I will debate any atheist on here
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09-02-2015, 09:46 AM (This post was last modified: 09-02-2015 09:50 AM by Job_1207.)
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 07:02 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 06:52 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  I base my convictions (about God's existence) on a logical interpretation of the hardcore evidence that I see around me.

Let me guess. Shit happens therefore god.

You almost nailed it, my friend, but your slight omission proves you haven't been paying attention to the world around you. Amazing shit happens, therefore God.
Ever heard of practical impossibilities? How many would you need to be presented with before you deigned to step down from your pedestal and take a closer look at the evidence?

It doesn't matter what I believe; all that matters is what I can prove!
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09-02-2015, 09:56 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 09:46 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 07:02 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  Let me guess. Shit happens therefore god.

You almost nailed it, my friend, but your slight omission proves you haven't been paying attention to the world around you. Amazing shit happens, therefore God.
Ever heard of practical impossibilities? How many would you need to be presented with before you deigned to step down from your pedestal and take a closer look at the evidence?

Can you be more specific as to what this "evidence" is exactly?

I'm pretty sure it will not be scientific.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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09-02-2015, 09:58 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 09:46 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 07:02 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  Let me guess. Shit happens therefore god.

You almost nailed it, my friend, but your slight omission proves you haven't been paying attention to the world around you. Amazing shit happens, therefore God.
Ever heard of practical impossibilities? How many would you need to be presented with before you deigned to step down from your pedestal and take a closer look at the evidence?

You keep saying 'evidence', but you never present any. Why is that? Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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09-02-2015, 10:11 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 09:46 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 07:02 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  Let me guess. Shit happens therefore god.

You almost nailed it, my friend, but your slight omission proves you haven't been paying attention to the world around you. Amazing shit happens, therefore God.
Ever heard of practical impossibilities? How many would you need to be presented with before you deigned to step down from your pedestal and take a closer look at the evidence?

Have a listen, what appears to be a “practical impossibility” to you, is simply your inability to understand and comprehend statistical data.

http://www.radiolab.org/story/91684-stochasticity/

Right now the Powerball drawing for Wednesday is about $450m. The odds of any one of us winning is 1 in 175,223,110
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ronald-l-w...88129.html.

BUT the odds of any one person winning the lottery is very high. Wait, wtf, how can that be you might ask?

Break open a statistics book and go “learn” yourself something.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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09-02-2015, 10:12 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 09:46 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 07:02 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  Let me guess. Shit happens therefore god.

You almost nailed it, my friend, but your slight omission proves you haven't been paying attention to the world around you. Amazing shit happens, therefore God.
Ever heard of practical impossibilities? How many would you need to be presented with before you deigned to step down from your pedestal and take a closer look at the evidence?

Again, what evidence?

Do you understand that when you claim to have evidence, but do not provide it, you are being dishonest?

And do you understand that it is this kind of dishonesty from Christians that contributes to people becoming atheists?

When your position is dishonest, how then can you possibly expect anyone who employs reason to believe anything you say?

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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09-02-2015, 10:14 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 09:46 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 07:02 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  Let me guess. Shit happens therefore god.

You almost nailed it, my friend, but your slight omission proves you haven't been paying attention to the world around you. Amazing shit happens, therefore God.
Ever heard of practical impossibilities? How many would you need to be presented with before you deigned to step down from your pedestal and take a closer look at the evidence?

BTW "amazing" does not mean goddidtit. Here's a tsunami survivor story

My baby was six months old and my first instinct was to grab him. I heard people screaming outside, that water was coming and I saw many people running. Then I heard something smack against the house and I knew I was not going to be safe on the second floor. My husband and my other children were out so I ran with my baby and my mother. The first wave hit us but we managed to hold on to each other. I was so scared that I would lose them so I held on as tight as I could. The water carried us to a police station near my house and a policeman there pulled us out of the water. Then the second very strong wave came. We ran up to the second floor but the water was filling up the whole room. I thought we might get trapped and drown in there. But the policeman started bashing at the ceiling and he made a hole so we could climb into the roof. It was an amazing moment. I was thanking God when the water started to go down.

She thanked god, she lives in Indonesia, so this god is probably Allah.

Do these so-called "miracles" count only when it's the Christian god and we conveniently brush aside the other 280,000 people that didn't survive?

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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09-02-2015, 10:17 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 08:57 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 06:52 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  Why would I be imagining the horrible "boss" I described in my post? Just to make my life miserable? What the hell would I gain from that? Who goes wishing they'd go to war one day and have their legs amputated by an exploding mine, or even worse, be the parent of a young soldier who suffered that? Would you be able to distinguish between imaginary and real if it were you and not a stranger you hear about on the news channel?

Just to make things clear, I do not have a "personal relationship" with God in the conventional way (actually I hate religion, with its indoctrination), but that doesn't mean God does not exist. I don't base my convictions on my own feelings and believe only what I want to believe. I base my convictions (about God's existence) on a logical interpretation of the hardcore evidence that I see around me. I find God mean, at best, but sweeping the dirt under the rug is not going to make it disappear; it's just going to put it out of sight. It would be a lot easier for me to pretend there was no God and go on with my life, don't you think? But no matter what, ultimately, I will never be able to lie to myself. I AM myself, and I would know about it!

This does not answer the question. I still am left with no alternative but to imagine this God you speak of. You say that you have so much hard core evidence but I have yet to see any. I have no doubt that if you ever do produce this evidence it will still require me to use my imagination in order to apprehend your God. It will only be evidence to someone who imagines a God behind it.

