I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
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21-09-2017, 06:34 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
(21-09-2017 06:27 PM)Gwaithmir Wrote:  > We already have a superior morality based upon experience and reason. To wit:

THE HUMANIST TEN COMMANDMENTS

1) Thou shalt strive to promote the greater good of humanity before all selfish desires.

2) Thou shalt be curious, for asking questions is the only way to find answers.

3) Harm to your fellow human is harm to humanity. Therefore, thou shalt not kill, rape, rob, or otherwise victimize anyone.

4) Thou shall treat all humans as equals, regardless of race, gender, age, creed, identity, orientation, physical ability, or status.

5) Thou shalt use reason as your guide. Science, knowledge, observation, and rational analysis are the best ways to determine any course of action.

6) Thou shalt not force your beliefs onto others, nor insist that yours be the only and correct way to live happily.

7) If thou dost govern, thou shalt govern with reason, not with superstition. Religion should have no place in any government which represents all people and beliefs.

8) Thou shalt act for the betterment of your fellow humans, and be, whenever possible, altruistic in your deeds.

9) Thou shalt be good to the Earth and its bounties, for without it, humankind is lost.

10) Thou shalt impart thy knowledge and wisdom gained in your lifetime to the next generation, so that with each passing century, humanity will grow wiser and more humane.
Consider

Yes, that! Much better.

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21-09-2017, 06:45 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
(21-09-2017 04:09 PM)wendigo Wrote:  Yes, I said it. The moral compass as made famous by the Holy Bible aligns (almost) perfectly with my gut feeling on right and wrong, biology, etc. I feel that to deny the obvious core ideas at the heart of the bible is folly, not because a God commands it, but because it makes moral, biological/evolutional and physical sense.


Having said that, I was raised atheist, and think that the idea of a "God" writing a scripture for human beings to follow overflows all borders on the ridiculous. How to reconcile this with modern ideas on political correctness?
Particular groups often cherry pick parts of the Bible to produce a coherent moral code that is admirable, but they do that by imposing filters and interpretive systems; there's no way for anyone to take the entire Bible as written and do what you're suggesting. As others have pointed out, in certain areas the Bible leads from behind, morally speaking.

I submit to you that generally accepted societal morality can't be ignored in any big way or you'd start running afoul of various laws and social taboos and standards of social reciprocity, etc. That's why generally the claimed moral systems of religions aren't very different from their host societies. I suggest to you that holy books end up being interpreted in ways that meet or exceed the morality that already exists, they are not a source of morality but a reflection of it.
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21-09-2017, 06:58 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
(21-09-2017 04:14 PM)wendigo Wrote:  
(21-09-2017 04:12 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  I totally agree. Kill your disobedient children and marry the women you rape. Thumbsup

Core ideas, that is the Sunday School roster. I get your immediate aversion to anything that might be written in the bible, but I don't think all atheists reject all that is good (in a biblical sense) simply to be contrary to what they perceive as an opposing viewpoint. For example, I oppose a lot of the lifestyles and attitudes that are typically attributed to atheists because they make no sense in the long run, evolution-wise, and are destructive to families and well-being. Like the media's crap-spewing conformism in all it's forms

What "lifestyles" and attributed by whom?

And we don't reject all that is "good" because it's in the bible, we reject that the bible has anything to do with what is "good" being "good". If you need a goddamn book to tell you not to kill somone, you're a fucking psycho.
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21-09-2017, 07:39 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
The bible does have some good ideas like don't murder and don't steal, but it's not like these were gems of wisdom no one had ever conceived of before Yahweh carved them into stone. The bible is just a barnacle on the hull of the good ship Basically Decent Cooperative Behavior; people were already aware of it though they didn't understand the source, but the bible acts like it's the captain and ship-builder. And then it throws in a bunch of manipulative bullshit and phony authority that has blinded and slowed down western civilization for centuries.

Anyhoo, welcome to the forum.

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21-09-2017, 07:42 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
I absolutely disagree.

There are lots of ethical systems based on the knowledge gained from millennia of people rubbing up against one another. Most come down to some variation of the golden rule. Other people are people like you.

