Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
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02-02-2017, 03:23 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:16 PM)BryanS Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:13 PM)Emma Wrote:  You'll have to justify that statement. Because that is a complete load of bullshit.

No one is advocating that Milo be jailed, or hauled off to a concentration camp, for fucks sake.

But they are justifying the violent response by explaining it away, and they are taking the position that Milo "should not be allowed to speak".

No, I've seen no one justify the violent response. Quite the opposite. But I am taking the position that Milo should not be allowed to speak. Because he hurts people. The Universities inviting him need to do a better job of vetting their speakers and simply stop inviting him to speak. THAT is all. No one is saying Milo should get shot. No one is saying he should have a zipper and padlock installed on his mouth. No. Just stop fucking giving him a platform at schools. Find some other crank from the right to speak. Not Milo. Milo has proven that he will attack and hurt PEOPLE, not simply just talk about ideas.
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02-02-2017, 03:24 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:18 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:10 PM)BryanS Wrote:  That is exactly what he "implied", and that is exactly your position. You have the same respect for free speech that Stalin had in the Soviet Union and Castro had in Cuba.

You don't understand what free speech is. Free speech means the government can't criminalize what you say or your opinions. So the government can't levy any restrictions on your speech. But private companies can. So can universities. And having the freedom to speak your mind does NOT mean you are free from the repercussions of what you said.

Don't straw man me with bullshit when you don't know what the fuck you're talking about and when you don't know my actual position.

I do understand freedom of speech and that you oppose it.

Milo's speech was inhibited by a violent mob. Breaking the law in order to stop someone from speaking is a violation of free speech rights. Are you saying the it is OK to break the law to prevent someone from speaking? Milo's speech wasn't limited by the school or the government--you are the one bringing up a straw argument here, not me.
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02-02-2017, 03:24 PM (This post was last modified: 02-02-2017 03:28 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 09:57 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  Sorry... and people should care about what either of those two gentle man say... because, why? Consider

No, really? What are their actual qualification?

I've got LOTS of opinions... but actual knowledge about stuff? Not so much.

Their credentials are in their demonstrable success. So say I'm this really obnoxious dick but I'm smart enough to realize I'm a dick and I'm sitting around pondering "Well how can I make this work for me?" because that's what dicks do. And it occurs to me in a between-the-earmuffs moment of clarity which can only be described as a putrid mixture of enlightenment and greed, that I might actually be the "World's Biggest Dick" and I know there's big money to be had there if I can just get people to recognize what I realized when I was like 5.

I gotta give them kudos. Bravo dicks, bravo. :slowclap:

#sigh
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02-02-2017, 03:26 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:22 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:21 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Slavery is only illegal when the government does it....it's not hard.
Unreasonable searches and seizure's are only illegal when the government...it's not hard.
Stopping the Freedom of the Press in only illegal when the government does it....it's not hard.

Sorry, just trying to find another Constitutional right this applied to, don't mind me...

Freedom of speech being "shut down" is only illegal if done by the government.


It's not that hard. See your errors yet?

Ah! I see the error, he should've talked and dodged rocks simultaneously. It was his own fault for not speaking his mind! If someone starting throwing rocks at you while typing your reply, no problem, so long as it isn't the government doing it.

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02-02-2017, 03:26 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:22 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:15 PM)BryanS Wrote:  You're the fucking asshole who decided to tell people to fuck off when you don't like what you hear. You are what is wrong with the left--you have no ability to have a reasoned debate. You don't believe in the free exchange of ideas. You have no respect for the art of persuasion or the use of logic to crush a loathsome ideology of your opponent.

Wants respect, but doesn't give respect. Consider Hypocrite?

I only respect those who are willing to grant it. EvolutionKills was the first to take the debate into the gutter--you did notice I quoted him, right? So turn your argument around--EvolutionKills demands respect but his first response to me was "fuck off". He can go fuck himself in the eye with an ice pick for all I care.
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02-02-2017, 03:27 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:16 PM)BryanS Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:13 PM)Emma Wrote:  You'll have to justify that statement. Because that is a complete load of bullshit.

No one is advocating that Milo be jailed, or hauled off to a concentration camp, for fucks sake.

But they are justifying the violent response by explaining it away, and they are taking the position that Milo "should not be allowed to speak".

Literally no one is trying to justify the violence. Nor "explain it away." Nor condone it in any way. And no one has yet to say that Milo shouldn't be allowed to express his opinions, but he does NOT have the right to do it wherever and whenever he wants. He can't come to a business and simply start spouting off his bullshit. Freedom of speech means you can have and vocalize your opinions as you please in the public sphere, but you don't have the right to go wherever you want to say it. Twitter can set a code of conduct, as can your workplace, or even this forum. And guess what? Your freedom of speech is NOT violated if you are banned from twitter or fired or banned from the forum for hate speech. Your freedom of speech would be violated if the government jailed you for what you say or if the government told you there were things you couldn't say.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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02-02-2017, 03:28 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:26 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:22 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Freedom of speech being "shut down" is only illegal if done by the government.


