I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
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20-02-2017, 08:09 AM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
(20-02-2017 02:41 AM)Mirek-Polska Wrote:  
(20-02-2017 02:25 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  Anecdotes and science bashing.

If there was anything to this at all, I would expect at least one piece of credible evidence would have surfaced somewhere.

How can we possibly test whether someone's crazy experience really happened? If we're just relying on their description of it, we certainly can't. Their consciousness floating around the room and observing events is one thing (even this hasn't been demonstrated to be actually true, anecdotes don't count), but mystical hell-realms are quite another. How can you possibly distinguish between a real journey and a hallucination? If you can't, then it's rational to take the simplest explanation that requires the least number of assumptions. A hell journey would require quite a lot of extra assumptions, none of which have an ounce of evidence or credibility.

Did you read this article?
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/314115-n...periences/

It essentially says "when the brain is out of oxygen, it starts firing rapidly in a disorganized fashion—it’s not working properly. From our knowledge of the brain, we would not expect organized experience in this state, but a jumble perhaps akin to what one might find in seizures or in mental illness—other examples of the brain not working correctly.

But what we get are vivid, organized, transformational experiences—people report that their NDEs feel “more real than real,” they feel free, that they understand the universe at a deep level, and have never been happier. This can happen both when the brain is not in immediate danger, and when it’s under severe duress because of a life-threatening situation.
Mind Power

Interestingly, when the brain is close to death, there is a higher incidence of cognitive enhancement—the mind feels unfettered and able to process more thoughts than usual. That we would find enhanced cognition under deprived conditions for the brain does not square with our understanding of brain function."

The Epoch Times does not have peer-reviewed articles.
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20-02-2017, 08:17 AM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
People "challenging" science on their random woo websites is rather like me broadcasting from my bedroom in my pants that I'm the world's greatest MMA fighter. Anyone can do it, and it means nothing unless you're willing to get into the cage and knock on some skulls.

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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20-02-2017, 09:44 AM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
(19-02-2017 11:17 PM)Mirek-Polska Wrote:  
(19-02-2017 11:15 PM)Astreja Wrote:  Sounds like a standard NDE -- Someone has a medical crisis and imagines a bunch of things. If he changed, it was probably because of the things he imagined, not because he experienced an actual afterlife.

I am wondering though, how could he imagine something so graphic? He imagined that God sent him to hell as a messenger so that he could tell people hell is real. I don't get how an atheist's mind could have come up with that.

Why is it that the person who has had the supposed NDE always saw something that aligns perfectly with their own previously held beliefs?

Christians never see Allah, Muslims never see Jesus, etc...
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20-02-2017, 09:50 AM (This post was last modified: 20-02-2017 09:59 AM by pablo.)
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
(19-02-2017 11:40 PM)Mirek-Polska Wrote:  
(19-02-2017 11:30 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Or people just make shit up? It sells books and gets people on TV.

Let me ask you this, if the theory of a brain deprived of oxygen is proved to be false, would you still believe NDEs are bullshit, or would you believe them?

Disproving the oxygen deprivation hypothesis does not prove NDE's are real.
It only proves that these "visions" are not caused by a lack of oxygen.

ETA: I might as well add this, I've been getting a lot of mileage out of it lately with the NDE crowd. Wink



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20-02-2017, 10:11 AM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
(19-02-2017 11:18 PM)Astreja Wrote:  
(19-02-2017 11:16 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  What the hell is it with all the near death shit lately?

Probably a believer hoping to scare us into belief with a bunch of woo-woo stories about hell.

No. Someone just wanted to sell a book. Shy

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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20-02-2017, 10:20 AM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
(19-02-2017 11:18 PM)Mirek-Polska Wrote:  
(19-02-2017 11:16 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  What the hell is it with all the near death shit lately?

Dodgy

It's scary because it could mean there is hell Weeping

Don't worry.




There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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20-02-2017, 12:18 PM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
I wonder if this is the same Mirek-Polska who claims to be posting from Poland, but is really in Canada... Consider

"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear." ~ Thomas Jefferson
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20-02-2017, 04:47 PM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
Aside from the fact that a panicked brain which is deprived of oxygen and sensory input is by definition the worst possible witness?

Let's start with the fact that NDEs never seem to transcend cultural boundaries (Appleby, 1989). Christians never run into a Coyote that chats with them in Ojibwe, Taoists never end up on Planet Kolob.

And you can conveniently have an NDE without ever being near death (Owens et al, 1990). You just need to think that you're dying. I'm told that you can even induce them in prefectly healthy individuals with the right drugs.

It seems pretty obvious that these so-called NDEs are entirely psychological, triggered by the mind and yielding nothing that is not already in the mind.

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Flesh and blood of a dead star, slain in the apocalypse of supernova, resurrected by four billion years of continuous autocatalytic reaction and crowned with the emergent property of sentience in the dream that the universe might one day understand itself.
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20-02-2017, 05:43 PM
RE: I have one question I would love for the atheists to answer!!!!!!!
(19-02-2017 11:17 PM)Mirek-Polska Wrote:  
(19-02-2017 11:15 PM)Astreja Wrote:  Sounds like a standard NDE -- Someone has a medical crisis and imagines a bunch of things. If he changed, it was probably because of the things he imagined, not because he experienced an actual afterlife.

I am wondering though, how could he imagine something so graphic? He imagined that God sent him to hell as a messenger so that he could tell people hell is real. I don't get how an atheist's mind could have come up with that.

Look at it this way, the subconscious takes whatever we have been exposed to whether it has its roots in something we were told, saw, heard, read or experienced and puts it into a blender and then spits out some really interesting gray-matter smoothies. It really isn’t more complicated than that.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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