IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
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17-10-2015, 08:31 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(17-10-2015 07:00 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Why if people here don't believe the fundamental premise of religion, do they even spend so much time trying to debunk what they already believe is not a true story?

So, some people believe in Santa Claus? So what. I mean, seriously. Either this is just a pure fairy tale or it has some connection to a known event, the rising of sea waters after the thawing of glaciers. Why is it so difficult to accept that people 1) make up fictional stories and 2) that stories relationg to real events are passed on through generations, orally.

Who says the "flood" flooded the "whole world". Did anyone back then know what the "whole world" consisted of? No.

So, the whole debate is a dumb idea because you are mocking a story which is likely to be a fictional story about some event that was known about because it was passed down through an oral tradition.

I think what is interesting about it is that there seems to be a "need" to explain something. The writer of the story seems to have a need to explain how any life survived a major flood. If there was no flood, he wouldn't have to set up an elaborate explanation of how anyone survived. That episode in the Bible would just not be there. The fact that a flood is mentioned in the Gilgamesh as well and that there was, in fact, a rising of sea waters, suggests that people were drowned in a major flood, somewhere and that it was a huge an very rapid flood, like a Tsunami or as a result of water breaking through what is now a channel, like the opening to the Mediterranean, or Black Sea.

Who says it's the whole world? Genesis 7:17-20 says so. I agree that the writers of the story had no idea of the size of the earth, or of the physics involved in their wild claims, but it clearly indicates that everything flooded... at least as high as Mount Ararat, a rainfall pace that would require over 200 inches of rainfall per hour for the full 40 days and nights specified in the story, a force literally a hundred times stronger than the worst super-hurricane we've ever seen.

I'm surrounded by fundamentalists who believe every word of that story, and who base their lives, their fears/prejudices, and (at least attempt to) run the government based on the stories in that book.

As others pointed out, when I start hearing about "the will of Santa Claus", I'll start working on debunking the claims of those who think there's a factory full of elves (and, apparently, a coal mine) at the north pole.

According to the National Center for Science Education, almost half of the United States consistently polls as thinking the Bible is literal and that evolution did not happen. This has major consequences in terms of our social and political dialogues, and I feel it is in my best interest to show that the falsehoods of the main fable which keeps most of my countrymen from understanding the science necessary to remain competitive in the 21st century, as well as to increase social fairness in a pluralistic nation.

Widespread scientific ignorance is a dangerous thing in a nation with the most powerful military on earth, and a self-righteous outlook. Don't believe me, look up the phrase "American exceptionalism".

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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17-10-2015, 08:58 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(17-10-2015 08:31 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(17-10-2015 07:00 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Why if people here don't believe the fundamental premise of religion, do they even spend so much time trying to debunk what they already believe is not a true story?

So, some people believe in Santa Claus? So what. I mean, seriously. Either this is just a pure fairy tale or it has some connection to a known event, the rising of sea waters after the thawing of glaciers. Why is it so difficult to accept that people 1) make up fictional stories and 2) that stories relationg to real events are passed on through generations, orally.

Who says the "flood" flooded the "whole world". Did anyone back then know what the "whole world" consisted of? No.

So, the whole debate is a dumb idea because you are mocking a story which is likely to be a fictional story about some event that was known about because it was passed down through an oral tradition.

I think what is interesting about it is that there seems to be a "need" to explain something. The writer of the story seems to have a need to explain how any life survived a major flood. If there was no flood, he wouldn't have to set up an elaborate explanation of how anyone survived. That episode in the Bible would just not be there. The fact that a flood is mentioned in the Gilgamesh as well and that there was, in fact, a rising of sea waters, suggests that people were drowned in a major flood, somewhere and that it was a huge an very rapid flood, like a Tsunami or as a result of water breaking through what is now a channel, like the opening to the Mediterranean, or Black Sea.

Who says it's the whole world? Genesis 7:17-20 says so. I agree that the writers of the story had no idea of the size of the earth, or of the physics involved in their wild claims, but it clearly indicates that everything flooded... at least as high as Mount Ararat, a rainfall pace that would require over 200 inches of rainfall per hour for the full 40 days and nights specified in the story, a force literally a hundred times stronger than the worst super-hurricane we've ever seen.

