I don't understand.
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12-11-2011, 12:35 PM
RE: I don't understand.
(12-11-2011 11:31 AM)kineo Wrote:  
(12-11-2011 10:54 AM)kim Wrote:  Undecided Maybe people just don't get zeroing out.

Can you please clarify what "zeroing out" is? Sorry I guess I'm just a noob here. Never heard that terminology before.

Sorry -my fault - it's my weird shorthand vocabulary for basics gleaned from Tao Te Ching ~ Lao-tzu. In a nutshell: To be nothing is to be.
Nothing=zero. "I zero out" = I am.
This notion has frequently helped restrain myself from leaping across a room to strangle the random, non-thinking, Theist who's cornered some poor, unsuspecting Agnostic demanding answers. It's also placed me into the position of being truly empathic and compassionate without really giving a shit... at least not about the big picture... which is... ? ... we all die... doesn't concern me. What concerns me is living. For now... until ... nothing. Nothing=zero=I am.

Tao of everything
Act without doing;
work without effort.
Think of the small as large
and the few as many.
Confront the difficult
while it is still easy;
accomplish the great task
by a series of small acts.
The Master never reaches for the great;
thus she achieves greatness.
When she runs into a difficulty,
she stops and gives herself to it.
She doesn’t cling to her own comfort;
thus problems are no problem for her.

Confused I feel like I've muddied it up further... and it's probably way off thread subject. Sorry again -I just need to keep my personal slang in check. Heart

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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12-11-2011, 12:38 PM
RE: I don't understand.
In this thread, off-track is just fine. Good stuff, Kim.

If you pray to anything, you're prey to anything.
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12-11-2011, 12:59 PM
RE: I don't understand.
(12-11-2011 11:43 AM)SecularStudent Wrote:  The thing about the Bible is that it is a book, full of stories written by humans. There are some truths, some fantasies, some poetry, some laws, etc. contained within it. There is really nothing about it that makes it any different from The Epic of Gilgamesh, the Iliad, Metamorphoses, the Dhammapada, the Quran, etc.

Technically, the Bible and the Koran were written by prophets. This means that the phraseology contains hidden structure whereas a prophet can "travel through time" to find alignment with previous prophets.

Which, of course, is pure speculation until I validate the science of simulation. Wink

Besides, seems Kim can operate the tao te ching with my level of profeciency; without being a crazy prophet. Big Grin

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12-11-2011, 01:09 PM
RE: I don't understand.
Blush I must share my Feynman fix - http://youtu.be/QkhBcLk_8f0
This is a short one, but it says so much...
... and he makes me smile. Smile
Heart

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12-11-2011, 01:50 PM
 
RE: I don't understand.
(12-11-2011 01:09 PM)kim Wrote:  must share my Feynman fix
This is a short one, but it says so much...
... and he makes me smile. Smile
Heart

Kim, thanks for the video, I loved it -- but I usually love everything about Feynman.

I have read 2 of his biographies, most of his books and, of course his Lectures on Physics.

Isn't it wonderful how he embraces doubt? (Have you read John Ralston Saul's "The Doubter's Companion"?)

One of my favourites of his books is "The Meaning of it All".

Here is a short excerpt -- Richard Feynman's delightful account of how he would investigate someone’s claim of being a mind reader.

Quote:This fellow comes to me, and he says, "I will demonstrate this to you. We will stand at the roulette wheel and I will tell you ahead of time whether it is going to be black or red on every shot."

So from other experience and general knowledge, I have a strong prejudice against mind readers. Million to one.

Now we begin. The mind reader says it's going to be black. It's black. The mind reader says it's going to be red. It's red. Do I believe in mind readers? No. It could happen. The mind reader says it's going to be black. It's black. The mind reader says it's going to be red. It's red. Sweat. I'm about to learn something. This continues, let us suppose, for ten times. Now it's possible by chance that that happened ten times, but the odds are a thousand to one against it. Therefore, I now have to conclude that the odds that a mind reader is really doing it are a thousand to one that he's not a mind reader still, but it was a million to one before.
….
Now suppose that we go to another club, and it works, and another one and it works. I buy dice and it works. I take him home and I build a roulette wheel; it works. What do I conclude? I conclude he is a mind reader.

it is possible to conclude, by a number of tests, that mind reading really exists. If it does, I get extremely excited, because I didn't expect it before. I learned something that I did not know, and as a physicist would love to investigate it as a phenomenon of nature. Does it depend upon how far he is from the ball? What about if you put sheets of glass or paper or other materials in between?

To be prejudiced against mind reading a million to one does not mean that you can never be convinced that a man is a mind reader. The only way that you can never be convinced that a man is a mind reader is one of two things: If you are limited to a finite number of experiments, and he won't let you do any more, or if you are infinitely prejudiced at the beginning that it's absolutely impossible.
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12-11-2011, 01:53 PM
RE: I don't understand.
See what you started? Watched that vid, couldn't help but think of this vid:




Now we're getting some understanding.

(Throw that last bit in there, keep it topical. Wink )

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12-11-2011, 01:59 PM
RE: I don't understand.
(11-11-2011 11:47 PM)PeterK Wrote:  What are your most convincing reasons that God does NOT exist? Without a shadow of a doubt what do people believe that convinces them this?.
God does not exist because non existence is the default position. If you don't know whether there is a cat in your cupboard, there IS no cat in your cupboard unless you can prove there is. (especially since no one but you seem to actually know the cat)

If you claim there is a god, you prove it. not the other way around. To me the default position is no god.

And by the way...
Before you start proving Him, be so kind to define Him first.

It boils down to this:
I don't worship deities for the same reason I don't regard to an invisible infinite ham in my fridge as being lunch. It’s a waste of time and again I’ll eat something else anyway this evening. Big Grin
What do I mean by this? You can pray, call and worship God all you like but if you’re ill you go to a doctor and when your house is on fire you call other humans to extinguish it. God is useless...

Observer

Agnostic atheist
Secular humanist
Emotional rationalist
Disclaimer: Don’t mix the personal opinion above with the absolute and objective truth. Remember to think for yourself. Thank you.
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12-11-2011, 02:03 PM
RE: I don't understand.
(12-11-2011 01:59 PM)The_observer Wrote:  
(11-11-2011 11:47 PM)PeterK Wrote:  What are your most convincing reasons that God does NOT exist? Without a shadow of a doubt what do people believe that convinces them this?.
God does not exist because non existence is the default position.
Huh

That position is faulty. Tongue

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12-11-2011, 02:19 PM
RE: I don't understand.
(12-11-2011 02:03 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  That position is faulty. Tongue
Possible. Why?

Observer

Agnostic atheist
Secular humanist
Emotional rationalist
Disclaimer: Don’t mix the personal opinion above with the absolute and objective truth. Remember to think for yourself. Thank you.
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12-11-2011, 03:15 PM
RE: I don't understand.
(12-11-2011 02:19 PM)The_observer Wrote:  
(12-11-2011 02:03 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  That position is faulty. Tongue
Possible. Why?

I exist. Default position: existence. I know what you're saying about god - I've also "seen some shit." Big Grin

Whether or not that shit exists is merely a function of my existence. Wink

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