I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
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31-05-2017, 06:03 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 05:54 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  
(31-05-2017 05:49 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  According to the science council, this is the actual definition of science: Science is the pursuit and application of knowledge and understanding of the natural and social world following a systematic methodology based on
evidence.
Now the Forever Family Foundation is claiming to use evidence for their tests, so if they are wrong then why don't you sue them for conning poor fools like me?
That's what science is yes, but what don't seem to understand is they are setting the standards of this test, so could potentially make it easier
to get the right answers, and even intentionally mark it as a "pass", for example, if they may have accepted a minor bribe.

That's just an idea, but if it's all done in
house...on a test that THEY have made...that THEY mark as well...it just seems a bit backwards to me. You need independant study, from people NOT involved over the course of lengthy periods of time, not an afternoon in a
barn guessing between 1 and 10.
How do you know they made up the test? Did you look at it? Why don't you talk to one of their psychics and write up your own test and if that psychic doesn't pass you get your money back. Win-win
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31-05-2017, 06:03 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 05:57 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  I personally believe that people don't want to believe in God because there's so much suffering in the world. After all, if God is love and we know what love is, then why do we suffer?

And that is one bit of evidence - amongst the dozens or more bits of evidence - against a divine, benevolent superintelligence.

Among the other evidential components against the existence of said superintelligence:
  • Lack of clear instructions
  • "Holy" books clearly influenced by social structures and attempts at gaining political, military and economic power
  • Inefficacy of prayer
  • Non-scientific and irrational data provided in "holy" books

There are scores more.
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31-05-2017, 06:04 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
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31-05-2017, 06:04 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
Do you think any of them could pass the dice test I described?

You know they couldn't, don't you? It would be very simple to do, especially over the phone.

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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31-05-2017, 06:04 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 06:01 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  If you're not messing with us, why can't you define the word?

If you're going to say things like "God is love", you're just playing semantic games.
Because I don't know who God is. I don't even know if there is a God but I do know that something eternal had to have created us.
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31-05-2017, 06:05 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 03:11 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  If not God, then what is eternal?

First we need to determine that something is eternal and then we can try to apply a label. The fact that you believe something has to be based on your "common sense" is meaningless. Our common sense is useful when applied to everyday situations with which we have a lot of experience. It is useless when dealing with infinities because we have no intuitive grasp of such things.

(31-05-2017 03:13 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  To believe that something actually comes from nothing is to believe in magic.

Facepalm
Coming from somebody who believes that an eternal being poofed the universe into existence, that takes irony to a whole new level.

Quote:And each and every one of those seemingly endless big bangs have a cause. What is the first cause?

If we are dealing with an eternity then there's no "first". If causality doesn't apply to the universe as whole then there's no need for a "cause". You are extrapolating from everyday events within the universe to events outside the universe and that's a category error.

(31-05-2017 03:24 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  But the reason why you don't know is because you'll never find out, because it's a logical impossibility otherwise

You are applying logic using rules that operate within the universe to things happening outside the universe. That's not logical. Saying "we don't know" is intellectually honest. Saying "it must be a god" is a form of arrogance since you are saying that reality must conform to what you are familiar with.

(31-05-2017 03:34 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  I know that me merely saying the words doesn't make me right but logically I'm right. I'm right on what is most likely true.

You have no idea what the options are so you have no way to determine what is possible, let alone most likely. You are merely asserting a statement of faith.

(31-05-2017 03:40 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  It's impossible to make a vacuum that has absolutely nothing in it.

It is not possible for us to do so within the universe at our current level of technology. Please demonstrate how you know that applies to whatever may have existed prior to our universe being formed.

Quote:And I don't feel conned at all, in fact, I could've asked for a refund if I wanted to but I knew she was genuine so I didn't.

You are nothing if not gullible. Your psychic has made a career out of fooling people (to be fair, she may even be fooling herself). Every test done to date under controlled conditions has shown no evidence of psychic abilities. Many have been shown to be deliberate frauds. The odds that you have stumbled over the one actually real psychic are about as close to zero as you can get. This is a case where we do have enough evidence to invoke common sense and it should be telling you that you've been conned even if you can't explain just how.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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31-05-2017, 06:06 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 05:57 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  I personally believe that people don't want to believe in God because there's so much suffering in the world.
I want to believe but I am not convinced of its existence.
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31-05-2017, 06:08 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 06:02 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  
(31-05-2017 04:16 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  If nothing in the universe can last forever then it's not eternal. Eternal is to forever exist in the future.

No thing can exist forever. That doesn't mean the universe can't exist forever in some form. That's a category error.

Do you have any more evidence? (Since you didn't answer before, I'm back to assuming you're just messing with us.)
What you're saying is a contradiction. Can something exist forever or can't it?
And if I wanted to mess with you I would resort to name calling or something.
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31-05-2017, 06:09 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 06:04 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  Because I don't know who God is. I don't even know if there is a God but I do know that something eternal had to have created us.

I await your receipt of a nobel prize in physics since you "know" things that the people who study these things professionally haven't concluded.

Slapping the label "god" on something that is not understood does not add any clarity, it just discourages further investigation.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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31-05-2017, 06:12 AM
RE: I'm not a Christian anymore, yet I'm not an Athiest
(31-05-2017 06:03 AM)Heath_Tierney Wrote:  
(31-05-2017 05:57 AM)DogLover12347 Wrote:  I personally believe that people don't want to believe in God because there's so much suffering in the world. After all, if God is love and we know what love is, then why do we suffer?



And that is one bit of evidence - amongst the dozens or more bits of evidence - against a divine, benevolent superintelligence.

Among the other evidential components against the existence of said superintelligence:
  • Lack of clear instructions
  • "Holy" books clearly influenced by social structures and attempts at gaining political, military and economic power
  • Inefficacy of prayer
  • Non-scientific and irrational data provided in "holy" books

There are scores more.
You'd be surprised how many psychics believe in reincarnation. According to one of them, we are born in Heaven and we personally choose to live a life here on earth, to learn whatever lesson we need to learn.
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