I'm surrounded by fundamentalists who believe every word of that story, and who base their lives, their fears/prejudices, and (at least attempt to) run the government based on the stories in that book.

As others pointed out, when I start hearing about "the will of Santa Claus", I'll start working on debunking the claims of those who think there's a factory full of elves (and, apparently, a coal mine) at the north pole.

According to the National Center for Science Education, almost half of the United States consistently polls as thinking the Bible is literal and that evolution did not happen. This has major consequences in terms of our social and political dialogues, and I feel it is in my best interest to show that the falsehoods of the main fable which keeps most of my countrymen from understanding the science necessary to remain competitive in the 21st century, as well as to increase social fairness in a pluralistic nation.

Widespread scientific ignorance is a dangerous thing in a nation with the most powerful military on earth, and a self-righteous outlook. Don't believe me, look up the phrase "American exceptionalism".


Yes, well, surely "here" we should perhaps be amongst "friends" generally speaking and should, I think, find some common ground at least amongst those of us who are in fact atheists and don't accept the Old Testament as a true story. Clearly, a flood of that proportion did not take place. What then is the reason behind the story. I put a possible explanation of the "story" forward. I'm not saying even the story is remotely plausible or true or that it was passed down by word of mouth. What I am positing is that this story may point to something which I find more interesting and disturbing, for me. What it suggests to me is that there was in the "collective conscience" if I can put it that way, a view that human life was at risk at some point of what some thought could have wiped out the whole of humanity and that few survived. The writing of a story explaining how humanity came through that is quite odd, if there was no possibility that anything remotely like this ever happened.

Now we can examine geological history we can see that water levels, around the world did, in fact, rise. For me, that is the more significant thing for people to look at. So what some people think Noah was a real person? The second thing that is important is that before people could, generally, read and write, they must have had ways of passing on knowledge that we no longer understand so that the telling of such a story may have fit with their own understanding of history.

I find religious fanatics and literalists a pain in the ass too. What I have tried to do is to put the bible aside and look elsewhere to figure out if these events are understandable in some other way.

The problem with this approach, particularly here, is that one is immediately abused by all and sundry because one has to look at novel sources of information.

I have found all sorts of interesting theories, some of which I post about here. How can understanding about our past move forward if we are pinned down and abused whenever we try to express any view that doesn't conform to what the "majority" of the group wants to believe and the majority of the group are a bunch of foul mouthed children who enjoy exposing themselves as vulgarians on a public website whenever something is posted which doesn't agree with their own populist views?

On this forum, one has to only quote the works of others who are both "peer reviewed" and trendy with the "in crowd" of bullies and abusers here. About the only novel idea which fits with that is Richard Carrier's Christ Myth theory. Other than that, you're on your own.

So, what of it that Americans are hyper religious?

I grew up in the bible belt. It was a pain so I left. Now, I live near Syria...

I am actually glad that the strongest power on earth is largely Christian because it beats the crap out of the Islamic horror story of the ancient world, which still exists here. I have come to see Islam for what it is, up close. A barbaric religion of uneducated, backward selfish people who, if they got their way would impose their religion on the rest of us even if it meant slaughtering millions in the name of their god.

I think the USA is, despite some of my posts, exceptional. In case it doesn't come through, I have a degree in political science and my honors advisor was a well known American political scientist educated at Duke and Notre Dame. If you do, any of you, have the opportunity, as I have, of migrating backwards to Europe and then to the Middle East and living in a feudal society and then an Islamic country...please, please, pass it up. Don't do it. Stay where you are. Trust me, everything that is said about these places is true, and worse. They are becoming modern. People drive cars, watch TV, have Iphones. But the cultures of the places are racist, ignorant and religiously intolerant.
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17-10-2015, 09:23 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
It's pretty simple where the whole dumb story comes from..

There was a farmer -- and the river he lived on flooded. He'd seen flooding before -- so he took his goat and 2 sheep up onto high ground. It rained all week.

In subsequent re-telling of this to his kids, the grand kids - and down the line ---

There was a farmer -- and the river he lived on flooded the whole valley. He knew it was coming -- so he got his 2 goats, 2 sheep and 2 cows and headed up to high ground. It rained for two weeks.

