I'm Too Hostile to Believers
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
20-06-2014, 10:02 PM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
(20-06-2014 09:34 PM)Reltzik Wrote:  
(20-06-2014 11:22 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Attacks against a proponent of an argument in an attempt to invalidate the argument is fallacious regardless of how much evidence you have for a person being "stupid" or whatever you call them.

A pathological liar can present an argument. Saying he is a patholohical liar, therefore his argument is false is fallacious.

(20-06-2014 11:12 AM)Reltzik Wrote:  Then they should be able to provide a large amount of evidence of stupidity to back up the ad-hominem, and that evidence, if immediately topical, will include a strong debunking of the proffered argument's flaws.

Translation: Immediately topical evidence is evidence relevant to the immediate topic, ie, the argument in question. This is the difference between calling someone an idiot, versus showing that the argument that they have put forward is idiotic and that they are by extension an idiot. One, as you point out, is a baseless ad hominem that does not address the idiot's actual argument. While correct in the abstract, as a response to my comment this was a straw man on your part. The other addresses the idiot's argument quite thoroughly, and then uses the idiot's failure in argument to provide reasonable support the additional, tangential point that the idiot is an idiot. I suggested that this would be feasible in the case that the idiot was in fact an idiot rather than just being called an idiot, and you maliciously and/or ignorantly (and either way idiotically) chose not to address this, in favor of a straw man that was itself a subtle ad-hominem.

Have a nice day! Big Grin

[Image: Jon-Stewart-saying-Oh-Snap.gif]

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
21-06-2014, 07:02 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
Short of assault and battery, can one be too hostile to believers? Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Chas's post
21-06-2014, 07:35 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
I don't feel hostile anymore at all, I did long time ago for a spell. Mostly I was angry at having been duped myself.

I have compassion for believers. They are in a tough place. Either they anger god or they anger you. Who are they more scared of?

I have compassion for them because they have to live in fear, one way or another...

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Dom's post
21-06-2014, 09:18 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
(21-06-2014 07:35 AM)Dom Wrote:  I don't feel hostile anymore at all, I did long time ago for a spell. Mostly I was angry at having been duped myself.

I have compassion for believers. They are in a tough place. Either they anger god or they anger you. Who are they more scared of?

I have compassion for them because they have to live in fear, one way or another...

It might have made sense to be compassionate toward them, were they not busy trying to stuff their superstitious bullshit down everyone else's throats.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Taqiyya Mockingbird's post
21-06-2014, 09:26 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
What about you, Taq? What is your take on trying to relate to your fellow human being who might wander in to this forum to possibly see where they fit in?

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like kim's post
21-06-2014, 09:44 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
(21-06-2014 09:26 AM)kim Wrote:  What about you, Taq? What is your take on trying to relate to your fellow human being who might wander in to this forum to possibly see where they fit in?

Laugh out load
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Airportkid's post
21-06-2014, 10:50 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
(20-06-2014 09:34 PM)Reltzik Wrote:  
(20-06-2014 11:22 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Attacks against a proponent of an argument in an attempt to invalidate the argument is fallacious regardless of how much evidence you have for a person being "stupid" or whatever you call them.

A pathological liar can present an argument. Saying he is a patholohical liar, therefore his argument is false is fallacious.

(20-06-2014 11:12 AM)Reltzik Wrote:  Then they should be able to provide a large amount of evidence of stupidity to back up the ad-hominem, and that evidence, if immediately topical, will include a strong debunking of the proffered argument's flaws.

Translation: Immediately topical evidence is evidence relevant to the immediate topic, ie, the argument in question. This is the difference between calling someone an idiot, versus showing that the argument that they have put forward is idiotic and that they are by extension an idiot. One, as you point out, is a baseless ad hominem that does not address the idiot's actual argument. While correct in the abstract, as a response to my comment this was a straw man on your part. The other addresses the idiot's argument quite thoroughly, and then uses the idiot's failure in argument to provide reasonable support for the additional, tangential point that the idiot is an idiot. I suggested that this would be feasible in the case that the idiot was in fact an idiot rather than just being called an idiot, and you maliciously and/or ignorantly (and either way idiotically) chose not to address this, in favor of a straw man that was itself a subtle ad-hominem.

Have a nice day! Big Grin

Philosophical arguments are not classified as "idiotic" or "non-idiotic".

They are classified as either deductive or inductive.

Arguments are either formally valid or invalid regarding their form, informally valid or invalid regarding the absence or presence of fallacies, sound or unsound regarding the presence of true premises and logical validity, or the absence of one or both of the aforementioned. They contain premises that are said to be either more plausible than their contradictories or not.

Thus, in summary, a good argument will be formally and informally valid and have true premises that are more plausible than their contradictories.

Moreland, James Porter; William Lane Craig (2009-08-20). Philosophical Foundations for a Christian Worldview (p. 30). InterVarsity Press. Kindle Edition.


Thus in philosophy, arguments are not said to be idiotic or non-idiotic but good or bad.

So it seems to me that since you appear to be unaware of these facts, you are the last one that should be calling someone or their argument "idiotic".
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
21-06-2014, 11:17 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
(21-06-2014 09:44 AM)Airportkid Wrote:  
(21-06-2014 09:26 AM)kim Wrote:  What about you, Taq? What is your take on trying to relate to your fellow human being who might wander in to this forum to possibly see where they fit in?

Laugh out load

I understand the funny Shy but I also think it's a valid request. I'm always curious about peoples' ideas concerning intent and effectiveness.

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like kim's post
21-06-2014, 11:31 AM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
Miso,
From what I know of you, you are extreme with your emotions regardless of what they are. You are very passionate and intense. With your religious upbringing and the ongoing issues with your family over religion, I think it makes sense that you are hostile.

Hopefully over time you will relax a bit. I just think it's part of your personality. You feel things very strongly. It'll be okay.

Heart

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF

We're all mad here. The Cheshire Cat
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Anjele's post
21-06-2014, 12:23 PM
RE: I'm Too Hostile to Believers
(20-06-2014 11:17 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Blah blah blah ...bunch of tediously dull troll vomit..blah blah blah

Talking about you is not the same as talking to you the primary difference being that the former is not an invitation to converse with me you intellectual peasant. Nor should you misconstrue this as an invitation as until you develop either a moral compass or some degree of intellectual veracity (both preferably) then I see no need to waste my time on your infantile attempts at trolling. Hell I'd even be fine if you just stopped being so boringly repetitive. I can't stand boring trolls, at least make an effort boy.

You are not worth my time, the time of anyone else, and I rather greatly suspect your not even worth your own. Shoo Fly.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like WhiskeyDebates's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: