Insanity
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17-10-2014, 08:55 AM
Insanity
Hello everyone.
I heard a story a while ago that got me thinking about the line between religiosity/lack of critical thinking and pure paranoid delutions. For various resons i cant share this story just yet, but someone like David Ike is a very good example of what i'm talking about.
For those of you that dont know, David Ike belives a lot of things, for example that the British Queen and the US president (among others) are actualy reptilian aliens in human form trying to control humanity. Check him out on youtube if youre longing for a whole bunch of facepalm moments. Atleast he belived this at one point, his story seems to change alot. I'm no psycologist, but how is this NOT paranoid delusion? Where do you thinking the line between mental illness and plain bad thinking is?

PS: sorry about the spelling, my iPad keeps autocorrecting to swedish words so i may have missed some.
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17-10-2014, 09:28 AM
RE: Insanity
Welcome to our community.

Never heard of him but that's ok -- he sounds a bit crazy. It's delusional if he truly believes it, but he might just be ranting on YouTube in the vague hopes of having a video of his go viral.

However, I think there is a certain not quite delusion but of course cognitive dissidence that occurs in the minds of religious people that comes from years of indoctrination. They turn off the rational part that says, "this is impossible" and embrace the warm fuzzy feelings religion gives them.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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17-10-2014, 09:40 AM
RE: Insanity
Well, he certainly sells a lot of books and things. His state of sanity might not be genuine but sure is profitable.

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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17-10-2014, 09:41 AM
RE: Insanity
(17-10-2014 08:55 AM)Dr Ikusha Wrote:  Where do you thinking the line between mental illness and plain bad thinking is?

If you can prove a belief wrong, I think that can point to delusion. Now, a lot of people don't know their beliefs are delusional, and might resort to more delusions to defend their beliefs (saying that atheist scientists are lying about evolution or the flood myth from Genesis, for example).

Asserting that a nonfalsifiable belief is true is definitely bad thinking. It may or may not be delusional, and you can't prove it either way because of how nonfalsifiability works. So, people should totally not assert nonfalsifiable things because it's unreasonable, but I'm not sure it qualifies as delusional.
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17-10-2014, 09:43 AM
RE: Insanity
My frustrations dealing with religious folks leads me to view their worldview as a having some sort of "mental condition".

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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17-10-2014, 09:56 AM
RE: Insanity
Welcome.

You will hear 'delusion' used a fair amount here, probably not always accurately. I am certainly guilty of that.

There are people who are ignorant of facts about the real world and believe strange things. That's just ignorance.

Then there are people who know something of the real world but still believe weird shit and it's ok with them because they compartmentalize their beliefs.

Then there are people who know something of the real world but still believe weird shit and it is upsetting - that upset is cognitive dissonance.

Then we get to the ones who have the facts but ignore them in favor of crazy. They are delusional.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-10-2014, 10:04 AM
RE: Insanity
(17-10-2014 09:41 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  
(17-10-2014 08:55 AM)Dr Ikusha Wrote:  Where do you thinking the line between mental illness and plain bad thinking is?

If you can prove a belief wrong, I think that can point to delusion. Now, a lot of people don't know their beliefs are delusional, and might resort to more delusions to defend their beliefs (saying that atheist scientists are lying about evolution or the flood myth from Genesis, for example).

Asserting that a nonfalsifiable belief is true is definitely bad thinking. It may or may not be delusional, and you can't prove it either way because of how nonfalsifiability works. So, people should totally not assert nonfalsifiable things because it's unreasonable, but I'm not sure it qualifies as delusional.

Does that make me mentally unstable?

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17-10-2014, 10:19 AM
RE: Insanity
(17-10-2014 09:28 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Never heard of him but that's ok -- he sounds a bit crazy. It's delusional if he truly believes it, but he might just be ranting on YouTube in the vague hopes of having a video of his go viral.

David Icke has been around for a while now, way before YouTube. He's a strange one as he used to be a familiar face for sports fans on British TV

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke

Quote:Icke was a BBC television sports presenter and spokesman for the Green Party, when in 1990 a psychic told him that he was a healer who had been placed on Earth for a purpose, and that the spirit world was going to pass messages to him. In March 1991 he held a press conference to announce that he was a "Son of the Godhead" – a phrase he said later the media had misunderstood. He said that a subsequent appearance on BBC's Wogan changed his life, turning him from a respected household name into someone who was laughed at whenever he appeared in public.

I don't know what famous sports commentators there are in the US. The first name that Google brings up is Howard Cosell. Imagine if one day he started dressing only in turquoise because it was a "conduit for positive energy" and went on some famous light night chat show talking seriously about he was the son of God, the world would end in 6 years time and the U.S. president was one of the lizard people.

That's David Icke for you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Icke#...ise_period
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17-10-2014, 11:23 AM
RE: Insanity
(17-10-2014 10:04 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Does that make me mentally unstable?

Are you talking about believing in things that are provably wrong or about nonfalsifiable beliefs in general?

On the latter, I said "unreasonable" not "mentally unstable". When I think "mental instability", I think danger to self and others.
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17-10-2014, 11:34 AM
RE: Insanity
(17-10-2014 10:04 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(17-10-2014 09:41 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  If you can prove a belief wrong, I think that can point to delusion. Now, a lot of people don't know their beliefs are delusional, and might resort to more delusions to defend their beliefs (saying that atheist scientists are lying about evolution or the flood myth from Genesis, for example).

Asserting that a nonfalsifiable belief is true is definitely bad thinking. It may or may not be delusional, and you can't prove it either way because of how nonfalsifiability works. So, people should totally not assert nonfalsifiable things because it's unreasonable, but I'm not sure it qualifies as delusional.

Does that make me mentally unstable?


See? Im weird. Im just not prepared to throw ALL theists under the same bus-of-delusion.
Why?
Because i do not walk in their skin.....they do.

Sometimes it really depends on the person and not their belief system. But usually they make themselves know by their actions and their words.

When I want your opinion I'll read your entrails.
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