In Uncharted Lands with Alla
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14-12-2015, 10:44 AM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
1) What made you become a believer in Christ when you were 19 years old if before you were an atheist?

2) What did you liked in the prayer ritual?

3) You were very young yourself when the missionaries came to your door. I doubt they were much younger than you were being 19 years old at the time. What are those things that you needed to hear to have a desire to learn more and that they were not «supposed» to tell at that moment?

4) Why don't they usually tell those things?

5) Why dd you qualify yourself as an «investigator» at that point, you did not investigate on LDS creed; a group of missionaries knocked at your door? In my understanding, that would make THEM the investigators and you the subject.

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14-12-2015, 11:49 AM (This post was last modified: 14-12-2015 11:56 AM by Alla.)
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
epronovost Wrote:1) What made you become a believer in Christ when you were 19 years old if before you were an atheist?
It is kind of hard to explain what made me (an atheist) a believer. I believe God made me a believer. One day I met a guy. At his house the was this photo, face of Christ in black and white print. He told me that it is some kind of art. Till now I have no idea if he was a believer or not. I assumed that all young and educated Soviet people did not believe in fairy tails. And we both studied at the same University to become engineers. I remember I decided to look at it closer. Next moment something very strange happened: some kind of power filled my whole body and it was like I discovered something I always knew but for some reason I completely forgot about. I knew instantly that Jesus Christ is real and that He lives and that He loves me and that I love Him. And when I say that "I knew" I mean that I was convinced that much that there was no any doubt in my mind and in my heart that was true.
I call this mysterious convincing power by the name I found in the Scriptures - Spirit or the Holy Ghost.
Do I have perfect knowledge that it was Spirit who convinced me? The answer is "no". But I have perfect knowledge that a19 year old atheist in the USSR in the twinkling of an eye became a believer in Christ. And there were no men next to me at this moment who tried to convert me.
So, this is my short testimony of what happened.


epronovost Wrote:2) What did you liked in the prayer ritual?
Unity of people who don't know each other. I felt like we(strangers) are all one - one family - brothers and sisters

epronovost Wrote:3) You were very young yourself when the missionaries came to your door. I doubt they were much younger than you were being 19 years old at the time.
When I was 19 I lived in Ukraine and there was no LDS Church there yet. I was much older and I lived in California when two missionaries visited me.

epronovost Wrote:What are those things that you needed to hear to have a desire to learn more and that they were not «supposed» to tell at that moment?
I didn't know what I needed to hear but they knew. Somehow. Things like that I lived with God before I was born on Earth.
My favorite things were:
1)that it was my choice to be born/to come on Earth. I remember when I was a kid I didn't understand why me is me and not another person. Why am I a girl and not a boy? Why was I born in the USSR and not in another part of this world? Why now and not in the past or in the future?
I have answers now.
2) that my father who was an atheist will not burn in hell forever. Salvation of the dead is one of the goals of the Church. (I felt spirit of Elijah right away.)
I told you that I tried to read the Bible but never understood it. But there were few verses for some reason stoop up in my memory(Oh, this spirit of Elijah!) Paul was talking about baptism for the dead. I remember I asked myself: what in the world is he talking about? Many years later two LDS kids told me about salvation of the dead and showed to me those verses where Paul was talking about baptism for the dead. Finally I knew what Paul was talking about!
3) They said they are Christians but they were saying things that are very different. Very different. I told myself: if it is true what they claim, that their Church is true Church of God, then it only makes sense that they are not like others. They said there are gods many when all Christians say that there is only one God. I was like:"What?! Then I told myself: why not believe this? nobody knows the truth about God anyway.

epronovost Wrote:4) Why don't they usually tell those things?
Because people have to accept basic principles of the Gospel first. Without accepting basics there is no sense in learning deeper things. First we learn ABC then we learn to read and write words. Now very short quoting of the scriptures in my own words: Paul was saying that milk(basic things) is first, then later we can digest meat(deep doctrine)

epronovost Wrote:5) Why did you qualify yourself as an «investigator» at that point, you did not investigate on LDS creed; a group of missionaries knocked at your door? In my understanding, that would make THEM the investigators and you the subject.
Investigator is any person who let missionaries(it is always two companions) to teach him/her and investigates LDS Church and Doctrine. Missionaries do not investigate those whom they teach.
They invite people to come to Christ and to investigate what they teach and then to make a choice: to accept the invitation or to reject it.

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14-12-2015, 04:14 PM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
I find it interesting that despite being only 8 years old when the Soviet Union collapsed, that you were only 5 when the Berlin Wall was dismantled and only 2 or 3 years old when the perestroika was launched you still qualified, in 2003, as a «young soviet». Were your parents former member of the Party? Where you communist yourself at that point? Most of your teenage years were past in one of the most savagely capitalist environment during the transition and in 2003, Putin was already well established has Russian Prime Minister while Ukraine was tempted to join NATO.

