have been looking at the world through your conditioned eyes for many, many years. It is hard to quantify how difficult a task it is to break those shackles, generally it takes people years of fluctuating doubts to break out of it.
Anyway, good luck on your future journey.

My belief is simply stated in the Upanishad Mundaka.

Bright but hidden, the Self dwells in the Heart,
Everything that moves, breathes, opens and closes
Lives in the Self. He is the source of love
And may be known through love but not through thought.

Love brings knowledge of the truth. What alternative is better than love, recognizing the self in all beings?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 08:30 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 02:37 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 02:09 PM)Atothetheist Wrote:  [quote='AlephBet' pid='717569' dateline='1420948060']

What relation do the symmetry properties of a physical system have to the conservation laws characterizing that system? How does this apply to the asymmetry of your responses?

If you can answer, then use the law of inverse squares to go back to my answers. Perhaps your focus if a bit off.

Is it my inability to focus, or your inability to explain in a clear and transparent way?

[Image: 0013382F-E507-48AE-906B-53008666631C-757...cc3639.jpg]
Credit goes to UndercoverAtheist.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 08:32 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:23 PM)Free Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 08:12 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  Yes. It's all anyone needs. We were never at fault to begin with. Naked in and naked out. Translated by the experience.

Are you familiar with the the hart as the young stag in Hebrew / German / Latin? It is the heart in German, or Hertzcor. In latin, the cor is the heart. In Hebrew the Cor is the basket of grain gathered from the harvest. The young stag (hart) must be filled. Wisdom makes the child a Son after the Guardian raises the young mind by learning the harvest.

Beyond Genesis 2:3, we taken knowledge. What we don't realize is that it is freely given, but not without wisdom from the journey. All of it is for a purpose. Would you agree?

I do not know why anything more is needed beyond Gen 2:3 in the Torah. The rest is like one big exercise in training people to be humanists. Everything you have learned, and everything else only says one single thing.

"Have love for one another."

Let me show you Jesus.

Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the Law?
Mat 22:37 Jesus said to him, You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets

Everything you have spent your entire life learning is brought to one tenant:

"Have love for one another."

If you can do that you do not need anything else. All the messages are for the people, to serve the people, to teach the people one thing only.

But barbaric as they were, to them this simple concept was utterly ridiculous.

Yes. Good words. Have you read the Upanishads?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 08:37 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:32 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 08:23 PM)Free Wrote:  I do not know why anything more is needed beyond Gen 2:3 in the Torah. The rest is like one big exercise in training people to be humanists. Everything you have learned, and everything else only says one single thing.

"Have love for one another."

Let me show you Jesus.

Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the Law?
Mat 22:37 Jesus said to him, You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets

Everything you have spent your entire life learning is brought to one tenant:

"Have love for one another."

If you can do that you do not need anything else. All the messages are for the people, to serve the people, to teach the people one thing only.

But barbaric as they were, to them this simple concept was utterly ridiculous.

Yes. Good words. Have you read the Upanishads?

They are the only words anyone needs, and need to put in practice.

Regarding self from Upanishads ...

Do you understand that selfishness is human and not evil? It is unavoidable, so may as well embrace it. Everything we do is, indeed, a selfish act.

This stems from preservation of self. This is why we are selfish, because it is the one thing that must survive; self.

Loving others is a selfish act, so therefore, how can selfishness be evil?

It is not.

Evil does not exist. Only error.

Having problems with your computer? Visit our Free Tech Support thread for help!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 08:39 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:26 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  A coupla things, stronghouse. How you would reconcile the fact that the oldest accounting of the "number of the beast" gives the digits 616? And what seems apparent to me that Paul's baptism of spirit more closely aligns with the Priestly preparations to enter the Holy of Holies, rather than some nebulous reincarnation mysticism?

Initiation into the Mysteries is what you are referring to. That process is outlined in the Gita, Upanishads and practiced by the prophets.

Ezekiel 37

37 The hand of the Lord was on me, and he brought me out by the Spirit of the Lord and set me in the middle of a valley; it was full of bones. 2 He led me back and forth among them, and I saw a great many bones on the floor of the valley, bones that were very dry. 3 He asked me, “Son of man, can these bones live?”

The same Lord here is the same Lord of the Self in the Eastern texts. Meditation is the entry gate of both the thief and Shepherd gathering the Sheep.

John 10

"Very truly I tell you Pharisees, anyone who does not enter the sheep pen by the gate, but climbs in by some other way, is a thief and a robber. Taking or giving. The will determines the way in and out.

The dry bones outlined by Ezekiel is the process of baptism, or rebirth. You must be born again. Until a person reaches self-realization, they are bound in knowledge and not wisdom from love.

Those who reject the truth are bound to repeat it. Volution is revolving around a center. The Earth does this, the sun, the moon and the galaxies are all in this process of repeated cycles. All of it put in place to refine the mind of living creatures. E means out of. Evolution is the process to reap the whirlwind, then rise above it.

I am here trying to show those in the whirlwind how to emerge. Ears must open. Seeds are planted. Soil simply needs to be prepared.

A gardener suffers the hoe. By this, I am refined. I need to be challenged to rise. All of us do.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 08:45 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:30 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  Love brings knowledge of the truth. What alternative is better than love, recognizing the self in all beings?
Science brings us closer to revealing the mysteries of the universe but does not make for heart felt poetry.

