International English Language Standard?
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12-04-2014, 07:04 PM
RE: International English Language Standard?
(12-04-2014 09:04 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  I used to use the word 'till'. What makes you say that it is wrong?

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/till

Quote:Origin of TILL
Middle English, from Old English til; akin to Old Norse til to, till, Old English til good
First Known Use: before 12th century


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/until

Quote:Origin of UNTIL
Middle English, from un- (probably from Old Norse *und up to; akin to Old Norse unz up to, until, Old High German unt, Old English ende end) + til, till till
First Known Use: 13th century

Same goes for 'orientate' first used in 1848.
To answer your post:
what Chas said. Drinking Beverage


Oh, and I had forgotten "supposably" until I heard a guy say that today. Facepalm It's like nails on a fucking chalkboard.

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12-04-2014, 07:38 PM
RE: International English Language Standard?
(12-04-2014 12:07 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Conversate Weeping

according to mirriam-webster,it exists. Altho i know converse,not conversate. But who am i to say? I aint no 'murican

I don't really like going outside.
It's too damn "peopley" out there....
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12-04-2014, 10:24 PM
RE: International English Language Standard?
(11-04-2014 08:49 AM)PoolBoyG Wrote:  So with things like time or measurements, somewhere in the world is an item or clock that everyone else in the world adjusts to. It's our universal standard.

Now language is more fluid, and there's no standard. But for English, is there some sort of group or dictionary that's recognized as the official standard for English? If governments or universities want to use words or phrases correctly for their official publications, where do they go to look up the standard? "Is atheism a belief, or lack of belief? What does this standard say..."
You know what, I thought this was about an international language.
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13-04-2014, 03:51 AM
RE: International English Language Standard?
(12-04-2014 10:24 PM)Alex_Leonardo Wrote:  
(11-04-2014 08:49 AM)PoolBoyG Wrote:  So with things like time or measurements, somewhere in the world is an item or clock that everyone else in the world adjusts to. It's our universal standard.

Now language is more fluid, and there's no standard. But for English, is there some sort of group or dictionary that's recognized as the official standard for English? If governments or universities want to use words or phrases correctly for their official publications, where do they go to look up the standard? "Is atheism a belief, or lack of belief? What does this standard say..."
You know what, I thought this was about an international language.
01000110 01110101 01100011 01101011 00100000 01110100 01101000 01101001 01110011 00101100 00100000 01001001 00100111 01101101 00100000 01100111 01101111 01101001 01101110 01100111 00100000 01100010 01101001 01101110 01100001 01110010 01111001 00101100 00100000 01101000 01100101 01111000 00101100 00100000 01100010 01100001 01110011 01100101 00110110 00110100 00101100 00100000 01100001 01101110 01100100 00100000 01100001 01110011 01100011 01101001 01101001 00100000 01101111 01101110 00100000 01100101 01110110 01100101 01110010 01111001 01101111 01101110 01100101 00101110 00001101 00001010
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RnVjayB0aGlzLCBJJ20gZ29pbmcgYmluYXJ5LCBoZXgsIGJhc2U2NCwgYW5kIGFzY2lpIG9uIGV2ZXJ5​b25lLg0K
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The requirement of evidence to back your claim does not disappear because it hurts your feelings, reality does not care about your feefees.
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13-04-2014, 03:59 AM
RE: International English Language Standard?
OK thanks for that Jeffosaurus and Chas. Just responses saying 'orientate' and 'till' are both incorrect without providing any reason as to why. Very useful.

You're both wrong. I don't have to explain why.
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13-04-2014, 04:31 AM (This post was last modified: 13-04-2014 04:56 AM by Mathilda.)
RE: International English Language Standard?
(12-04-2014 09:16 AM)Chas Wrote:  Well, 'til I see 'till' as the first definition, I will use 'til. Drinking Beverage

"orientate" was fucking illiterate in 1848 and it is fucking illiterate now. Angry

Says the US-speaker taking his words from a dictionary created by Noah Webster which deliberately chose different spellings and variations to encourage an independent national identity and who is now judging original language native speakers if they do not comply with that usage.

Personally being British I'll be sticking with English-English.

So orientate instead of orient.

Speciality instead of specialty.

Centre instead of center.

Flavour instead of flavor.

Till instead of 'til

http://www.dailywritingtips.com/do-you-o...-yourself/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_American...h_Language
http://grammarpartyblog.com/2011/04/05/t...%80%98til/
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13-04-2014, 10:14 AM
RE: International English Language Standard?
This thread goes to the heart of the internal struggle that takes up more of my thoughts than it probably should.

Evolution... diversity... conflict... innovation!
vs.
Civilisation... assimilation... harmony... stagnation!
Consider
In context of the thread, there are two questions:

1. Should there be any standard?
2. If so, which standard?

In a wider context the same notions can be applied to ideologies, political systems and even religions.

This is a tough one for a relativist like me.

For example, as a frequent traveller, I really wish there was an international standard for power sockets.

I teach best practice standards and frameworks so I am pro: accountability, fairness, efficiency, effectiveness and transparency.

But I also enjoy the excitement of chaos and freedom.

I teach the rules but don't like to follow them.

How crazy and chaotic and dangerous and fun would it have been to live in that world before units of time were established?

Conclusion:
We need sufficient standardisation of language to be able to communicate; to enable progress towards I know not what... but not an inflexible dogmatism that stifles innovation and beneficial mutations and serendipity.

See? Too much time spent thinking about this shit! Thanks PoolBoy Angry

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13-04-2014, 12:12 PM
RE: International English Language Standard?
(13-04-2014 04:31 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(12-04-2014 09:16 AM)Chas Wrote:  Well, 'til I see 'till' as the first definition, I will use 'til. Drinking Beverage

"orientate" was fucking illiterate in 1848 and it is fucking illiterate now. Angry

Says the US-speaker taking his words from a dictionary created by Noah Webster which deliberately chose different spellings and variations to encourage an independent national identity and who is now judging original language native speakers if they do not comply with that usage.

Personally being British I'll be sticking with English-English.

So orientate instead of orient.

Speciality instead of specialty.

Centre instead of center.

Flavour instead of flavor.

Till instead of 'til

http://www.dailywritingtips.com/do-you-o...-yourself/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_American...h_Language
http://grammarpartyblog.com/2011/04/05/t...%80%98til/

Not American; I use the Oxford.

But that doesn't mean that back formations are acceptable. We already have a proper word (e.g. orient) - don't make up another.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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25-04-2014, 06:29 AM
RE: International English Language Standard?
I work in the 'hood. I train new hire employees in a call center. I grew up in a different state, and had the benefit of what I would like to think of as a pretty good public school education. I attended junior college, and went through the Defense Language Institute for two different languages. I understand that languages evolve, but the word is EVOLVE. Seeing the language devolve is distressing.

The things that come out of my students' mouths depress me. A true example:

"Oh no problem sir. You just gots to commicate that to your installator."

One of the reps on the call floor had to correct a move order for a customer. The customer was moving to 81st street. The rep who placed the order put 'Eddy 1st Street' as the address.

I could go on all day - and then drink all night.

(12-04-2014 12:07 PM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  Conversate Weeping
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