I contend that your God is wholly imagined and does not actually exist. I know this to be true because it is indistinguishable from something that is imaginary. That is why all of you are driven to get others to believe without evidence, because you somehow think that if enough people imagine along side you then it will be true. It won't though because reality does not conform itself to the imagination. Existence exists independently from anyone's conscious activity.

Do you know what an educated guess is? I think you do.

Do you know what a practical impossibility is? You may, you may not.

Now, when I see a practical impossibility unfolding right before my eyes, I make an educated guess that we're no longer talking about the mathematical probability for that thing to have happened, but the absolute zero possibility for that to have happened. But I just saw it happen 100% real. How come an event that has 0% chances of happening just did? Your problem is that you mistake the probability, which may be a very small number, with an impossibility, which is zero. Not zero point something; just zero. You don't make the distinction between those two and that prevents you from seeing what I see. You see 0.00....001% and rest assured that it could have happened "by chance"; I see 0% and know it didn't happen by chance. It's simple maths, nothing else.

It doesn't matter what I believe; all that matters is what I can prove!
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09-02-2015, 10:20 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 10:17 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 08:57 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  This does not answer the question. I still am left with no alternative but to imagine this God you speak of. You say that you have so much hard core evidence but I have yet to see any. I have no doubt that if you ever do produce this evidence it will still require me to use my imagination in order to apprehend your God. It will only be evidence to someone who imagines a God behind it.

I contend that your God is wholly imagined and does not actually exist. I know this to be true because it is indistinguishable from something that is imaginary. That is why all of you are driven to get others to believe without evidence, because you somehow think that if enough people imagine along side you then it will be true. It won't though because reality does not conform itself to the imagination. Existence exists independently from anyone's conscious activity.

Do you know what an educated guess is? I think you do.

Do you know what a practical impossibility is? You may, you may not.

Now, when I see a practical impossibility unfolding right before my eyes, I make an educated guess that we're no longer talking about the mathematical probability for that thing to have happened, but the absolute zero possibility for that to have happened. But I just saw it happen 100% real. How come an event that has 0% chances of happening just did? Your problem is that you mistake the probability, which may be a very small number, with an impossibility, which is zero. Not zero point something; just zero. You don't make the distinction between those two and that prevents you from seeing what I see. You see 0.00....001% and rest assured that it could have happened "by chance"; I see 0% and know it didn't happen by chance. It's simple maths, nothing else.

None of this answers my question. Incredibly improbable things happen every minute of every day. Now, I can imagine that there is a supernatural being behind it all but how is what I'm imagining not imaginary?

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
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09-02-2015, 10:23 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 10:17 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 08:57 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  This does not answer the question. I still am left with no alternative but to imagine this God you speak of. You say that you have so much hard core evidence but I have yet to see any. I have no doubt that if you ever do produce this evidence it will still require me to use my imagination in order to apprehend your God. It will only be evidence to someone who imagines a God behind it.

I contend that your God is wholly imagined and does not actually exist. I know this to be true because it is indistinguishable from something that is imaginary. That is why all of you are driven to get others to believe without evidence, because you somehow think that if enough people imagine along side you then it will be true. It won't though because reality does not conform itself to the imagination. Existence exists independently from anyone's conscious activity.

Do you know what an educated guess is? I think you do.

Do you know what a practical impossibility is? You may, you may not.

Now, when I see a practical impossibility unfolding right before my eyes, I make an educated guess that we're no longer talking about the mathematical probability for that thing to have happened, but the absolute zero possibility for that to have happened. But I just saw it happen 100% real. How come an event that has 0% chances of happening just did? Your problem is that you mistake the probability, which may be a very small number, with an impossibility, which is zero. Not zero point something; just zero. You don't make the distinction between those two and that prevents you from seeing what I see. You see 0.00....001% and rest assured that it could have happened "by chance"; I see 0% and know it didn't happen by chance. It's simple maths, nothing else.
You do realize that you are assigning probability assessments unscientifically and that proves nothing? You have to assemble EVIDENCE and then make realistic assessments of probability based on the data. Saying someone felt better after praying for god to heal them is silly.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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09-02-2015, 10:23 AM
RE: I will debate any atheist on here
(09-02-2015 10:17 AM)Job_1207 Wrote:  
(09-02-2015 08:57 AM)true scotsman Wrote:  This does not answer the question. I still am left with no alternative but to imagine this God you speak of. You say that you have so much hard core evidence but I have yet to see any. I have no doubt that if you ever do produce this evidence it will still require me to use my imagination in order to apprehend your God. It will only be evidence to someone who imagines a God behind it.

I contend that your God is wholly imagined and does not actually exist. I know this to be true because it is indistinguishable from something that is imaginary. That is why all of you are driven to get others to believe without evidence, because you somehow think that if enough people imagine along side you then it will be true. It won't though because reality does not conform itself to the imagination. Existence exists independently from anyone's conscious activity.

Do you know what an educated guess is? I think you do.

Do you know what a practical impossibility is? You may, you may not.

Now, when I see a practical impossibility unfolding right before my eyes, I make an educated guess that we're no longer talking about the mathematical probability for that thing to have happened, but the absolute zero possibility for that to have happened. But I just saw it happen 100% real. How come an event that has 0% chances of happening just did? Your problem is that you mistake the probability, which may be a very small number, with an impossibility, which is zero. Not zero point something; just zero. You don't make the distinction between those two and that prevents you from seeing what I see. You see 0.00....001% and rest assured that it could have happened "by chance"; I see 0% and know it didn't happen by chance. It's simple maths, nothing else.

If you see something happen - however improbable - it's probability is assured - unless you dismiss the observer as unreliable.
Big Grin

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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