Love (in search of, pining for lost love, desires of lust, the excitement of passion...) provides great inspiration for poetic art, in an attempt to touch the human soul.

Is there any belief in particular that you want to challenge yourself with?
Perhaps you want to explore why women are so mysterious? Perhaps why we desire them so? Perhaps why there is a special lady you can't seem to stop thinking about Heart

Anyways, if you have some artistic talents, perhaps you can entertain us
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 08:52 PM (This post was last modified: 11-01-2015 08:56 PM by AlephBet.)
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:37 PM)Free Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 08:32 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  Yes. Good words. Have you read the Upanishads?

They are the only words anyone needs, and need to put in practice.

Regarding self from Upanishads ...

Do you understand that selfishness is human and not evil? It is unavoidable, so may as well embrace it. Everything we do is, indeed, a selfish act.

This stems from preservation of self. This is why we are selfish, because it is the one thing that must survive; self.

Loving others is a selfish act, so therefore, how can selfishness be evil?

It is not.

Evil does not exist. Only error.

There is a higher good in suffering. You note selfishness as a necessity. All things in creation are necessity, but the highest good is found in a simple symbol I have developed over the years.

R ------------- > S -------------------> R
Reward Suffering Reward

In the middle, we have unavoidable suffering. Take a reward on the left and suffer as a result. This is the will of the thief. Smoke and you get sick. On the other side, you have suffering on purpose leading to reward. Go to the gum and gain health. You must work for it.

As you note, motivation is possibly selfish. Like all duality, there are always two sides to each truth. Hate / Love. Fear / Courage. In this case, suffering has two sides. One is founded on the will to take. The other is founded on the will to give.

In the Upanishads, the self is in all beings, including yourself. By suffering on purpose, you give to the self. Regardless of which self (even your own), you are giving. When you work a job, you give to yourself, but the family also receives. When you smoke, you are taking from your own health, but all family members suffer the lost income, lifespan and overall well being.

Our choices affect others. The one law has two orthogonal sides. Just as 4D time has past and future hidden from our view, so truths such as selfishness have twos sides. I think this is what you are saying. The Dhammapada outlines collapsing wave function related to how we build our world by choices.

Dhammapada

Chapter 1 - Choices

We are what we think.
All that we are arises with our thoughts.
With our thoughts we make the world.
Speak or act with an impure mind
And trouble will follow you
As the wheel follows the ox that draws the cart.
We are what we think.
All that we are arises with our thoughts.
With our thoughts we make the world.
Speak or act with a pure mind
And happiness will follow you
As your shadow, unshakable.
"Look how he abused me and hurt me,
How he threw me down and robbed me."
Live with such thoughts and you live in hate.
"Look how he abused me and hurt me,
How he threw me down and robbed me."
Abandon such thoughts, and live in love.
In this world
Hate never yet dispelled hate.
Only love dispels hate.
This is the law,
Ancient and inexhaustible.

The law is Ancient and inexhaustible for one reason. Giving develops surplus. Taking leaves debt. Note the tables flipped for our moneychangers and the peacemakers having no rest.

When Jesus entered the temple, he overturned the tables of the moneychangers and the benches for those selling doves (peace). No rest for them as our money temple crumbles. This was a prophecy.

Based on the above information, debt is the key to the thief as a marker. Again, we can't know this until we read the symbols of all scripture. The Bible holds keys to showing the mind truth from our own history / prophecy. Our mind sees it coming as the Lord drawing the future into the past.

There is a selfishness to avoid. The present debt we see from our own nation is the result of selfish policy based on Carbon (666). The petrol dollar is the mechanism for commerce based on the beast of Carbon (mark of mankind).
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 09:00 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:52 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  There is a selfishness to avoid.

All obsessive selfishness is to be avoided. It creates addiction to desire. Balance is the key here.

One can give too much love to one at the expense and suffering of the many. Selfish love can be damaging.

Point is in knowing self. When one knows ones own self, don't need a mirror.

Having problems with your computer? Visit our Free Tech Support thread for help!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 09:01 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:05 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 06:40 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Server not found AlphabetSoup. Your link in bogus.
"Oldest alphabet found in Egypt. It's Hebrew: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/521235.stm There are many other references. We could debate this in another thread perhaps. "
Not even close : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lan...n_accounts

Opens for me. Try it again.

Does now, but most certainly yet another lie. It's not Hebrew.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
11-01-2015, 09:04 PM
RE: I am Believer - Challenge My Beliefs
(11-01-2015 08:45 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(11-01-2015 08:30 PM)AlephBet Wrote:  Love brings knowledge of the truth. What alternative is better than love, recognizing the self in all beings?
Science brings us closer to revealing the mysteries of the universe but does not make for heart felt poetry.

Love (in search of, pining for lost love, desires of lust, the excitement of passion...) provides great inspiration for poetic art, in an attempt to touch the human soul.

Is there any belief in particular that you want to challenge yourself with?
Perhaps you want to explore why women are so mysterious? Perhaps why we desire them so? Perhaps why there is a special lady you can't seem to stop thinking about Heart

Anyways, if you have some artistic talents, perhaps you can entertain us

Yoga for the mind. Stepping on over to the other side. That's about it.

As for entertainment and artistic talent, you wouldn't believe me if I told you. It's amazing what a self-realized mind accomplishes for a believer. Truth is the only gift that keeps on giving in this manner. I am blessed to be blessed.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: