Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
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02-02-2017, 02:35 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:33 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:30 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  "Apolitical organized groups showed up for a politically motivated speech to burn things, punch people, chant, and throw rocks because they are assholes is beyond ridiculous. "

Because it never happens that people riot in an unorganized way. Like say...when a team wins a championship or something...

The celebration may not be organized, but they all showed up to an orgaized sport, wearing the same shit, cheering for the same team....it's pretty fucking organized dude.

That is some unique special pleading there. An unorganized but organized riot Laugh out load

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02-02-2017, 02:39 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:35 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:33 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  The celebration may not be organized, but they all showed up to an orgaized sport, wearing the same shit, cheering for the same team....it's pretty fucking organized dude.

That is some unique special pleading there. An unorganized but organized riot Laugh out load

Redundancy is redundant, don't you know?

You don't need to plan violence for you to show up as a group with similar ideas, and as a result of those shitty ideas, shitty things happen.. Don't know what's so special (aka, unique) about that.

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02-02-2017, 02:42 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:39 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:35 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  That is some unique special pleading there. An unorganized but organized riot Laugh out load

Redundancy is redundant, don't you know?

You don't need to plan violence for you to show up as a group with similar ideas, and as a result of those shitty ideas, shitty things happen.. Don't know what's so special (aka, unique) about that.

You also don't need to be a part of the group to show up and try and turn it violent either. Almost like the violent people may not have been...*gasp*...part of the protest and just showed up!

Fucking crazy! That's what we have been saying ALL ALONG!

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
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02-02-2017, 02:44 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:42 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:39 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Redundancy is redundant, don't you know?

You don't need to plan violence for you to show up as a group with similar ideas, and as a result of those shitty ideas, shitty things happen.. Don't know what's so special (aka, unique) about that.

You also don't need to be a part of the group to show up and try and turn it violent either. Almost like the violent people may not have been...*gasp*...part of the protest and just showed up!

Fucking crazy! That's what we have been saying ALL ALONG!


You've moved your position from Alt-Right infiltrators, to apolitical hooligans, back to Alex Jones style Alt-Right infiltration of University of Berkley, and then tell me I'm the one with no evidence. You're properly delusional.

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02-02-2017, 02:48 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:35 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  I'm not defending Milo. I'm defending civility and free-speech.

Sure. Let the Nazi (Spencer) speak. The best thing we can do is stand there and let the Nazi talk like a fucking Nazi. We win, he is his own best argument against himself. You cannot open the door to political violence for just your side, you cannot bend the rules enough so that it's just okay for us to punch this one Nazi this one time, without it swinging back the other way. Let the Nazi be a Nazi, and let us all laugh at him and his most assuredly inadequately small genitals.

As for Milo, he is a bully, and has no place on any campus.

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02-02-2017, 02:48 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:35 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  I'm not defending Milo. I'm defending civility and free-speech.

No you're not.

You're defending bigotry and hate under the guise of free speech.

It's just like Trump saying, "I'm not PC" and then using that as cover to say the most racist, misogynistic, hateful things imaginable.

It's transparent. We see right through you.
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02-02-2017, 02:48 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:35 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:33 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Did you read the article? Milo is a fucking douchebag of the highest order. Shocking


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


After Milo, in his speech, finished making fun of criticism over the phrase “man up” he said:

“I’ll tell you one UW-Milwaukee student that does not need to man up, and that is (Student’s name).“

Here’s the horrifying thing: this trans student was in the crowd. Called out. And then your picture — which was, as the trans woman stated later, earlier in her transition — flips up on the screen. Right there. In front of the auditorium. On the big screen. And in front of thousands of other people watching online.
It gets worse. Milo then says:

“Do you know about (Student’s Name)? Have any of you come into contact with this person?”

Hold it. This student is in the crowd, probably with her friends, and now the friends have been shamed for being in contact with her, too. They did not ask for this. They did not know this was coming. They’re sitting there, stunned. He keeps going.

“This quote unquote nonbinary trans—you’re not laughing now, are you, you know him—this quote unquote nonbinary trans woman forced his way into the women’s locker rooms this year. Who knows about this story, any of you? I see you don’t even read your own student media.”

