I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
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16-10-2014, 05:34 PM
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
Of course he didn't create a sock during that two weeks he knew he was coming back in 2 weeks and didn't want to be banned.
Once he was actually banned the punishment of being banned for creating a sock no longer applied.

duh..

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16-10-2014, 05:46 PM
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
(16-10-2014 04:16 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(16-10-2014 04:07 PM)Anjele Wrote:  Clown boy's posts are so altered from the original that I don't see what good they are. The remedy of delete, edit, and clean up makes it hard to show what kind of things he really said on this forum.
...

Exactly, that makes the undertaking so much harder.

(16-10-2014 04:07 PM)Anjele Wrote:  ...
At this point, we can go back and forth forever. The team is going to stand up for the team. The members want answers and remedies for the future. That's not going to happen until and if Dark responds. At that point we can proceed with some sort of plan. Till then everyone is just pissing in the wind.

Agreed.

Although that does not mean that we can't all have a think about what could be done / should be done to make TTA the best it can be.

I think it needs to be a collaborative effort. All suggestions welcomed.

I'm wondering whether it would be valuable to post Seth's guidance in a separate thread and ask for everyone's opinion on how the principles / vision / goals can be achieved in the medium to long term.

What do you think?

I think everyone knowing what Seth has to say is information that must be shared with the whole forum.

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16-10-2014, 05:47 PM
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
(16-10-2014 04:01 PM)FSM_scot Wrote:  
(16-10-2014 01:29 PM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  Why isnt Stark a good fit now? I love Stark. If DLJ wasnt kidding...and doesn't want it.....can we have Stark (&chas)
?????????

I like stark. I even enjoyed moderating when he was admin. But his style of sit back and it will all be fine only works when a forum is small enough that it doesn't attract toxic members.

Every ft since has been trying to emulate that style. It does have its good points like allowing for unpopular opinions, but it does nothing to help when a situation like the one that happened to Losty, where the stalking extended to affecting her life outside of the forum. It took the actions of the admins on another forum to finally put a stop to something which should have been remedied here, but nothing was done. And that is very disturbing.

Well said.
(Sorry i missed your response till right now)

Thanks!

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16-10-2014, 05:48 PM
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
(16-10-2014 04:07 PM)Anjele Wrote:  
(16-10-2014 03:57 PM)DLJ Wrote:  It's not too late. But it's a seriously huge undertaking.

To get to the truth, side-step any potential re-writing of history and sift perceptions from reality, it would involve Deep (who is supposed to be relaxing, buried under pretty girls (or boys (or boy-girls)) in Thailand) creating a report of all posts (visible on the forum and those too in the 'management only' section) all related PMs (there are privacy issues there) and the Rep lists... with time-stamps and stuff.

Also collecting evidence from skype conversations (verbal and written) and for all I know, phone calls too and also interviewing all involved.

You can see the problems, right?

We certainly need to find a way to deal with this situation if (more likely when) it happens again but right now, we're simply not sufficiently resourced to be able to do it.

Another question of course, is whether, in this kind of situation, a ban is actually the solution. People have been saying that he was not banned quickly enough and that he should not have been allowed to join in the first place but a stalker does not need to be a member of the forum to be able to read what we write. So there are wider issues to consider than just how the forum team reacted.

So what I think I'm asking for, is to allow Dark some space to first finish his off-forum duties and when he comes back, give him the chance to think things though getting advice from all/any as necessary and then put forward a proposal of how to handle this... not a quick fix but a longer term solution.

It could well involve major changes. The philosopher king / benign dictator model worked for Stark but as he himself pointed out when he stepped down it wouldn't work now. A 'congress' model, perhaps having something like a school governing body has been suggested and there might be other alternatives. Who knows?

We have some guidance from Seth, we have limited resources (all volunteers), we have growing numbers and we have to work out a way (a governance model) that can balance the realistion of benefits vs. risks vs. resource constraints for all stakeholders for now and in the future.

Discussions are happening but things won't happen overnight.

Meanwhile, everyone, let's be careful out there.

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Clown boy's posts are so altered from the original that I don't see what good they are. The remedy of delete, edit, and clean up makes it hard to show what kind of things he really said on this forum.

At this point, we can go back and forth forever. The team is going to stand up for the team. The members want answers and remedies for the future. That's not going to happen until and if Dark responds. At that point we can proceed with some sort of plan. Till then everyone is just pissing in the wind.


But.....
Clearly i like pissing in the wind.


Heehee

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16-10-2014, 05:48 PM
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
(16-10-2014 05:20 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Actually it was one week (I was on vacation through most of it) and no, he didn't make a sock during that time he was temp banned. Smile

That you know of. I've lost count of the amount of times I saw someone sock puppet only to be caught the one day they forgot which proxy they were using.

