I will debate any atheist on here
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18-04-2015, 11:19 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(24-03-2015 09:08 AM)David Kragt Wrote:  Some say that life itself is meaningless but that they create their own meaning...

Some atheists say that passing their genes on to the next generation is what gives life meaning...

Some say the value of life is the legacy we leave behind...

If you're going to quote my signature, please do it properly. Thanks.

Dodgy

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19-04-2015, 12:02 PM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(17-04-2015 08:32 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(16-04-2015 09:59 AM)David Kragt Wrote:  If it doesn't matter in a cosmic sense it simply doesn't matter.

That's an infantile viewpoint. Grow up - take responsibility for your own life, your own happiness, your own meaning.

This seems rather interesting to me. I like to think that I have some agency in my own life, and I dare say most people enjoy that feeling. As an atheist I have no illusions about my life being guided by some other supernatural agent. I have control over my own life.

Christians seem to deny themselves this agency. Someone else must be responsible for their lives, and for their happiness as a result. While this might be helpful in dealing with negative aspects of life (although if it's healthy or not is another matter) it does seem rather juvenile. It's not MY fault I'm not happy! It's not MY fault that my life isn't what I want! It's what GOD wants! He runs everything.
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21-05-2015, 01:02 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(08-02-2015 12:23 PM)One Above All Wrote:  Provide a single, fallacy-free, logically and reality consistent argument for the existence of your particular god that doesn't apply to every other god.
I won't hold my breath.

No faith can be "proven" logically, any more than the love you have for your family can be "proven" by logic. How sad and cold if our family love had to be forcefully scrutinised by "logic"! Some aspects of our reality are illogical (in the literal sense) eg sacrifice, serving the poor... Do you ask a patriot why s/he would die for his/her nation?
Or why some people spend their lives serving the poor? It is absurd to try and put these qualities under the spotlight of "logic". In the same way, a person's "faith" enriches one's life and cannot be scrutinised by logic. My faith is in the "invisible" (spiritual) God who manifested Himself through Jesus Christ. Yes, illogical. It cannot be analysed via "logic". By the way, what do you mean when you said "that doesn't apply to every other god"?? Haven't you just acknowledged the existence of at least a "god"?
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21-05-2015, 01:24 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(08-02-2015 12:39 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  
(08-02-2015 12:33 PM)Chas Wrote:  Sorry, no. There is no evidence corroborating your Bible stories.

There is plenty of evidence for me and the rest of the billions of Christians in this world.

Chas...not so much historical evidence (we are talking about 2000 years ago when communications were very primitive and limited), but ancient historians do make commentary on the rapid spread of these "people of the Way" as early Christians were called, and their zeal for life and telling others about Jesus. The vital part of their message was the risen Lord and the impact that had on them. It's still the same impact today for those who hear the good news, respond in faith and be transformed in their spirits by Jesus' Spirit.
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21-05-2015, 03:47 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(21-05-2015 01:02 AM)Chris Chen Wrote:  ...
My faith is in the "invisible" (spiritual) God who manifested Himself through Jesus Christ. Yes, illogical.
...

Welcome to TTA.

It's certainly unusual and refreshing to find a theist who acknowledges the absurdity of their faith.

I hope you'll enjoy your time here.

Smile

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21-05-2015, 04:20 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(21-05-2015 01:24 AM)Chris Chen Wrote:  
(08-02-2015 12:39 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  There is plenty of evidence for me and the rest of the billions of Christians in this world.

Chas...not so much historical evidence (we are talking about 2000 years ago when communications were very primitive and limited), but ancient historians do make commentary on the rapid spread of these "people of the Way" as early Christians were called, and their zeal for life and telling others about Jesus. The vital part of their message was the risen Lord and the impact that had on them. It's still the same impact today for those who hear the good news, respond in faith and be transformed in their spirits by Jesus' Spirit.

Halle-fucking-lujah Dodgy

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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21-05-2015, 04:22 AM (This post was last modified: 21-05-2015 04:34 AM by Szuchow.)
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(21-05-2015 01:24 AM)Chris Chen Wrote:  
(08-02-2015 12:39 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  There is plenty of evidence for me and the rest of the billions of Christians in this world.

