Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
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24-06-2017, 01:27 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(23-06-2017 11:58 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(23-06-2017 11:37 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  So what'd I miss?

Congratulations, you're pregnant! Thumbsup

Better Muffs than me.


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24-06-2017, 01:50 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(24-06-2017 01:27 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(23-06-2017 11:58 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Congratulations, you're pregnant! Thumbsup

Better Muffs than me.

I'll get to you as soon as I can, Momz. Muffs had priority. Thumbsup

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24-06-2017, 02:01 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(24-06-2017 01:50 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(24-06-2017 01:27 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Better Muffs than me.

I'll get to you as soon as I can, Momz. Muffs had priority. Thumbsup

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24-06-2017, 06:34 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
Lord help this planet if I ever had kids.
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24-06-2017, 06:55 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(22-06-2017 03:05 PM)epronovost Wrote:  
(22-06-2017 01:46 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  I think we just disagree on group dynamics, and our viewpoints are irreconcilable. I could never look at a group of people who abhore individualism and personal liberty and think "Yes, they are part of the same group as me". I am repulsed by that sort of mentality, and renounce them. They are nothing like me. I am nothing like them. In no reasonable sense of the word should we ever be grouped together.

I don't think our viewpoints on group dynamics are irreconcilable. Let's look a bit deeper into it. You claim being strongly in support to individualism and personal liberty. There is definetely ''loons'' who support individualism and personal liberty. Let's just take the example of pedophile apologists. They support individualism and personal liberty. The core of their argument is that the State cannot decide who can and cannot conscent to sex based on their age. That minimal age of conscent is an attack on personal freedom. I don't think you support their position, but you do are part of the group of people who support individualism and personal liberty same as they do. You just disagree with how far individualism and personal liberty should be taken. Are pedophile apologists good representatives of the group who advocate for individualism and personal liberty (those I would call libertarians)? No, absolutly not. Would me pointing out constantly the flaws of pedophile apologists without ever contextualising them be a dishonest way of looking at libertarians? I do believe so.

The women in your example isn't opposed to LGBTQ rights, she supports them. Are her arguments any good? Not really. Could she be considered representative of all the people who support LGBTQ rights, neither. Is she part of the group who support LGBTQ rights? Definetley. Is lampooning her and making her a representative of the supporter LGBTQ rights without contextualising her work honest? Absolutly not.

This hits to the core of the purpose of the thread. I would publicly and loudly denounce pedophiles, as you suggested I would, especially if there was a popular perception that this was representative of people who were advocates of personal liberty and individualism. I do would consider this a point of contention so incongruous with my own views as to be unmistakably different.

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24-06-2017, 07:17 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(22-06-2017 02:03 PM)Emma Wrote:  
(22-06-2017 01:54 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Don't know what a GG is. Also, never said any of this was the norm. I've said exactly the opposite, had you payed any attention whatsoever.

A GGer is a GamerGater, as Girly referenced earlier. GGers were infamous for demonizing the term SJW a few years back in their attacks on several women developers/journalists/critics/bloggers/etc. and other "players" in gaming world. Basically, they'd have labeled anyone an SJW who is a feminist and advocate for a series of social causes.

Regardless- as epronovost pointed out- the fringe extreme examples of leftists are simply not respected enough or given enough credence to cause the effect you seem to think.

Warning: The following post will not conform to the current Zeitgeist

I'm somewhat familiar with GamerGate, as it is dubbed. I doubt I'm as familiar with it as you are, but I am at least familiar enough the some of the non-sense 'science' proving 'The Patriarchy' by Anita Sarkeesian. Now, this is not to say everyone who self-describes as a feminist is a nut, but I do think the overwhelming majority of you younger feminists have beliefs based on illogical conclusions, and indoctrination. I think most of the younger feminists, the so-called 3rd wave feminists, are about as respectable as a creationist.

Let me be clear. I don't think most of these young ladies are bad people (though those certainly exist too), but I don't think most evolution denying creationists are bad either. I don't doubt their sincerity is genuine, or that they may even have some legitimate points to be made. However, from what I have seen the mainstream 3rd wave feminists have aligned themselves with Islam. They deny basic scientific biology. They believe in a destructive reformation of Marxism that pits every sexual/gender/racial/religious minority against every majority (Replace Proletariat and Bourgeoisie vice Oppressed and Oppressor) irrespective of situational realities. In order to do that they themselves become the things they claim to fight on behalf of. What I mean by this, is they claim to speak on behalf of various minority groups without consensus of any type, and tell others what the minorities are as a group. All of this is mainstream. The fringe elements, the violent conspiracy driven nutbags could not have any legitimacy at all if the mainstream 3rd wave feminists were rightly called out for their terrible and destructive ideas by reasonable grounded critics whose ideas are grounded in reality. It's reasonable, liberty-minded folks who should be the vocal representatives of true social justice for all.

