IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
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21-09-2015, 06:45 AM (This post was last modified: 21-09-2015 06:50 AM by Learner.)
IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
*IF* the global flood happened (as is described in the imaginary Bible tale), what might the geological/paleontological evidence look like? It amazes me that creationists keep pulling the argument out of their ass saying the order of the fossil record is due to the less mobile animals fossilizing first at a lower fossil layer, and then the smarter animals that could move to higher ground away from the floodwaters being what would fossilize in a higher fossil layer. This notion is a completely stupid "armchair" move and bears zero resemblance to reality.

But it's made me think (in order to try to help some creationist friends further see their explanations simply don't make sense): what might the geological/palenontological evidence look like if there was a global flood? (The enormous improbabilities and impossibilities of the story aside...like where the water actually came from and went, everything about the story, etc. Let's just magically assume rising flood waters that eventually cover the highest mountains on earth.)

I think it's easy for creationists to slink back from the enormous improbabilities of the story to pull the faith-card. But when we're talking about evidence from the largest "natural" disaster on earth ever, I trust that's another matter in their consideration...there absolutely must be evidence.

Let's assume, from the account, it took 40 days for the water level to rise above the highest mountains (Gen 7:4) due to rains during this period plus the "fountains of the deep" bursting open and "windows of heaven" being opened (ie, ancient pre-scientific bogus ideas...anyway, Gen 7:11). THEN the flood lasts for 150 days on the earth (Gen 7:24).

(1) I assume that this type of flood would leave a massive single sedimentary layer all across the world?

(2) There would be absolutely no rhyme or reason to the order of the fossil record. If dinos existed with humans per Y.E.C., then you could find places where they were fossilized together per the flood. You'd surely find at least one unlucky rabbit to get fossilized in the "precambrian strata."

(3) Strictly per the Bible account, there should NOT have been any fossilized water creatures since it says nothing about the water animals dying but only the land animals (Gen 7:21-23), in the naive assumption that water critters would just be fine in a bunch of water, right?? No way. Answers in Genesis and other creationists include fish and other sea creatures as getting fossilized first - oops, better read that passage again, Ken Ham! Can't include fish in the "billions of dead things buried in the rock layers laid down by water all over the earth." But further, in reality, many sea creatures would've died in this flood because either the saltwater or the freshwater fish would've died. Enormous increases in water pressure would've killed many. Further, many sea critters are sensitive to changes in salinity, so these would've also died. And if those food sources died, how would we still have the sea animals who live on feeding on those food sources who died?

(4) I don't have much knowledge about actual floods and fossilization, but I fail to see how the simple fact that some critter was picked up a bit later in the flood because it was on higher ground means that without exception, it would without a doubt be located higher in the fossil layers than a critter picked up at a lower elevation earlier in the flood. Come on, isn't that childish reasoning?

(5) I don't see how any fossils that have been delicately preserved would ever have been found, yet there are many examples across the world of fossilized critters with exceptionally preserved detail.

(6) We'd find evidence of a land bridge connecting to Australia for a large majority of the marsupial animals to travel that way, and maybe some fossilized remains of an inbred population migrating that way. And, I guess we'd need evidence of a land bridge from Asia to America available during this time as well.

(7) Anything else??

I know there's so much that could be said that it's hard to even know where to start. But I'm just looking for some basic seemingly-obvious things on this topic.
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21-09-2015, 06:47 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
Consider that the "flood" didn't happen over geologic time -- that is - over millions of years -- but over human history --- like in the last 4000 years as purported by the theist...

Shit -- there'd still be a ring around the tub -- metaphorically.....

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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21-09-2015, 06:52 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(21-09-2015 06:47 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Consider that the "flood" didn't happen over geologic time -- that is - over millions of years -- but over human history --- like in the last 4000 years as purported by the theist...

Shit -- there'd still be a ring around the tub -- metaphorically.....

Good point! You mean, there'd be some human record and we'd probably have come up with an idea by now of where all the water went? (Like when scientists look for evidence of an ancient asteroid hitting earth and killing the dinosaurs, they consider the crater in the Yucatan?)
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21-09-2015, 06:54 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(21-09-2015 06:52 AM)Learner Wrote:  
(21-09-2015 06:47 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Consider that the "flood" didn't happen over geologic time -- that is - over millions of years -- but over human history --- like in the last 4000 years as purported by the theist...