It's not that hard. See your errors yet?

Ah! I see the error, he should've talked and dodged rocks simultaneously. It was his own fault for not speaking his mind! If someone starting throwing rocks at you while typing your reply, no problem, so long as it isn't the government doing it.

I guess I should stop expecting you to abandon logical fallacy and use facts and reason and logic. Keep building those straw men. Drinking Beverage

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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02-02-2017, 03:28 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:24 PM)BryanS Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:18 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  You don't understand what free speech is. Free speech means the government can't criminalize what you say or your opinions. So the government can't levy any restrictions on your speech. But private companies can. So can universities. And having the freedom to speak your mind does NOT mean you are free from the repercussions of what you said.

Don't straw man me with bullshit when you don't know what the fuck you're talking about and when you don't know my actual position.

I do understand freedom of speech and that you oppose it.

Milo's speech was inhibited by a violent mob. Breaking the law in order to stop someone from speaking is a violation of free speech rights. Are you saying the it is OK to break the law to prevent someone from speaking? Milo's speech wasn't limited by the school or the government--you are the one bringing up a straw argument here, not me.

NO, Bryan, that's not what any of us are saying. We've said over and over again that the violent reaction should not be condoned.
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02-02-2017, 03:28 PM
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:26 PM)BryanS Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:22 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Wants respect, but doesn't give respect. Consider Hypocrite?

I only respect those who are willing to grant it. EvolutionKills was the first to take the debate into the gutter--you did notice I quoted him, right? So turn your argument around--EvolutionKills demands respect but his first response to me was "fuck off". He can go fuck himself in the eye with an ice pick for all I care.

The OP and the title were always in the gutter. Want respect, give it.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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02-02-2017, 03:29 PM (This post was last modified: 02-02-2017 03:43 PM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Illiberal Left Shuts Down Free Speech with Violence (Again)
(02-02-2017 03:15 PM)BryanS Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 03:08 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Fuck off. The University has an obligation to guard it's students against such

You're the fucking asshole who decided to tell people to fuck off when you don't like what you hear. You are what is wrong with the left--you have no ability to have a reasoned debate. You don't believe in the free exchange of ideas. You have no respect for the art of persuasion or the use of logic to crush a loathsome ideology of your opponent.


Alright, you want to have a go dipshit?

He's the part you conveniently missed.

(02-02-2017 02:48 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:35 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  I'm not defending Milo. I'm defending civility and free-speech.
Sure. Let the Nazi (Spencer) speak. The best thing we can do is stand there and let the Nazi talk like a fucking Nazi. We win, he is his own best argument against himself. You cannot open the door to political violence for just your side, you cannot bend the rules enough so that it's just okay for us to punch this one Nazi this one time, without it swinging back the other way. Let the Nazi be a Nazi, and let us all laugh at him and his most assuredly inadequately small genitals.

As for Milo, he is a bully, and has no place on any campus.

But that didn't stop you from jumping the gun.

(02-02-2017 03:01 PM)BryanS Wrote:  
(02-02-2017 02:55 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  [Image: bfd60517347f6be6d75da71e03b843ff.jpg]

Milo is a bully, and he has no place on any campus. It's not a liberal or a conservative thing, it's a 'people should not be allowed to target and single out individual students for harassment so bad they have to leave campus' thing.


At least you own up to being opposed to free speech.

I own up to there being reasonable limits to free speech, and Milo crossed the line. Spencer did not, in his own context, and indeed the person who punched the literal Nazi crossed the line. So this is why I subsequently told you to 'fuck off', as you were mischaracterizing me, after I had already explicitly made my rather nuanced position pretty fucking clear.

That because of the very specific context of Milo, his targeted harassment of individual students. It's not that he's an transphoibc asshole, it's that he targeted a specific transgender student for his harassment, used hate speech against them (called her a 'tranny', this is the equivalent to 'nigger'), purposely used the wrong gender pronouns (referring to the student as 'him'), then sexually objectified her, all of this in front of the large campus audience. Not only that, but the student Milo specifically targeted (as opposed to keeping them anonymous) was there in the crowd when he did this. After that they suffered from targeted harassment so bad that they had to drop out of school. Yeah, Milo can fuck right off, and no campus should be giving a platform to anyone who so proudly attacks students directly and personally. And the very same KKK defending ACLU would agree with me that Milo being denied a platform on behalf of the campus would not be a violation of his First Amendment rights.



But sure, tell yourself how I'm all that's wrong with the liberal movement, if that makes a dumbass like you sleep better at night. Drinking Beverage

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