Now I am confused again by your timeline. You said that 4 month after your epiphany in 2003 you were visited by missionnary, now in your latest post its while living in California being much older (so I suspect more like almost a decade later) not barely 4 months. Could you clarify the timeline a bit for me.

1) Did you gave a thought to other religious faith who claim pre-existance like Hinduism a thought before becoming a member of LDS?

2) Were you not affraid by that feeling you had when looking at the drawing of Jesus? It isn't exactly a very normal occurence. If I suddenly fell in love with that I barely knew, I would second guess my reaction a lot.

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14-12-2015, 04:59 PM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
Hi Brian37, I am affraid you are stumbling on the wrong thread. The boxing ring is usually for 1 on 1 conversation and debates. Maybe you should open a commentary thread in he Collosseum for that purpose. It's easier to interview a person when only one person is asking the questions. If you have some suggestions, please let me know and I will make sure to ask them when in your stead.

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14-12-2015, 06:14 PM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
epronovost Wrote:Now I am confused again by your timeline. You said that 4 month after your epiphany in 2003 you were visited by missionnary, now in your latest post its while living in California being much older (so I suspect more like almost a decade later) not barely 4 months. Could you clarify the timeline a bit for me.
Ok, I will try again.
When I was 19 years old it was still Soviet Union but very close to Perestroyka. This is when I was standing in front of the portrait/art. This is when I became a believer in Christ. Years later in 2003 I already lived in the USA in California, in sunny LA. This is when I suddenly had a desire to go to church every Sunday with my family. And this is when missionaries appeared in front of my door/knocked at my door.
epronovost Wrote:1) Did you gave a thought to other religious faith who claim pre-existance like Hinduism a thought before becoming a member of LDS?
No, I already knew that I was believer in Christ. What happened when I was 19 years old was so powerful that I could never deny Christ any more.
And LDS do not call it pre-existence. We believe in pre-mortal life, mortal life and post-mortal life. We don't believe in reincarnation.
epronovost Wrote:2) Were you not affraid by that feeling you had when looking at the drawing of Jesus? It isn't exactly a very normal occurence. If I suddenly fell in love with that I barely knew, I would second guess my reaction a lot.
It is different kind of love. It is not the same when you are in love with someone. And it was so familiar and natural. It was like I forgot but suddenly I remembered. I think I understand what it means "their eyes were suddenly opened" when I read about Adam and Eve.
I understand this better because I know now that we all already knew Christ in pre-mortal life and that when we loved Him and that when we come here(the Earth) we have to forget everything so we can live by faith and this way we can be tested.

English is my second language.
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14-12-2015, 08:00 PM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
Let me resume what you have told me so far. You were in the mid/early 80's when you were 19 years old, you had a Christian awakening triggered by an art piece of Jesus Christ. This event shook the very foundation of your belief system, but felt so natural that despite its extraordinary nature you never second guest it. Almost 20 years later, while you were on the eve of being 40 years old, you met LDS missionnaries which gave you the curiosity and the will to join their fauld to learn more about them.

1) If you had to choose three values, principles or virtues that represent best your religious view what would they be and why? As an atheist, I would say its curiosity, honesty and ambition.

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14-12-2015, 09:47 PM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
....

Charity(compassion, kindness), honesty/integrity, hard work, work, work to progress in life
P.S. I like values you choose.

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14-12-2015, 10:03 PM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
epronovost Wrote:Let me resume what you have told me so far. You were in the mid/early 80's when you were 19 years old, you had a Christian awakening triggered by an art piece of Jesus Christ. This event shook the very foundation of your belief system, but felt so natural that despite its extraordinary nature you never second guest it. Almost 20 years later, while you were on the eve of being 40 years old, you met LDS missionnaries which gave you the curiosity and the will to join their fauld to learn more about them.
I like how you make your numbers. Smile
I was 33 years old in 2003.

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15-12-2015, 07:53 AM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
This means that you were 19 during the fall of the Berlin Wall and five years after the beginning of the Perestroika (or two if you prefer to count from the congress instead of Gorbachev first reform). The Perestroika isn't the dismantling of the Soviet Union, its a period of economical reform under the Soviet regime in an attempt to save it from collapse. Please, be careful with your timeline. Historians hate that sort of confusion. It makes for poor research and makes it look like you are transforming your own life history to match your current beliefs and/or a fantasmic image of yourself.

Could you explain better your three choices of values? Why each ones and how they relate to your religious affiliation.

PS: of course you like them they are values. Here are the three values carried by ISIS and other Islamist fundamentalists groups: determination, courage and ambition. (they look good stated like that, but it doesn't prevent them to be monsters).

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15-12-2015, 08:13 AM
RE: In Uncharted Lands with Alla
I told you that when I was 19 I lived in Soviet Union. So, in 1989 it was still Soviet Union.
Ukraine became independent only after 1991. In 1992 I immigrated to US.
In 2003 I became LDS. I don't know why you became so confused.

English is my second language.
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