And - as time went on -----

There was a farmer, and some mysterious stranger told him a flood was coming and it did --- so he got his 2 goats, 2 sheep, 2 cows and a unicorn and he built a raft -- and he put a big tether on it and rode out the flood for 18 days. They ate the unicorn.

................

ya see where this is headed, eh???

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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17-10-2015, 09:42 AM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(17-10-2015 08:58 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Yes, well, surely "here" we should perhaps be amongst "friends" generally speaking and should, I think, find some common ground at least amongst those of us who are in fact atheists and don't accept the Old Testament as a true story. Clearly, a flood of that proportion did not take place. What then is the reason behind the story. I put a possible explanation of the "story" forward. I'm not saying even the story is remotely plausible or true or that it was passed down by word of mouth. What I am positing is that this story may point to something which I find more interesting and disturbing, for me. What it suggests to me is that there was in the "collective conscience" if I can put it that way, a view that human life was at risk at some point of what some thought could have wiped out the whole of humanity and that few survived. The writing of a story explaining how humanity came through that is quite odd, if there was no possibility that anything remotely like this ever happened.

Now we can examine geological history we can see that water levels, around the world did, in fact, rise. For me, that is the more significant thing for people to look at. So what some people think Noah was a real person? The second thing that is important is that before people could, generally, read and write, they must have had ways of passing on knowledge that we no longer understand so that the telling of such a story may have fit with their own understanding of history.

I find religious fanatics and literalists a pain in the ass too. What I have tried to do is to put the bible aside and look elsewhere to figure out if these events are understandable in some other way.

The problem with this approach, particularly here, is that one is immediately abused by all and sundry because one has to look at novel sources of information.

I have found all sorts of interesting theories, some of which I post about here. How can understanding about our past move forward if we are pinned down and abused whenever we try to express any view that doesn't conform to what the "majority" of the group wants to believe and the majority of the group are a bunch of foul mouthed children who enjoy exposing themselves as vulgarians on a public website whenever something is posted which doesn't agree with their own populist views?

On this forum, one has to only quote the works of others who are both "peer reviewed" and trendy with the "in crowd" of bullies and abusers here. About the only novel idea which fits with that is Richard Carrier's Christ Myth theory. Other than that, you're on your own.

So, what of it that Americans are hyper religious?

I grew up in the bible belt. It was a pain so I left. Now, I live near Syria...

I am actually glad that the strongest power on earth is largely Christian because it beats the crap out of the Islamic horror story of the ancient world, which still exists here. I have come to see Islam for what it is, up close. A barbaric religion of uneducated, backward selfish people who, if they got their way would impose their religion on the rest of us even if it meant slaughtering millions in the name of their god.

I think the USA is, despite some of my posts, exceptional. In case it doesn't come through, I have a degree in political science and my honors advisor was a well known American political scientist educated at Duke and Notre Dame. If you do, any of you, have the opportunity, as I have, of migrating backwards to Europe and then to the Middle East and living in a feudal society and then an Islamic country...please, please, pass it up. Don't do it. Stay where you are. Trust me, everything that is said about these places is true, and worse. They are becoming modern. People drive cars, watch TV, have Iphones. But the cultures of the places are racist, ignorant and religiously intolerant.

These are good points. I did see an interesting hypothesis about rising sea levels and a (somewhat sudden) flooding of the great valley below the point where the Tigris/Euphrates river system empties into what is now the Persian Gulf, and how the destruction of that lush garden might have been passed down after numerous generations as a "worldwide" flood.

I, too, grew up in (and remain on the edge of) the Bible Belt. As for the barbarity of Fundamentalist Islam, I would consider it more obviously violent but not much worse than the Fundamentalist Christianity; the difference is that the United States was founded on a basis of secularism, with the First Amendment's prohibition against established religion, which kept the hardline Christians from doing more in the way of establishing effective theocracy than they have. But I have little doubt that, in the absence of the Constitutional powers granted to the feds by our courts over time, by which we were able to apply the rights of disestablishment to our state lawmakers' attempts to impose such religious rules onto others, and in the presence of an "outside threat" to the Christianized culture such as the Western world represents to the Islamic cultures, we would be little better.