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24-06-2017, 07:24 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(22-06-2017 09:36 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(22-06-2017 02:03 PM)Emma Wrote:  A GGer is a GamerGater, as Girly referenced earlier. GGers were infamous for demonizing the term SJW a few years back in their attacks on several women developers/journalists/critics/bloggers/etc. and other "players" in gaming world. Basically, they'd have labeled anyone an SJW who is a feminist and advocate for a series of social causes.

Regardless- as epronovost pointed out- the fringe extreme examples of leftists are simply not respected enough or given enough credence to cause the effect you seem to think.


A crash course on GamerGate for the uninitiated. Just don't mind the puppet, it's his shtick.






A more in depth look at GamerGate, including an autopsy on its origins.
























I simply have no time to go through all of this at the moment, but I'd be happy to delve into it at some point if you think it might give me insight into the larger problem, if you even recognize it as a problem. I would like to extend another invitation to Skype upon digestion of the materials you've recommended. I don't think we're at an impasse in spite of the, ahem, heated disagreements. I really think that we are fundamentally in agreement with quite a bit of things in spite of the micro-chasm that exists when looking at this topic with a microscope.

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24-06-2017, 07:46 AM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(24-06-2017 07:24 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(22-06-2017 09:36 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  A crash course on GamerGate for the uninitiated. Just don't mind the puppet, it's his shtick.






A more in depth look at GamerGate, including an autopsy on its origins.
























I simply have no time to go through all of this at the moment, but I'd be happy to delve into it at some point if you think it might give me insight into the larger problem, if you even recognize it as a problem. I would like to extend another invitation to Skype upon digestion of the materials you've recommended. I don't think we're at an impasse in spite of the, ahem, heated disagreements. I really think that we are fundamentally in agreement with quite a bit of things in spite of the micro-chasm that exists when looking at this topic with a microscope.

That was just posted for the benefit of a specific topic highlighted by Emma, that of GamerGate, and only then as a means of presenting a quick crash-course on what happened for the uninitiated.

The Eli Bosnick post is far more applicable to your OP, but those too are the words of another and not my own, though I am largely in agreement with him.

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24-06-2017, 12:50 PM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
As an Aussie, all I seem to read about is that the majority of Americans dislike the Electoral College system—which is not, apparently, a true indicator of what the electorate wants.

Would it be an impossible ask constitutionally to get the 250-year-old College system disbanded in order to bring US voting into the 21st century? And if so, how would it be achieved assuming a necessary bipartisan agreement? Would there need to be a plebiscite?

In the US, a candidate (theoretically) wins an election by gaining a plurality, or more votes than the other candidate. Clinton—with nearly 3 million more primary votes than Trump—lost the election solely because of the absurd College system, which in fact destroys any logical notion of electoral "plurality".

Why not firstly try a limited-level *preferential system of voting in order to encourage more—or any—independent or minor party candidates at Federal level? Or anything to improve the standards of hypercritical presidential voting and avoid bankrupt TV reality show hosts becoming POTUS—rather than politically-qualified former Secretaries of state.

* Employed when no one candidate or party wins outright, based on first preference votes. It means a citizen's vote can still be counted, even if their first choice of candidate is eliminated due to a lack of votes.

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24-06-2017, 01:08 PM
RE: Idiotic Lefties Are Responsible for the Trump Effect
(24-06-2017 12:50 PM)SYZ Wrote:  As an Aussie, all I seem to read about is that the majority of Americans dislike the Electoral College system—which is not, apparently, a true indicator of what the electorate wants.

Would it be an impossible ask constitutionally to get the 250-year-old College system disbanded in order to bring US voting into the 21st century? And if so, how would it be achieved assuming a necessary bipartisan agreement? Would there need to be a plebiscite?

In the US, a candidate (theoretically) wins an election by gaining a plurality, or more votes than the other candidate. Clinton—with nearly 3 million more primary votes than Trump—lost the election solely because of the absurd College system, which in fact destroys any logical notion of electoral "plurality".

Why not firstly try a limited-level *preferential system of voting in order to encourage more—or any—independent or minor party candidates at Federal level? Or anything to improve the standards of hypercritical presidential voting and avoid bankrupt TV reality show hosts becoming POTUS—rather than politically-qualified former Secretaries of state.

* Employed when no one candidate or party wins outright, based on first preference votes. It means a citizen's vote can still be counted, even if their first choice of candidate is eliminated due to a lack of votes.

The electoral college is actually a good system. It prevents large populous states from having too much say in how the government runs. It forces a candidate to win over a large section of the country with different views. Balance.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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