Shit -- there'd still be a ring around the tub -- metaphorically.....

Good point! You mean, there'd be some human record and we'd probably have come up with an idea by now of where all the water went? (Like when scientists look for evidence of an ancient asteroid hitting earth and killing the dinosaurs, they consider the crater in the Yucatan?)

For one -- when you mix salt water and fresh water -- you still get salt water....

Where's the worldwide layer of salt from the receeding waters???

There isn't one.. Hmmmm.... Shit... Sorry Noah -- you're fucked..

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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21-09-2015, 06:57 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(21-09-2015 06:54 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(21-09-2015 06:52 AM)Learner Wrote:  Good point! You mean, there'd be some human record and we'd probably have come up with an idea by now of where all the water went? (Like when scientists look for evidence of an ancient asteroid hitting earth and killing the dinosaurs, they consider the crater in the Yucatan?)

For one -- when you mix salt water and fresh water -- you still get salt water....

Where's the worldwide layer of salt from the receeding waters???

There isn't one.. Hmmmm.... Shit... Sorry Noah -- you're fucked..

Oh, I understand. Great point - I hadn't thought of a worldwide layer of salt. Man, in all the time since I've rejected the Flood story, I continue to learn more and more problems with it. I typically call that story the most unbelievable story I've ever heard.
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21-09-2015, 07:01 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(21-09-2015 06:57 AM)Learner Wrote:  
(21-09-2015 06:54 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  For one -- when you mix salt water and fresh water -- you still get salt water....

Where's the worldwide layer of salt from the receeding waters???

There isn't one.. Hmmmm.... Shit... Sorry Noah -- you're fucked..

Oh, I understand. Great point - I hadn't thought of a worldwide layer of salt. Man, in all the time since I've rejected the Flood story, I continue to learn more and more problems with it. I typically call that story the most unbelievable story I've ever heard.

It's just a silly story....

"The water receeded" --- WHERE?? If the water somehow covered the whole earth, where's the frigging drain hole for it to go down????

You gotta remember -- this story was written by goatherders who thought there WAS an "end of the earth" --- where the water could simply fall off into the void.....

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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17-10-2015, 01:47 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
I thought it was obvious that this flood story would probably relate to rising sea waters after the last ice age came to an end. The English Channel, for instance, if you look at it resembles a large washed out land bridge. The water may have come into the Mediteranean in a surge as it rose up over or broke through land barriers, and then into the Black Sea. Maybe there were large surges of water which then settled down to a lower level or maybe "Noah" or anyone who survived by taking to a raft thought the sea was receding because they reached dry land. It's just a story but there is evidence of a large rise in water levels following the ice age.

http://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/briefs/gornitz_09/

It's just another tall tale to explain a folk tale about rising water and imbue it with a "god" theme. Now we have global warming. Same thing. We're all bad, if we don't change we'll all fry or drown.
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17-10-2015, 03:17 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
I don't want to spoil the party and I really I hope you can kick my but after reading this comment:

- Any trace of salt will be washed away by the rains of fresh water afterwards
- As the amount of water must have been added by divine intervention - there is not enough water on earth to create a global flood like - it can also disappear with divine intervention.

As the water that was added would have been fresh, the salt would have been diluted.
And even if there was a trace, by salt or anything else- if you assume the material interference of a divinity is possible, he can get rid of those afterwards.

You use your bathtub and you clean it.
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17-10-2015, 03:41 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(17-10-2015 03:17 AM)WillemRM Wrote:  I don't want to spoil the party and I really I hope you can kick my but after reading this comment:

- Any trace of salt will be washed away by the rains of fresh water afterwards
- As the amount of water must have been added by divine intervention - there is not enough water on earth to create a global flood like - it can also disappear with divine intervention.

As the water that was added would have been fresh, the salt would have been diluted.
And even if there was a trace, by salt or anything else- if you assume the material interference of a divinity is possible, he can get rid of those afterwards.

You use your bathtub and you clean it.


Well, yeah, once you accept "it's fucking magic" as an answer, nothing is un-possible. Rolleyes

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17-10-2015, 04:36 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
Also, this. Tongue

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