The question wasn't whether or not America was/is exceptional, but the celebration of ignorance and anti-scientific ideas in a nation that controls an incredibly powerful military and roughly half the nuclear weapons on the planet. Our exceptionalist beliefs in things like our notion of having a "special status", in which Americans tend to think we are automatically right and better than everyone else despite any facts you might present to the contrary (such as our love of punishment resulting in seven times the standard Western rate of incarceration, high rates of childbirth mortality, poverty, gaps in anti-discrimination laws and worker-protection laws in comparison to other first world nations which leave it possible to fire people for being gay, a religious issue, and even for becoming pregnant, etc.)... I could go on and on.

I think the combination of power and prideful ignorance is dangerous to the entire human race, especially as America continues to lose its economic edge and the standards of living begin to drop here. We already have a problem in science and technical fields, simply because not enough of us are qualified to enter them. My dad is an engineer and my wife is a scientist; in both fields, we are "making up the gap" by importing talented, educated people from around the world, but that is slowing down and stopping as those who once came to our universities to study and then stayed here to work now come to study and then return home to do their research in their own nations, like China and India.

By focusing on the violence and social problems of nations in the Mideast, it ignores the elephant in the room: they have the power to irritate us, to harm a few of us, and to make the lives of their own peoples a living hell (this is certainly not restricted to Islam, if you have ever been to parts of Southeast Asia and South America, where Buddhists and Christians, respectively, engage in similar sorts of violent repression of their "out-group" peoples), but they lack our power to turn the world into a cinder. When I hear the fanatical, religion-driven ideologies of the people running for one of our two major political parties, I shudder.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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17-10-2015, 10:34 AM (This post was last modified: 17-10-2015 10:39 AM by Deltabravo.)
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
Hmmm....

I used to live out West. That's all I can say. I know how red-necked a place the US is. I can't disagree with what you say. I was on another atheist forum and was virtually driven off it because I believe in gun control. That puts you, in the US among the most hated of people, second only to people who have read a book by Ralph Ellis.(joke)

The problem for me is this.

In 1452 the Seljuk Turks invaded Asia Minor and captured Constantinople, the center of the Western world. I had no conception of what this was really about until I moved to where I am which is in the area of southern Turkey/Syria.

Only 40 years later Columbus makes the biggest discovery ever, the New World. Why? It's entirely economic. You can read all you want here about belief systems and morality. The reason Columbus set out on his voyage is that geographically Constantinople and Asia Minor are the center of an old "world system" which spread from Western Europe to the Far East. The means of travel were both on land and by boat. Rivers like the Tigris and Euphrates were important trade routes, as were the Bosphorus and the Black Sea. Take a look at a map. Ask yourself if you were running a highway, railway, pipeline or whatever means of communication for trade purposes, which way would you go to get from Europe to the Far East. Remember, this is what we now call the "Indo-European" world because these peoples have always been related by DNA, culture and history. Then, with the coming of the Turks to Asia Minor, they cut the known world in half and they were Muslims. That situation dominated the known world for 350 years.

You have to see Christianity in two ways, in my opinion. First, it arose out of a Hellenistic view of the world which came up against an old Hebraic culture in which the god-figure was brutal and vengeful and so were the people. It was an antidote to a brutalistic world view.

Then, when Islam came along and wrote up a manifesto for this old religion in the Koran, the world had a real problem because this religion is as brutal, ugly and cruel as was the old Hebraic religion and it was anti-Hellenistic, murderous, cultish and total. Islam erases all pre-existing history. Everything before Mohammed is of no interest. God is indifferent, often cruel. "It's Allah's will".

I live here in the Middle East. Don't kid yourself about Islam. It was and still is a dangerous religion which has never, does not and may never accept western values and freedoms. Tune into Al Jazeera sometime and start following their editorial staff. They have people like Marwan Bashara who did a series called "Empire" in which he thoroughly trashes the USA and the West. His entire perspective is Islamic. Muslims see western tolerance of religions as a form of apostasy for which westerners should all, logically in Islam, be put to death. You can't have religious tolerance in Islam, full stop. That's frightening thing to think about. All we in the west have been through in terms of achieving personal freedoms to think, write, speak, protest, dress, enjoy ourselves...the list goes on, is absolutely of no interest to Muslims. Al Jazeera did a program in which they hi-lighted the plight of Muslims in France who were discriminated against because of their views that Islam was the only religion permissible.

