Intro -- from a Christian :)

[Phil_GA]

(07-12-2012 10:08 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  

(07-12-2012 10:01 PM)Phil_GA Wrote:  Thx for the link.

However, since I don't think that either one of us have ever personally met each other, I don't think you know me well enough to rationally conclude that I *cannot* provide a "coherent definition" of God. I'm capable of thinking a great many types of things and have yet to run into anything I'm incapable of reasonably understanding.

Whether or not the other party is equally capable or willing to suspend disbelief is another matter entirely.

Well, as all the other Theists du jour, if you can, you will be the first. in human history. That's a bit arrogant, no ? You already said you were a "Christian".
That implies you make claims about a very specific god, (Yahweh, the Hebrew god of the armies). That god has been pretty thoroughly debunked around here.
One does not "suspend disbelief". One requires evidence. We are, (here), WAY beyond that phase of life. If you need to start back there, great.
There is no evidence for any god(s), least of all the Christian one. If you "suspend disbelief" then you are also busy proving there is no 1957 Chevy orbiting Pluto. Good luck with that waste of time.

Lots of stuff there; just a couple things in response:

1. I try not to make any claims about God outside of holy writ (the Bible). Interpretations notwithstanding, to me this collection of literature is the best source to increase one's understanding of who God is.
2. This is important: suspending disbelief, within the context of debate, has to do with being willing to consider a viewpoint that is not believed by the one considering it for the purposes of either potential adoption and/or shooting it down.

I'm about to make a radical statement: I do my best to base my belief system on a rational understanding of God.

This is part of the point of my showing up here.

[Logisch]

And how does one come about this rational understanding of god?

[Tartarus Sauce]

(07-12-2012 10:43 PM)Logisch Wrote:  And how does one come about this rational understanding of god?

He answered that in the above post already you silly goose

[Logisch]

(07-12-2012 10:44 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  

(07-12-2012 10:43 PM)Logisch Wrote:  And how does one come about this rational understanding of god?

He answered that in the above post already you silly goose

I know. I was hoping for a more fun canned answer to respond to. You're ruining all the fun

"I understand god because bible. You can't understand god without the bible. So god exists because bible." sounds like presuppositionalism or just the unfolding of a lot of circular reasoning. I was hoping for something different. But...

[Phil_GA]

(07-12-2012 10:14 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  Hmmmm, you seem like you will be a fairly interesting individual.

Welcome to the hornet's nest! I presume you have tough enough skin to resist the stinging, but hey, who ever had fun without a little bit of a thrill in their life? That being said, an honest manner of debate and character as well as polite discourse and a good sense of humor will net you huge respect on this board, regardless of how fundamentally split your worldview is from the rest of the forum. However, we don't take too kindly to dishonest tactics and abrasive attitudes, so we will see where you fall.

Again, welcome.

Thanks a lot. I wouldn't be showing up here if I couldn't handle a good response from others.

The risk of my sense of humor (as well as the lack of voice inflections) is that it might come across as dishonest or abrasive. I'll try to be aware of this and proceed accordingly.

[Logisch]

(07-12-2012 10:50 PM)Phil_GA Wrote:  

(07-12-2012 10:14 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  Hmmmm, you seem like you will be a fairly interesting individual.

Welcome to the hornet's nest! I presume you have tough enough skin to resist the stinging, but hey, who ever had fun without a little bit of a thrill in their life? That being said, an honest manner of debate and character as well as polite discourse and a good sense of humor will net you huge respect on this board, regardless of how fundamentally split your worldview is from the rest of the forum. However, we don't take too kindly to dishonest tactics and abrasive attitudes, so we will see where you fall.

Again, welcome.

Thanks a lot. I wouldn't be showing up here if I couldn't handle a good response from others.

The risk of my sense of humor (as well as the lack of voice inflections) is that it might come across as dishonest or abrasive. I'll try to be aware of this and proceed accordingly.

Unfortunately... as I read this? out entirely in a sarcastic.... tone... and changed my tone of voice halfway THROUGH? You PERHAPS READ THIS LOUDLY and perhaps VERY... SERIOUSLY. But it was all in jest.


(You also probably did it with the voice of mr walken)

[Logisch]

YOU SEE... it's REALLY HARRRRRD to GET the POINT across... ON THE INTERRRRNET! I mean WHAT'A WE DOIN HERE... trying to make COHERRRRRRENT responses without some sort of INDICATORRR as to WHAT we ARE SAYING.


(seriously though, don't be afraid to be yourself)

[Phil_GA]

(07-12-2012 10:46 PM)Logisch Wrote:  

(07-12-2012 10:44 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  He answered that in the above post already you silly goose

I know. I was hoping for a more fun canned answer to respond to. You're ruining all the fun

"I understand god because bible. You can't understand god without the bible. So god exists because bible." sounds like presuppositionalism or just the unfolding of a lot of circular reasoning. I was hoping for something different. But...

Perhaps I should say that I'm flattered at the high standard to which I've been lifted, as it were, in my Christian claim and that, somehow, in one introductory thread, I'm going to single-handedly dispel all notions of God's non-existence and change the course of this forum forever.

But that would be overly dramatic.

In all seriousness, yes, I do understand who God is because of the Bible. No, I think God can be considered outside of the Bible. And no, God doesn't exist because the Bible says so.

[Bucky Ball]

(07-12-2012 10:40 PM)Phil_GA Wrote:  

(07-12-2012 10:08 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Well, as all the other Theists du jour, if you can, you will be the first. in human history. That's a bit arrogant, no ? You already said you were a "Christian".
That implies you make claims about a very specific god, (Yahweh, the Hebrew god of the armies). That god has been pretty thoroughly debunked around here.
One does not "suspend disbelief". One requires evidence. We are, (here), WAY beyond that phase of life. If you need to start back there, great.
There is no evidence for any god(s), least of all the Christian one. If you "suspend disbelief" then you are also busy proving there is no 1957 Chevy orbiting Pluto. Good luck with that waste of time.

Lots of stuff there; just a couple things in response:

1. I try not to make any claims about God outside of holy writ (the Bible). Interpretations notwithstanding, to me this collection of literature is the best source to increase one's understanding of who God is.
2. This is important: suspending disbelief, within the context of debate, has to do with being willing to consider a viewpoint that is not believed by the one considering it for the purposes of either potential adoption and/or shooting it down.

I'm about to make a radical statement: I do my best to base my belief system on a rational understanding of God.

This is part of the point of my showing up here.

Well since I know more about the Bible than you ever will, that part is a waste of time.
I'm not really interested in a "debate". It's a settled issue. Hope you can find someone here who is interested.
There s no "rational" understanding of a "god'. You can't define it. There is no evidence for it. And your own (theological) system says faith is a "virtue", (St. Paul, a gift of your "Holy Spirit").
You have to suspend your reason, and make a "leap" (of faith). That is the most irrational thing possible, no matter what you claim.

The Christian god has the same traits as an abusive partner:
• you have to fear him to receive his love
• you are unworthy of his love
• you are nothing without him
• if you do not love him he will hurt you
• he doesn't want to punish you – it's really your fault
• he threatens you if he thinks you might break things off
• at all times he needs to know where you are, what you're doing and thinking so he can control your thoughts and behavior

[kingschosen]

So, I'm assuming you opted out of my questions?