Chas...not so much historical evidence (we are talking about 2000 years ago when communications were very primitive and limited), but ancient historians do make commentary on the rapid spread of these "people of the Way" as early Christians were called, and their zeal for life and telling others about Jesus. The vital part of their message was the risen Lord and the impact that had on them. It's still the same impact today for those who hear the good news, respond in faith and be transformed in their spirits by Jesus' Spirit.

Lets say that ancient historians really say so. So what? Others faith did not try to proselytize? Those who believed in other fairy tales weren't zealous? Fact that many people believes something does not make it true. Many believed in Thor, or in Zeus and now these so called gods are where they rightly belong - in myths; nobody* worship them, people outgrew this particular brand of gods.

*somebody probably do, though it's realy small minority I think.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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21-05-2015, 06:49 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(21-05-2015 01:24 AM)Chris Chen Wrote:  
(08-02-2015 12:39 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  There is plenty of evidence for me and the rest of the billions of Christians in this world.

Chas...not so much historical evidence (we are talking about 2000 years ago when communications were very primitive and limited), but ancient historians do make commentary on the rapid spread of these "people of the Way" as early Christians were called, and their zeal for life and telling others about Jesus. The vital part of their message was the risen Lord and the impact that had on them. It's still the same impact today for those who hear the good news, respond in faith and be transformed in their spirits by Jesus' Spirit.

Spread of Christianity is due to Emperor Constantine making it the official religion, forbidding all others under pain of death.

No one..let me say it slower...NOOOO ONNNNNE who EVER wrote of jesus knew him. Not...one...single ..person. All hearsay, all stories, people love to tell stories. One would suspect if this self proclaimed messiah was crucified, and the entire world went dark midday, and corpses burst from the tombs and walked around town, someone would have thought that noteworthy AT THE TIME. Did Philo of Alexandria, a reknowned and highly respected historian in the area at the time note these events? no, In fact he doesn't even mention a jesus Consider Perhaps Justus, a historian who lived in Galillee....nope...rather odd. Perhaps one of the plethora of literate people at the time wrote it down?.....nope. perhaps it didn't happen....that gets my vote.

Argument ad populum is weak.

Argument ad delusion is weak

Argument ad nauseam is prevalent

"It's still the same impact today for those who hear the good news, respond in faith and be transformed in their spirits by Jesus' Spirit."

Define good news.

Define faith.

Define Jesus' spirit.


Flex

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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21-05-2015, 07:58 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(21-05-2015 01:24 AM)Chris Chen Wrote:  
(08-02-2015 12:39 PM)Call_of_the_Wild Wrote:  There is plenty of evidence for me and the rest of the billions of Christians in this world.

Chas...not so much historical evidence (we are talking about 2000 years ago when communications were very primitive and limited), but ancient historians do make commentary on the rapid spread of these "people of the Way" as early Christians were called, and their zeal for life and telling others about Jesus. The vital part of their message was the risen Lord and the impact that had on them. It's still the same impact today for those who hear the good news, respond in faith and be transformed in their spirits by Jesus' Spirit.

That might be evidence of people's gullibility, but it is not evidence of the truth of the belief.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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21-05-2015, 08:59 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(21-05-2015 01:02 AM)Chris Chen Wrote:  
(08-02-2015 12:23 PM)One Above All Wrote:  Provide a single, fallacy-free, logically and reality consistent argument for the existence of your particular god that doesn't apply to every other god.
I won't hold my breath.

No faith can be "proven" logically, any more than the love you have for your family can be "proven" by logic. How sad and cold if our family love had to be forcefully scrutinised by "logic"! Some aspects of our reality are illogical (in the literal sense) eg sacrifice, serving the poor... Do you ask a patriot why s/he would die for his/her nation?
Or why some people spend their lives serving the poor? It is absurd to try and put these qualities under the spotlight of "logic". In the same way, a person's "faith" enriches one's life and cannot be scrutinised by logic. My faith is in the "invisible" (spiritual) God who manifested Himself through Jesus Christ. Yes, illogical. It cannot be analysed via "logic". By the way, what do you mean when you said "that doesn't apply to every other god"?? Haven't you just acknowledged the existence of at least a "god"?

What is illogical in sacrifice? One could think that best use of one life would be to sacrifice it for what one deems greater purpose. How helping the poor is illogical? One may feel some kind of pleasure from it.

As for faith I would rather call it infantile. Apart from indoctrination it's I think just fear of dying and fear of taking life in one hands without guidance for invisible friend.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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