One seriously needs to think about this scenario. We are becoming one world and a few billion people out there adhere to this warped religion. Look at what they have done to the Buddha statues in Afghanistan and to Palmyra. Say to yourself, when you see a photo of the director of antiquities at Palmyra strung up at 80 years of age and when you hear stories of people coming from Raqqa that people are being crucified in the streets and their are 50 heads on sticks at traffic junctions, "the people who are doing this are enjoying doing it". These people are coming your way unless it is stopped and if they got hold of a nuclear weapon, they would undoubtedly use it and they would use it in the largest cities in Europe and the USA, if they could. There is no doubt about that at all.

This "exceptionalism" and the idea that the USA has to be a fortress, in my opinion, isn't just born out of something to do with the Cold War or modern history. This comes from something far older, far deeper and far scarier than most people can even imagine. It comes from a time when whole peoples had to migrate out of the Near East and Middle East to escape this kind of religion as well as ecomomic and cultural collapse in the face of major climactic changes which reduced the whole of the Near East, places like Syria, from a green and fertile land, to deserts.

Anyway, that's my rant. Living in North America isolate you from the ugly reality of what "could" happen if western values of freedom, equality and toleration aren't pursued and if other, more brutal ideologies are allowed to gain in strength.

I don't, personally, think the Garden of Eden was necessarily in Bahrain. I think it could equally mean the whole of the area of the Near East, Asia Minor, the Levant, North Africa, the Mediterranean basin which we are now discovering was a green and fertile area.

I just think you have to forget about the fact that America is what it is. I think there was a "method" to what Church Fathers did in developing Christianity the way they did. It has at its core an important moral message. The rest is there for a reason. If you lived in a day when some Turks could come along and slaughter you in your own church or make you a slave, rape your women etc., you would do anything to ensure this would never happen and that these sort of people with this sort of religion could be defeated because to Muslims it really is an all out total war against western values.
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17-10-2015, 10:58 AM (This post was last modified: 17-10-2015 11:03 AM by RocketSurgeon76.)
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
Good reply! And I definitely agree, it's important to look at the various religions, especially Christianity, in that dual perspective.

I would only point out, in a minor quibble/counter, that the social cultures of the religion are not the same as the religions themselves... there was a time in history a millennium ago, when the Christian nations were the brutal, intolerant ones, and Baghdad was the center of free expression (as much as was possible, at that point in history).

The key factor, from the historians I have read on the subject, is indeed economic influences, trade routes, and outside threats to a given culture (even if only perceived). Religion, from my point of view, provides both a social cohesion that allows groups to identify collectively in order to repel those outside, invasive threats, but unfortunately have proven over the course of time to be nearly as dangerous as that against which they defend.

Well, the Sumerians, in the Epic of Gilgamesh (from part of which the Noah story obviously borrowed heavily) mention the ancient Dilmun civilization in what is now Bahrain, and describe it as a lush garden. I meant much older than that time period, and would place Bahrain on the southernmost edge of the area I am calling the garden. I meant quite literally in what is now the Gulf, downstream of what is now the mouth of the Tigris/Euphrates system at Arvand Kenar. The Bible describes the four rivers that come together, two of which are now dried out and forgotten by history, but which satellite-radar show to have flowed into the same area. According to Wiki article on the Missouri State professor who proffers the idea, Juris Zarins:

Quote:Zarins argued that the Garden of Eden was situated at the head of the Persian Gulf, where the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers run into the sea, from his research on this area using information from many different sources, including LANDSAT images from space. In this theory, the Bible’s Gihon River would correspond with the Karun River in Iran, and the Pishon River would correspond to the Wadi Batin river system that once drained the now dry, but once quite fertile central part of the Arabian Peninsula.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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17-10-2015, 12:19 PM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
I think the Sumerians were from that area, around Ur. I suppose these myths originate from that area. I suspect the Sumerians were sea-farers so the location at that Arabian Gulf was important economically. That would give them access via river up into Asia Minor and almost to the Mediterranean and into the far east.

