I need Hitchens, quick!
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10-12-2012, 05:56 PM (This post was last modified: 10-12-2012 06:01 PM by Vosur.)
RE: I need Hitchens, quick!
(10-12-2012 12:40 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Having a disbelief in gods definitely fundamentally changes the nature of the universe, just as a belief in gods do. It isn't irrelevant by a long shot. One directly affects the understanding of the other profoundly, don't kid yourself.
We are all born as atheists, hence why atheism itself has no influence on anything but your position concerning the existence of gods.

(10-12-2012 12:40 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Yes, I am arguing that Atheism can be a religion, not that it is. I'm surprised you hadn't caught on to that by now...
I do understand your position just fine; I disagree with your claim that atheism can be a religion and have substantiated my opinion in my previous post(s).

(10-12-2012 12:40 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Again, it sometimes is...
Give me some meat, something to chew on. Simply asserting the opposite of your opponents position accomplishes nothing and is counter-productive to a healthy discussion.

(10-12-2012 12:40 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Sure it is...
See above. You need to make an argument for why you disagree.

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10-12-2012, 08:37 PM
RE: I need Hitchens, quick!
Eh, whatever, I don't care enough to debate...I'm bored with it. There is room for debate though, it all comes down to definitions for religion. I personally believe that a minority of atheists are Atheists, while most atheists are just atheists.

I've laid out my reasons pretty clearly, and if you don't agree that is fine.

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10-12-2012, 09:08 PM
RE: I need Hitchens, quick!
If your atheistic friends are under the delusion that atheism is still a religion, rephrase your points. It's very similar to what creationists do. When creationism failed to get in schools, evangelicals regrouped and tried again under the 'Intelligent Design' banner in the hopes nobody would notice. So act like you're reaching a compromise.

"Oh, I think the problem is you're confusing atheistic-religion with atheistic-dogmatism. There are dogmatic atheists. There are also atheists known for worshiping other atheists, which means they're contradicting their beliefs. Atheism is the rejection of belief in God and/or Gods and the rejection of religious practice of God and/or Gods. Keyword there: belief. Please don't confuse believing with religion, as so many do."

There's the chance your friends aren't really atheists. Atheism is one of the most misunderstood beliefs in the world. I once believed atheism was the belief in having no purpose in life. It's an ongoing learning experience.

If you think Superman is real, comics are historical events,
and a bite from a radioactive spider will give you superpowers,
congratulations! You're on the same playing field as a theist.
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11-12-2012, 01:25 AM
RE: I need Hitchens, quick!
Exactly what atheistic dogma are you referring to Mr. TomS? Are you talking about scientific evidence to contradict commonly held religious beliefs? Just curious....

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11-12-2012, 08:52 PM
RE: I need Hitchens, quick!
(11-12-2012 01:25 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  Exactly what atheistic dogma are you referring to Mr. TomS? Are you talking about scientific evidence to contradict commonly held religious beliefs? Just curious....
I was talking about atheists who claim there is evidence against the existence of God and congregate amongst themselves boasting about it. When they do this, I can see why a theist would accuse atheism of just being another religion, which is funny for a theist to do, because it means they're criticizing themselves. Fanaticism is not just a religious tendency, it's really a human tendency. Kinda like how religion, try as they might, can't take credit for morality.

If you think Superman is real, comics are historical events,
and a bite from a radioactive spider will give you superpowers,
congratulations! You're on the same playing field as a theist.
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11-12-2012, 10:30 PM
RE: I need Hitchens, quick!
(11-12-2012 08:52 PM)TomS Wrote:  
(11-12-2012 01:25 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  Exactly what atheistic dogma are you referring to Mr. TomS? Are you talking about scientific evidence to contradict commonly held religious beliefs? Just curious....
I was talking about atheists who claim there is evidence against the existence of God and congregate amongst themselves boasting about it. When they do this, I can see why a theist would accuse atheism of just being another religion, which is funny for a theist to do, because it means they're criticizing themselves. Fanaticism is not just a religious tendency, it's really a human tendency. Kinda like how religion, try as they might, can't take credit for morality.
Well, there can be no proof against the existence of god as a concept, however there can be evidence against gods, and proof of the non-existence of specific gods, whether it be empirical, or logical. Of course from a philosophical perspective there may exist no "proofs", but a close to one as could be reasonably hoped for from a pragmatist perspective, but I think I get what you meant.

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