I've noticed something peculiar.
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19-05-2015, 05:32 PM (This post was last modified: 19-05-2015 05:41 PM by Gilgamesh.)
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
(19-05-2015 05:24 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(19-05-2015 05:21 PM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  Also, I will admit that when faced with an argument from a theist, I don't always have the knowledge to counter it. I don't even know if that knowledge exists; for all I know I am being faced with a valid and sound argument from a theist; the irrefutable. However, despite that, I still believe I am right. My conclusion is already drawn; I'm right and they're wrong ...

You might want to work on that. It won't serve you well.

I only do it in regards to god claims. As far as that claim goes, don't we all here do this? If not, I don't think I can fix it; To me, the god claim, unless you give 'god' a vague definition, or a definition that is already ascribed to another word, is absolutely impossible to substantiate. Often this is so precisely because theist's refuse to reasonably define it, too.
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19-05-2015, 05:40 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
I'd like to respond to this and I will be very honest (Someone on here once said I was one of the most honest members on this forum so I have to live up to that), and what better way to spend my 1,500th post? Angel

I know exactly what KC is talking about because I, too, noticed the recent uptick in people asking for help to dismantle arguments. A couple of things about this: First, it could be precedent. When a lawyer prepares for trial, especially in motion court, they look for precedents that almost automatically will win their case or motion. It's just so much easier than having to spend countless hours convincing a judge of the merits, etc., when another judge already went through that. This could be the case here.

Sure, I know a ton about certain apologetics and how to counter, but there is no way I know as much as GWG or Bucky. If they have already refuted what I am up against and I agree with them, I will use their POV, put it in my own words and address the person I'm debating. I've PM'd GWG before for links or thoughts on certain subjects when I was writing a blog post or chatting with someone about it. Many times I've searched this archive looking for threads that dealt with something I'm discussing. Now, do I possess the faculties to research it and come up with the same conclusion? Sure, but most of these debates are happening in real time or at the very latest one-day intervals. So sometimes timing or punctual responses are of the essence to social media discussions.

Here is the major honest part: I hate to be wrong. I do love to win. I've been an athlete all of my life and in one particular area I was and still am close to world-class. So winning is part of my character. If I'm wrong and I know I am, I'll admit it and that usually is followed by an apology because sometimes I can be an ass. But, when you combine the need to win with the urgency to respond in a debate, I can see why people come here looking for help.

And it's funny, while I'm not anywhere near neutral like KC, I used to go in theist forums and debate, and it's remarkable how similar the comments and attitudes are. So I'm certain there are just as many theists asking for help in their debates.

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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Atheism promotes critical thinking; theism promotes hypocritical thinking. -- Me
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19-05-2015, 05:40 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
(19-05-2015 05:32 PM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  
(19-05-2015 05:24 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  You might want to work on that. It won't serve you well.

I only do it in regards to god claims. As far as that claim goes, don't we all here do this? If not, I don't think I can fix it; To me, the god claim, unless you give 'god' a vague definition, or a definition that is already ascribed to another word, is absolutely impossible to substantiate. Often this is so for the very reason that it can't be reasonably defined, too.

Well what is your vague god claim, if any?
The gods of all the religions are extremely definitive: if one chooses to accept fanaticism and fantasy!
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19-05-2015, 05:51 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
(19-05-2015 05:40 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Here is the major honest part: I hate to be wrong.

The only times I've ever learned something substantial and significant is when I am wrong. I learn nothing from being right.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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19-05-2015, 06:22 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
(19-05-2015 05:51 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(19-05-2015 05:40 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Here is the major honest part: I hate to be wrong.

The only times I've ever learned something substantial and significant is when I am wrong. I learn nothing from being right.

Good point. Though I have learned substantially from professors and reading, but yes, my mistakes have made me smarter, stronger.

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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19-05-2015, 06:24 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
(19-05-2015 05:51 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I learn nothing from being right.

You learn you're not wrong Tongue no? well I tried.

"If you keep trying to better yourself that's enough for me. We don't decide which hand we are dealt in life, but we make the decision to play it or fold it" - Nishi Karano Kaze
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19-05-2015, 06:26 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
(19-05-2015 06:22 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  
(19-05-2015 05:51 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  The only times I've ever learned something substantial and significant is when I am wrong. I learn nothing from being right.

Good point. Though I have learned substantially from professors and reading, but yes, my mistakes have made me smarter, stronger.

Not knocking professors.
I have done a bit of public speaking.
People often ask for citations from academia to bolster points.
Point of matter is, often the esteemed writer asked for has contradicted
herself elsewhere.
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19-05-2015, 06:35 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
(19-05-2015 06:26 PM)Mr Woof Wrote:  
(19-05-2015 06:22 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Good point. Though I have learned substantially from professors and reading, but yes, my mistakes have made me smarter, stronger.

Not knocking professors.
I have done a bit of public speaking.
People often ask for citations from academia to bolster points.
Point of matter is, often the esteemed writer asked for has contradicted
herself elsewhere.

Well that is what the academic or scientific field of studies are built upon. The continued support and contrasting ideas of others in the field in order to form agreed upon points.

Perhaps that does lead to a view of that idea. While there is often a well understood notion of, the general consensus doesn't determine an ideas truth, there is often a scientific/skeptical approach from internet forum atheists. That may lead to a type of desiring others academic like inputs.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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19-05-2015, 07:06 PM (This post was last modified: 19-05-2015 07:19 PM by TheGulegon.)
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
As far as the aggressiveness is concerned, in a country full of batshit theists with a pound of cotton plugged in each ear, this may be the only place a person is given the chance to put their foot down and not back off from speaking the truth! But not everybody's good at speaking! Doesn't mean they're too stupid to fit the concept in their head, just that they may need somebody who IS good at it to express their thoughts for them with shiny fanangly words! Tongue

(19-05-2015 03:00 PM)Dom Wrote:  In real life, atheists mostly go it alone. It's a very lonely place to be for many of us. It just feels good to have a "family" to come to for help with things that our real life friends cannot or will not help us with.

I am glad so many people feel free to ask for support here. It's part of the whole point of this place.


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19-05-2015, 07:29 PM
RE: I've noticed something peculiar.
After 2000 years of atheists regarded as evil, satanic, child eating, devil worshipping sub human and 2000 years of religious indoctrination and bible study inserted into every minute detail of everyone's lives, fuck yeah! it's about time they got some of their own medicine back and if I need to ask a couple of questions from fellow atheists to help make a point, so be it.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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