I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
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12-08-2013, 03:58 AM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
Well, you can't prove a negative. A Gnostic is one who claims to have knowledge, usually considered "secret". In a gnostic atheist, by definition there would be no source from which to get this knowledge. From a theological standpoint it makes no sense to say "I know God/gods doesn't exist.". Saying there is no evidence to support the belief in a god/s is a different matter entirely.

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12-08-2013, 04:20 AM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
DL you have to take that up with the pro-philosophy gang.

I am heavily anti-philosophy so almost nothing they do get my support.

Good that you accept that I am an unwilling atheist.

Kind of odd that it took me a whole year to find that super simple solution.
just in case some extreme pro-phil start to bark I can retire to
apatheistic agnostic atheist that is very unwilling to be atheist. Smile
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12-08-2013, 04:27 AM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
(12-08-2013 04:20 AM)Freethinker2 Wrote:  DL you have to take that up with the pro-philosophy gang.

I am heavily anti-philosophy so almost nothing they do get my support.

Good that you accept that I am an unwilling atheist.

Kind of odd that it took me a whole year to find that super simple solution.
just in case some extreme pro-phil start to bark I can retire to
apatheistic agnostic atheist that is very unwilling to be atheist. Smile

I still don't see what hair you are splitting here. What is wrong with the term 'atheist'?

To me, an "unwilling atheist" would be someone who doesn't believe in gods but wants to.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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12-08-2013, 11:13 AM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
Yeah, freethinker is either very wrong with his definitions or he found some new perspective we haven't found yet...

I can't see what's wrong with atheism, why are you unwilling? do you not want to be part of the "atheist community"? or do you just don't like to talk about gods in general?

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12-08-2013, 11:24 PM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
(12-08-2013 11:13 AM)nach_in Wrote:  Yeah, freethinker is either very wrong with his definitions or he found some new perspective we haven't found yet...

I can't see what's wrong with atheism, why are you unwilling? do you not want to be part of the "atheist community"? or do you just don't like to talk about gods in general?

If there existed "atheist community" then most likely I would join yes.

But it depends on how they behave. But trust me I did exchange views
with active atheists for one year daily and between 4 hours to 8 hours/day

and these atheists assured me that logically there can be no "atheist community"

There can be individual atheists banding together locally or on internet
but no "atheist community" Atheism does not exist only individual atheists exist.

You can not join atheism and thus logically you can not leave atheism.

I think that was the straw that broke my hope on atheism as something
to care about.

what I hate the most about atheism is the Borg behavior.
We are the Atheist Borg.
Resistance is futile we will assimilate you against your will.

Any decent movement has to allow people to join because they want to
and to leave when they want to or else it is like a destructive sect
that hold persons as prisoner and never let go.

And I have been a supporter of atheism from me 10 years old
to me 40 years old so why is that not enough.
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12-08-2013, 11:25 PM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
"do you just don't like to talk about gods in general?"

I do talk about gods in the sense of
I believe that all gods are man made.
I am very willing to talk about that view.
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12-08-2013, 11:36 PM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
Hi Chas

"To me, an "unwilling atheist" would be someone who doesn't believe in gods but wants to. "

Good that you tell me that it is that confusing term. So based on that reaction
then I most likely has to go back to Social Anthropological atheist?

What is it to be a Social Anthropological atheist?
Social psychology as wikipedia describes it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_psychology
"the scientific study of how people's thoughts, feelings,
and behaviors are influenced by the actual, imagined,
or implied presence of others." (God is imagined)

Anthropology of religion is describe like this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthropology_of_religion
" every religion is a cultural product created by the human community that practices it."

and supported by this definition of religion by Clifford Geertz

"religion is "(1) a system of symbols which acts to
(2) establish powerful, pervasive, and long-lasting moods and motivations in men by
(3) formulating conceptions of a general order of existence and
(4) clothing these conceptions with such an aura of factuality that
(5) the moods and motivations seem uniquely realistic" (Geertz 1966)."

That is actually what I believe in with the reservation I change mind if more fact comes up.
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12-08-2013, 11:48 PM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
I'm sorry, but to break it down logically in my mind I hear the following:

Unwilling atheist.

One who is not willing to not believe that a god exists.

Words have definitions. I understand that they also have connotations, but the connotations are full of every different culture's different baggage.

An atheist in an urban swedish city will not bring the same connotations as an atheist in rural Alabama in the US. Yet the simple definition of an atheist remains the same. You're fighting your own demons, here.

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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13-08-2013, 02:59 AM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
Positively I am an anthropological theist
logically that makes me a non-philosophic atheist

I positively believe in anthropological theism
The gods of religious traditions are man made.
but seen from the atheist definition that view
makes me into a non-philosophical atheist
which means that I don't support the atheist definition.

I don't trust it can be explained much clearer than that.
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13-08-2013, 04:47 AM
RE: I sincerely need your kind help. Struggled one year daily with Philosophy
(12-08-2013 11:24 PM)Freethinker2 Wrote:  If there existed "atheist community" then most likely I would join yes.

But it depends on how they behave. But trust me I did exchange views
with active atheists for one year daily and between 4 hours to 8 hours/day

and these atheists assured me that logically there can be no "atheist community"

There can be individual atheists banding together locally or on internet
but no "atheist community" Atheism does not exist only individual atheists exist.

You can not join atheism and thus logically you can not leave atheism.

I think that was the straw that broke my hope on atheism as something
to care about.

what I hate the most about atheism is the Borg behavior.
We are the Atheist Borg.
Resistance is futile we will assimilate you against your will.

Any decent movement has to allow people to join because they want to
and to leave when they want to or else it is like a destructive sect
that hold persons as prisoner and never let go.

And I have been a supporter of atheism from me 10 years old
to me 40 years old so why is that not enough.
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