It. would. not. have. been. a. big. deal. Most apparently did not even know. No. Big. Deal. So what? Now she goes into the locker room that matches her gender. She’s able to concentrate on her education — because if she looks like a woman and goes into the men’s locker room, there’s harassment there. So she goes to the bathroom that matches her gender, and everything is fine. Again, most of the students didn’t even really know. She’s been able to get educated in peace. But after this, every time she walks into a classroom, she’s that trans woman Milo made fun of in front of thousands of people. Every time she walks into a locker room, she now may have to watch her back. Before she had decent job prospects, presumably. Now, her name is out there, and she has to worry whether her possible employer or coworkers will realize she is that trans woman Milo made fun of in a front of thousands of people — and now millions, as several have seen the story since.

She did not ask for this. All she wanted to do was go to the bathroom that matched her gender.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Milo can take a long walk off a short peer for all I care, that fucking wanker. Dodgy

I'm not defending Milo. I'm defending civility and free-speech.

So you really honestly think Milo should be free to do this on a university campus? Is that civility?
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02-02-2017, 02:50 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 10:55 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 09:34 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  I know I am a political island on this forum (as evidenced by my recent rating decline followed by my temporary? Exodus). However, surely those of you who prefer the labels of Progressive, Socialist, Communist, and so on do not condone the actions of Black-Bloc recently, do you? That's a genuine question, not a rhetorical one, just in case it's not clear.

I know there have been a lot of my peers who like those politicals brands who are thrilled with 'Punching Nazis', and shutting down Milo. Is this acceptable, uploadable, or deplorable?

For those of you unfamiliar with the stories I am referencing:

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/02/01/us/mil...-berkeley/

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/01/20/politi...r-punched/

Personally, I think they should have let him speak, they could have followed it with another speech that refuted him.

I find people love to whine about "free speech" but what they really mean is "I want to say what I want to say, but you don't get say anything unless you agree with me."

Double plus thumbs up Smile Americans on the left used to hold freedom of speech as a sacrosanct right, but that is no longer the case. Significant numbers of the left now only believe in freedom of speech that they agree with, and those same individuals want to treat offensive speech as a crime.

This is more prevalent among campus environments, and young activists on the left, but it is a concerning development on the left. That sort of position is rightfully called "illiberal" in the sense that freedom of speech used to be inseparable from liberal politics. It is concerning to me the numbers of other posters on this thread who want to claim a position of anti-free speech as the liberal position.


This used to be the position of the American Left:

Quote:Those who won our independence by revolution were not cowards. They did not fear political change. They did not exalt order at the cost of liberty. To courageous, self-reliant men, with confidence in the power of free and fearless reasoning applied through the processes of popular government, no danger flowing from speech can be deemed clear and present, unless the incidence of the evil apprehended is so imminent that it may befall before there is opportunity for full discussion. If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence.--Spreme Ct Justice Louis Brandeis
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02-02-2017, 02:52 PM (This post was last modified: 02-02-2017 02:56 PM by TheBeardedDude.)
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:44 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:42 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  You also don't need to be a part of the group to show up and try and turn it violent either. Almost like the violent people may not have been...*gasp*...part of the protest and just showed up!

Fucking crazy! That's what we have been saying ALL ALONG!


You've moved your position from Alt-Right infiltrators, to apolitical hooligans, back to Alex Jones style Alt-Right infiltration of University of Berkley, and then tell me I'm the one with no evidence. You're properly delusional.

Show me where I claimed that they were:
1) alt-right infiltrators
2) Alex Jones style "false flag" BS

edit to add: What I (and others) am saying is that there is 0 evidence to show what the political affiliation is of any of the rioters. You assume they are "illiberal leftists" but there is nothing to support that. Meaning these people may have been nothing more than assholes who showed up to take advantage of the situation. And since even you agree that the actions of the minority don't represent the entirety of a given political opinion, it is fallacious to call them "left" anything. You did that just to generate conflict. Not to be "cordial" or "civil"

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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02-02-2017, 02:53 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 02:48 PM)Heath_Tierney Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:35 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  I'm not defending Milo. I'm defending civility and free-speech.

No you're not.

You're defending bigotry and hate under the guise of free speech.

It's just like Trump saying, "I'm not PC" and then using that as cover to say the most racist, misogynistic, hateful things imaginable.

It's transparent. We see right through you.

This.

And on top of that, he straw mans us. Hobo

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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