I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
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14-03-2012, 02:45 PM
I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
Before meeting KC I didn't really know anything about Calvanism. Since I've thought about it I wonder why any Christian wouldn't be one. Or any theist for that matter, not just Christians. If God is all knowing then he certainly knows your entire life. He knows when you will be born, what school you will go to, what job you will have, and when you will die. Since this is the case then obviously there can be no free will. Without free will there is nothing you can do to ensure your salvation. God knew before you were born whether or not you were going to heaven.

Omnipotence = No Free Will = Calvanism

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

-Mark Twain
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14-03-2012, 02:47 PM
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
Welcome to the club, Tim.

Drinks and cookies are on the table in the corner.

But yeah... for me... it just... made sense. I don't know.

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14-03-2012, 02:52 PM
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
(14-03-2012 02:47 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Welcome to the club, Tim.

Drinks and cookies are on the table in the corner.

But yeah... for me... it just... made sense. I don't know.

I would but that fat guy in your gif landed on the chocolate chip.

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

-Mark Twain
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14-03-2012, 05:38 PM (This post was last modified: 17-03-2012 04:25 PM by Mr Woof.)
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
The Calvinist concept locks god into specific man made criteria.

One need not be 100% Atheist, nor 100% theist/polytheist.....god does'nt seem to be given any say in the matter.

To me the very word 'God' donates a potential growing higher/ lower order entailing an element of our own input; that is to say not completely deterministic.

Religious people have been conned into paying homage to man made ideals of god as some sort of holy arbitrator or, particularly in Calvinism, a cruel and capricious despot.

Oh yes, as for the big Atheist Convention here next month, i certainly wont be paying $400 to kissLord Dawkins ring.
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14-03-2012, 05:44 PM
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
I thought you were gone Mr Woof. I will have to assume that someone has hijacked your nick and is now posting as you. Not sure why but who can say on these matters.

As for Calvanism, I also understand the ideology behind an omnipotent god being always aware of our lives thus eliminating free will.
My only issue with it other than it saying there is a god, has to do with the assumption that god couldn't create a creation that functions outside of itself just for shits and giggles.

It's religious peoples need for boxes that condemns them to their fate. But without he boxes there is no need for religion in the first place.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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14-03-2012, 05:49 PM
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
(14-03-2012 05:44 PM)lucradis Wrote:  I thought you were gone Mr Woof. I will have to assume that someone has hijacked your nick and is now posting as you. Not sure why but who can say on these matters.

As for Calvanism, I also understand the ideology behind an omnipotent god being always aware of our lives thus eliminating free will.
My only issue with it other than it saying there is a god, has to do with the assumption that god couldn't create a creation that functions outside of itself just for shits and giggles.

It's religious peoples need for boxes that condemns them to their fate. But without he boxes there is no need for religion in the first place.
Tis I, Woof, not Woose (Australian for wus); i do worry about hackers though at times.Wink
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14-03-2012, 06:08 PM
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
(14-03-2012 02:45 PM)germanyt Wrote:  Since I've thought about it I wonder why any Christian wouldn't be one.

Omnipotence = No Free Will = Calvanism

I totally agree. When I was a Christian, I was non-denominational (but probably Baptist if I had to label it). But we had no problem with the idea of predestination. Omniscience = Predetermination, and anyone who thinks otherwise is equivocating the word omniscience.

In fact, most of us atheists who don't believe in free will also believe in predestination (not in the destined for heaven or hell sense, but the "future actions are set in stone" sense).

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
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15-03-2012, 09:58 AM
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
The Free Will argument is a pathetic waste of breathe. That breathe could be donated to plants, but instead, a trade must be in place. Stupidity for the trees.

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15-03-2012, 11:08 AM
 
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
(15-03-2012 09:58 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  The Free Will argument is a pathetic waste of breathe.

True, but its a REALLY good RUSH song.............just saying........
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15-03-2012, 11:30 AM
RE: I don't understand Christians who aren't Calvanists.
I wouldn't recognize it when I was a Christian- but now that I am no longer tied to any theology it only makes sense to me that an all-knowing and all-powerful god removes the ability for true free will. It would be an illusion at best.
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