I agree about Christianity. I think what we know as Christianity has been grafted onto a "horus" worship, a messianic monotheism. There are Christian artefacts which point to that, such as this "Christian" piece at the Louvre: http://www.louvre.fr/en/oeuvre-notices/horus-horseback

I think of Eden as an allegorical and not a real place. I think it refers to the idea that, like today with global warming, that there was a time when the ice age drove people into a narrower belt of land further south and the climate was very different as was the topography. Much more intense sun but with the cooling of a huge glacier to the north. The glacier melts, the Eden dries up and people think they have caused it.

Have you seen this site: http://www.pasthorizonspr.com/

It's interesting because there is a lot about the work of Jason Ur at Harvard. There are some images on the site, somewhere, if they are still there, from Palo Alto where they have taken NASA infra red imagery of Syria and have been able to construct road systems from light reflected by anthroposoil, or human waste along roadways. This shows that the area was a maze of roads. There are also some studies of large depressions in the ground which show it was a place where large herds of sheep moved about, just as in Europe.

I think we are entering into a new age of being able to analyse the past using a lot of techniques such as imaging and DNA which is going to blow open a lot of conceptions we have about the past. It may also shed light on what books like the bible are describing and some of it may have factual underpinnings.

I have a pet theory that the Sumerians moved north into Syria and became known as Assyrians and that there was another access to the Arabian Gulf via the Dead Sea rift valley which I have read was once invaded by the sea. I think that when this link to the sea dried up it may have resulted in them invading the Nile Delta because there is also a very old "Suez Canal" between the Nile and the Red Sea which Napoleon rediscovered. This sea link between the Mediterranean and the Indian Ocean would have been hugely significant commercially and may be key, I think, to an understanding of the history of the area and the wealth of civilizations like the Sumerians, Assyrians, Egyptians. We tend to focus on their religions and their architecture rather than on how they amassed great wealth.

The Near East and Turkey are fascinating areas. They are only emerging from centuries of religious oppression by Islam. I think a lot of what is going on in the Middle East is completely misunderstood by westerners largely because the Ottomans weren't interested in the European history of the area and even now Muslim countries don't mind seeing ancient buildings and artifacts destroyed because they pre-date Islam. Even the language is fascinating. Turkish, for instance, is agglutinative which suggests that it is actually Sumerian. The odd thing about Turkish is that in many ways it is very similar to English, except backwards with words place in a different order, which kind of supports the theory that the British did, in fact, come fro Armenia, which was Turkey and Syria. DNA analysis is also pointing in that direction.

I agree with your comments about religion. If one sees it that way, then it allows one, I think, to put it in its box and move on to more important things. I have read a lot of what people here think of as "crank" religious revisionism by people like Atwill and Ralph Ellis. I don't agree with a lot of what they say but they have some fascinating ideas and unearth a lot which is illuminating about early Christianity. It's sad there isn't more of a focus on this type of analysis by "serious" academics rather than the nihilistic dismissal of all of it out of hand.
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17-10-2015, 12:35 PM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
That is a really cool website. Thanks for the link!

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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17-10-2015, 12:53 PM (This post was last modified: 17-10-2015 01:42 PM by GenesisNemesis.)
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
Firstly, we would be finding a lot more fossils, since the Earth would be only 6,000 years old. Secondly, they wouldn't be sorted to appear as though evolution occurred. Creationists have no mechanism to explain fossil sorting. You don't even have to look at the problems of the global flood though, just the logistics of the Ark itself are absurd enough.
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17-10-2015, 01:54 PM
RE: IF the global flood happened, what would the geological/paleontological evidence be?
(17-10-2015 12:35 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  That is a really cool website. Thanks for the link!

Yes, it's fascinating. We are just starting to scratch the surface of the "past".

I have spent a whole evening here and snoozing on the sofa. My wife went out to see the grandkids and I said I would work on a paper but I haven't even looked at it. Must stop for now.
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