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16-10-2014, 05:56 PM (This post was last modified: 16-10-2014 06:12 PM by Momsurroundedbyboys.)
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
(16-10-2014 05:31 PM)Hughsie Wrote:  
(16-10-2014 05:20 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Actually it was one week (I was on vacation through most of it) and no, he didn't make a sock during that time he was temp banned. Smile

Sorry, but it was 2 weeks. I set it myself. Big Grin

I'm sorry...I got that one totally wrong...
I blame vacation. Smile It was a week of "my time" and a week where I didn't care -- cause I was on vacation. Dodgy

But I did visit while I was gone. Smile


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And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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16-10-2014, 08:22 PM
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
I see no problem talking all this through myself

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17-10-2014, 06:33 AM
Just an opinion
I might be a little bit late to the party in this thread but I'm coming down hard on the side of LostandInsecure. There is a lot that could be said about the handling of the whole WC situation, and much of it has been so I'll skip over that and just add what I wanna add.

Atheists are one of the most wrongfully mistrusted, vilified, and discriminated groups of people in North America if not the world at large. Most of us have been through some damn negative reactions to our atheism, either through discrimination in the work place, relationships, or communities. And that's the easy stuff. People are killed on a regular basis in some countries for this view. So my question is this:
If an atheist can't feel safe coming to an atheist forum then what the fuck do we as the TTA forum even have to offer atheists? To be the fucking McDonald's of atheist forums where we take all the garbage, we know to be garbage, once they make it here on the world tour of bannings? Why are we viewing animals like WickedClown in a vacuum?

Why should any member in good standing, with fantastic rep, who has been here for months and months have to leave the damn forum so they can feel comfortable and safe? And for what? So that a broken animal in a mental institution, with a lifelong history of mental problems, and a clear track record of disturbing, disruptive, and violent behavior, who has been banned from multiple atheist forms for specifically targeting atheist for trolling and abuse can have access to another community to disrupt? This is fucking stupid.
I'm all for giving a guy a chance...but WC's train of abuses is long and spans not just multiple forums but the real world too. I can even tolerate giving a guy like WC a chance to reform and display it here on the forum but NOT at the expense of other people which is, intentional or not, what happened here.

Inviting a known career thief into your vault unsupervised is not a matter of equality, redemption, or equal treatment under the law it is nothing more then godsdamned stupid. The fact he was allowed to continue to stuff his pockets is beyond stupid as to be motherfucking self destructive. There are billions of people in the fucking world we can afford to slam the door in the face of people like WC especially for the sake of the safety, security, and peace of mind of fellow forum members in good standing.

There are people still on this forum, today, who are in violation of multiple rules and have been for weeks or more. We need more active moderation in my opinion.

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17-10-2014, 07:03 AM
Stupid title is too long for some reason, I don't understand technology
WhiskeyDebates Wrote:I might be a little bit late to the party in this thread but I'm coming down hard on the side of LostandInsecure.

Be gentle with me please Blush


On a serious note, thank you for speaking up, it means a lot to me

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Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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17-10-2014, 07:14 AM
RE: I am only slightly appalled that the admins have said nothing still, I'm done waiting
(17-10-2014 06:33 AM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  I might be a little bit late to the party in this thread but I'm coming down hard on the side of LostandInsecure. There is a lot that could be said about the handling of the whole WC situation, and much of it has been so I'll skip over that and just add what I wanna add.

Atheists are one of the most wrongfully mistrusted, vilified, and discriminated groups of people in North America if not the world at large. Most of us have been through some damn negative reactions to our atheism, either through discrimination in the work place, relationships, or communities. And that's the easy stuff. People are killed on a regular basis in some countries for this view. So my question is this:
If an atheist can't feel safe coming to an atheist forum then what the fuck do we as the TTA forum even have to offer atheists? To be the fucking McDonald's of atheist forums where we take all the garbage, we know to be garbage, once they make it here on the world tour of bannings? Why are we viewing animals like WickedClown in a vacuum?

Why should any member in good standing, with fantastic rep, who has been here for months and months have to leave the damn forum so they can feel comfortable and safe? And for what? So that a broken animal in a mental institution, with a lifelong history of mental problems, and a clear track record of disturbing, disruptive, and violent behavior, who has been banned from multiple atheist forms for specifically targeting atheist for trolling and abuse can have access to another community to disrupt? This is fucking stupid.
I'm all for giving a guy a chance...but WC's train of abuses is long and spans not just multiple forums but the real world too. I can even tolerate giving a guy like WC a chance to reform and display it here on the forum but NOT at the expense of other people which is, intentional or not, what happened here.

Inviting a known career thief into your vault unsupervised is not a matter of equality, redemption, or equal treatment under the law it is nothing more then godsdamned stupid. The fact he was allowed to continue to stuff his pockets is beyond stupid as to be motherfucking self destructive. There are billions of people in the fucking world we can afford to slam the door in the face of people like WC especially for the sake of the safety, security, and peace of mind of fellow forum members in good standing.

There are people still on this forum, today, who are in violation of multiple rules and have been for weeks or more. We need more active moderation in my opinion.

Well said. Thumbsup

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