If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
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31-10-2017, 01:37 PM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 01:16 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:  Acts 4 and Acts 2. Communism is commanded by God via his messenger, the Holy Ghost. Somehow, America's Christians don't follow God's commands.

U C 20/20.

Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

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DL
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31-10-2017, 01:41 PM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 01:22 PM)Deesse23 Wrote:  
(31-10-2017 01:00 PM)Greatest I am Wrote:  Does this link and information indicate to you that your vote means anything as compared to what the lobbyists want And pay millions for?

http://www.upworthy.com/20-years-of-data...b014efbf27

Regards
DL

How many votes do you have?
How many votes does a billionaire have?
When votes are count at the ballots, how much does your vote count, how much does a billionaires┬┤ vote count?
When you get tried for murder, according to what standards?
When a billionaire gets tried for murder, according to what standards?

If you cannot see the difference in treatment a white collar criminal gets as compared to the rest of us, then -----

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DL
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31-10-2017, 02:19 PM (This post was last modified: 31-10-2017 02:33 PM by Thoreauvian.)
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 01:37 PM)Greatest I am Wrote:  Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

Regards
DL

Similarly, Sufis think they know the true meaning of Islamic ideas, even though their interpretations are only held by a minority of people and go against their holy books. I think it much more likely they are just apologists of a different stripe. While they maintain there's a core truth to religious teachings, such ideas remain unverifiable nevertheless -- claims of gnosticism notwithstanding.

Just because something makes more sense today doesn't mean that was what was intended hundreds of years ago. So for instance, it seems very likely from what I've read that the historical Jesus was in fact an apocalyticist.
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31-10-2017, 04:27 PM (This post was last modified: 31-10-2017 04:31 PM by Deesse23.)
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 01:41 PM)Greatest I am Wrote:  
(31-10-2017 01:22 PM)Deesse23 Wrote:  How many votes do you have?
How many votes does a billionaire have?
When votes are count at the ballots, how much does your vote count, how much does a billionaires┬┤ vote count?
When you get tried for murder, according to what standards?
When a billionaire gets tried for murder, according to what standards?

If you cannot see the difference in treatment a white collar criminal gets as compared to the rest of us, then -----

Regards
DL

You avoided my argument somehow. According to which different standard is a white collar crminal treated?

I am pointing out that the formal law is ultimately relevant. As soon as the laws change, the whole game will change. I recommend not to water down your language before this is going to happen, so you have some levels of language left to apply.
You keep pointing out in what environment current law is applied, different application of said standard, what loopholes are used, etc.
You keep talking past me. Even if you werent, i would be happy to just disagree with you.

What i dont understand however about your position is: At any time in any given political system the rich were better off and had more influence than the non-rich. So your usage of "oligarchy" seems to be a distinction without a difference with respect to any form of government mankind so far had. According to your usage of the word, we never had anything else than oligarchies. Thats why i would like to refrain from throwing around this word too much.

Ceterum censeo, religionem delendam esse
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31-10-2017, 04:35 PM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
"Gnostic Christian" sounds to me like an oxymoron. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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01-11-2017, 12:07 AM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 10:32 AM)Greatest I am Wrote:  
(31-10-2017 10:21 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  I get your point that scapegoating is immoral. You seem to think they walk around worrying about being "good Christians". Who cares? They're decent people, your proclamations notwithstanding.

They're more concerned with being good people, and that is what makes them decent.

Let us hope you expend as much energy in that regard as well.

True that some Christians are good, but that good is negated every time they put a dime in the collection plate of a religion that promotes the substitutionary punishment ideology that Christianity promotes.

There were good S S troops in Hitler's camp as well but there was no way for us to know they were good when they were all flying the same flag just as all Christians except Gnostic Christians fly the same cross.

The same all inclusive label can be put to Islam as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drJCC2XXMBo

Regards
DL

Well, I'm skeptical of any "all-inclusive" horseshit anyway. I'm also skeptical of comparisons between modern American Christians and SS troops ... such comparison seems utterly simplistic.

Also, many Christians never step foot in church.

My point, since you seem oblivious to it, is that broad generalizations seem to vary in value inversely to their breadth.

But hey, you've got your own schism to push, so don't let me stop you. No doubt you're going to Heaven and the others ain't, you're moral and the others ain't, yadda yadda, insert rubber-ducky soft-soap stuff here.
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01-11-2017, 09:51 AM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 02:19 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  
(31-10-2017 01:37 PM)Greatest I am Wrote:  Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

Regards
DL

Similarly, Sufis think they know the true meaning of Islamic ideas, even though their interpretations are only held by a minority of people and go against their holy books. I think it much more likely they are just apologists of a different stripe. While they maintain there's a core truth to religious teachings, such ideas remain unverifiable nevertheless -- claims of gnosticism notwithstanding.

Just because something makes more sense today doesn't mean that was what was intended hundreds of years ago. So for instance, it seems very likely from what I've read that the historical Jesus was in fact an apocalyticist.

Man is born with the same instincts today as he was in the past.
If it is moral now, it was moral then even if they did not know it.

There are quite a number of Jesus' that pop out of scriptures. If you only see on then you are not looking the right way.

For instance, their is the Rome created pacifist Roman ass kisser and there is the more esoteric mystic who wants us to shed the yoke of religions and Gods.

That last one speaks like this.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

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DL
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01-11-2017, 10:00 AM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 04:27 PM)Deesse23 Wrote:  
(31-10-2017 01:41 PM)Greatest I am Wrote:  If you cannot see the difference in treatment a white collar criminal gets as compared to the rest of us, then -----

Regards
DL

You avoided my argument somehow. According to which different standard is a white collar crminal treated?

I am pointing out that the formal law is ultimately relevant. As soon as the laws change, the whole game will change. I recommend not to water down your language before this is going to happen, so you have some levels of language left to apply.
You keep pointing out in what environment current law is applied, different application of said standard, what loopholes are used, etc.
You keep talking past me. Even if you werent, i would be happy to just disagree with you.

What i dont understand however about your position is: At any time in any given political system the rich were better off and had more influence than the non-rich. So your usage of "oligarchy" seems to be a distinction without a difference with respect to any form of government mankind so far had. According to your usage of the word, we never had anything else than oligarchies. Thats why i would like to refrain from throwing around this word too much.

All governments need funding.

That funding comes from themselves, if they are rich enough to get elected on their own, or from their rich friends who will then control them.

I know of no situation where this does not apply.

Just a quick reply to the difference between white collar crime and blue collar.

Would you think your chances of a successful legal fight are improved, or not, if you can hire the lawyer who was top of his class?

Think O.J. Simpson.

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DL
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01-11-2017, 10:11 AM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 01:37 PM)Greatest I am Wrote:  Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

Regards
DL

Developed into?
These concepts are part of scripture in both religions.
As bad as they are now both are a lot better than they were.

Jesus also said
"But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. "
And many many more quotes that defy the "Prince of Peace" image.
Jesus the "love Hippie" is very good PR.

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01-11-2017, 10:14 AM
RE: If socialism is caring for people, should the U.S. Of A. not get more socialist?
(31-10-2017 10:35 AM)Deesse23 Wrote:  
(31-10-2017 10:26 AM)BikerDude Wrote:  Good luck with that.

Please dont try to quote me out of context. That was pretty disingenuous.
If you have a suggestion for a society based on paying no tax at all, you are free to present it.

I wasn't trying to be disingenuous.
I guess there is a context where people don't have to pay taxes?
You should look into being a lawyer.

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