If the dear leader orders it
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28-07-2017, 02:15 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
In fairness to the guy, wouldn't he HAVE to obey if Trump orders him to do something?

Is it the German army that are taught they can actively disobey an order is they think it's morally wrong? I think it Trump orders anything like that, they should just quietly remove him...never to be seen again.

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28-07-2017, 02:16 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
(28-07-2017 01:34 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(28-07-2017 01:14 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  Not true. Speaking as a South Australian, nuclear weapons make us plenty of money. Specially from India these days.

How so? Do you sell them raw materials?

We sell them uranium. ostensibly for their planned expansions on their nuclear power systems since they don't have much local uranium available and the Chinese are blocking their other procurement options.
But I don't believe anyone accepts that our ore isn't at least in part going to contribute to Indian ongoing nuclear arms manufacture.

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28-07-2017, 02:22 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
(28-07-2017 02:15 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  In fairness to the guy, wouldn't he HAVE to obey if Trump orders him to do something?

Is it the German army that are taught they can actively disobey an order is they think it's morally wrong? I think it Trump orders anything like that, they should just quietly remove him...never to be seen again.

It's about US armed forces:

It's clear, under military law, that military members can be held accountable for crimes committed under the guise of "obeying orders," and there is no requirement to obey orders which are unlawful. However, here's the rub: A military member disobeys such orders at his/her own peril. Ultimately, it's not whether or not the military member thinks the order is illegal or unlawful, it's whether military superiors (and courts) think the order was illegal or unlawful.

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28-07-2017, 06:20 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
(28-07-2017 02:15 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  Is it the German army that are taught they can actively disobey an order is they think it's morally wrong?

One of the first things they teach you in the (post war) german army is that orders do not have to be followed blindly. Explicit reference is (was in my case) made to WWII Wehrmacht and its officers. We were taught that we were expected to evaluate orders for being in accordance with the constitution/current law.

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28-07-2017, 06:34 AM (This post was last modified: 28-07-2017 07:16 AM by Rockblossom.)
RE: If the dear leader orders it
(28-07-2017 02:15 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  In fairness to the guy, wouldn't he HAVE to obey if Trump orders him to do something?

No. US military officers take an oath to support the Constitution. There is no "obey" clause in the oath. Legally, "orders" means "legal orders" - so anything else is not actually an order. A Tweet is not an order. Anything that is not legal under the Constitution is not an order. Of course, military officers can lose their jobs for it, but really, how many are going to agonize over : "Oh, I have to start a nuclear war, or I could lose my job!" The oath to the Constitution alone is part of the "checks and balances" on the government.

Officers oath:
“I, (state your name), having been appointed a (rank) in the United States (branch of service), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the office upon which I am about to enter. (So help me God.)”
http://www.afmentor.com/ceremony/Oath_Of_Office.htm
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28-07-2017, 06:57 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
Allegedly during the ten minutes between this tweet:

[Image: 170726092110-trump-tweet-transgender-mil...ge-169.jpg]

and this tweet:

[Image: GtFUeCZ3iwE.jpg?itok=4hE0Iq_E]

The pentagon was worried that the president was going to declare war on North Korea
without talking to them first!

Holy Shit! The ONE thing I do not want is to have the fucking US military walking on egg shells for the next 4 years...

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28-07-2017, 06:57 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
(28-07-2017 02:15 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  In fairness to the guy, wouldn't he HAVE to obey if Trump orders him to do something?

That would be an alarming fact in any case. Democracy is to be about checks and balances. One person should be able to order a nuclear strike without being checked by anyone? What would be the difference to any wayward dictatorship?

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28-07-2017, 08:55 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
I think you have way more to worry about from India, Pakistan, N. Korea or terrorists....


Trump is a narcissistic, egotistical fuck --- but I doubt he's going to jeopardize himself or his wealth by lobbing nuikes......

You should worry more about the Jihad Joes out there.....

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28-07-2017, 09:08 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
(28-07-2017 08:55 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  I think you have way more to worry about from India, Pakistan, N. Korea or terrorists....


Trump is a narcissistic, egotistical fuck --- but I doubt he's going to jeopardize himself or his wealth by lobbing nuikes......

You should worry more about the Jihad Joes out there.....

Yabbut, he is also delusional and unstable and prone to fits of rage.

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28-07-2017, 10:03 AM
RE: If the dear leader orders it
(28-07-2017 08:55 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  You should worry more about the Jihad Joes out there.....

They don't have nukes. And I'm not sure how unstable that bloke really is or how well aware of the consequences of a nuclear strike. There's that story about Kissinger preventing a nuclear strike by Nixon, which he wanted to order in a drunken stupor. Another clinicaly unstable person, who had well documented mental issues over decades.

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