The bible's ethics aren't better than others and are often worse. The biblical god is a murderous, emotional, tribal-big-man asshole.
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21-09-2017, 07:43 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
(21-09-2017 06:27 PM)Gwaithmir Wrote:  
(21-09-2017 04:09 PM)wendigo Wrote:  Yes, I said it. The moral compass as made famous by the Holy Bible aligns (almost) perfectly with my gut feeling on right and wrong, biology, etc. I feel that to deny the obvious core ideas at the heart of the bible is folly, not because a God commands it, but because it makes moral, biological/evolutional and physical sense.


Having said that, I was raised atheist, and think that the idea of a "God" writing a scripture for human beings to follow overflows all borders on the ridiculous. How to reconcile this with modern ideas on political correctness?

> We already have a superior morality based upon experience and reason. To wit:

THE HUMANIST TEN COMMANDMENTS

1) Thou shalt strive to promote the greater good of humanity before all selfish desires.

2) Thou shalt be curious, for asking questions is the only way to find answers.

3) Harm to your fellow human is harm to humanity. Therefore, thou shalt not kill, rape, rob, or otherwise victimize anyone.

4) Thou shall treat all humans as equals, regardless of race, gender, age, creed, identity, orientation, physical ability, or status.

5) Thou shalt use reason as your guide. Science, knowledge, observation, and rational analysis are the best ways to determine any course of action.

6) Thou shalt not force your beliefs onto others, nor insist that yours be the only and correct way to live happily.

7) If thou dost govern, thou shalt govern with reason, not with superstition. Religion should have no place in any government which represents all people and beliefs.

8) Thou shalt act for the betterment of your fellow humans, and be, whenever possible, altruistic in your deeds.

9) Thou shalt be good to the Earth and its bounties, for without it, humankind is lost.

10) Thou shalt impart thy knowledge and wisdom gained in your lifetime to the next generation, so that with each passing century, humanity will grow wiser and more humane.
Consider

Gotta admit, I read that in Saruman's voice cuz of your icon Tongue

Ignorance is not to be ignored.

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21-09-2017, 08:36 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
(21-09-2017 04:14 PM)wendigo Wrote:  Core ideas, that is the Sunday School roster.

I find it unsurprising that you don't disagree with basic Sunday School morality. Unless you went to a horrible church it's unlikely that they taught the kids anything other than very basic common sense social norms. Unfortunately, that cherry picks the Bible, ignoring vast sections of the NT and almost all of the OT.

Teach your average munchkin about the Midianite genocide or the murder of the first-born of Egypt and you'll get frightened and confused kids and furious parents.

Quote:For example, I oppose a lot of the lifestyles and attitudes that are typically attributed to atheists because...

Getting to know us before being judgemental might help your case.

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21-09-2017, 09:00 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
(21-09-2017 04:09 PM)wendigo Wrote:  Yes, I said it. The moral compass as made famous by the Holy Bible aligns (almost) perfectly with my gut feeling on right and wrong, biology, etc. I feel that to deny the obvious core ideas at the heart of the bible is folly, not because a God commands it, but because it makes moral, biological/evolutional and physical sense.


Having said that, I was raised atheist, and think that the idea of a "God" writing a scripture for human beings to follow overflows all borders on the ridiculous. How to reconcile this with modern ideas on political correctness?

I believe you are a cherry-picking dishonest person that doesn't acknowledge the obvious moral problems with the bible.

What are your thoughts about hell? Or original sin?

Are you just going to try to cherry-pick your way out of those moral biblical failings?

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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21-09-2017, 09:08 PM
I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
Holy Bible? It's just a book of fables about genocidal tyrant obsessed with worship. Nothing holy there.

As for morals others already pointed trouble with this.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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21-09-2017, 09:26 PM
RE: I believe the Bible teaches correct morals (mostly)...
(21-09-2017 04:14 PM)wendigo Wrote:  ...
Core ideas, that is the Sunday School roster.
...

Please help out this ignorant atheist ... what are these core ideas, specifically?

Seriously, I don't know what this means.

Blush

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