Irreducible complexity
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14-12-2013, 08:26 AM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 08:17 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 08:10 AM)Dom Wrote:  Heck yeah, the easter bunny could have created the universe. Tongue In your imagination, anything is possible. But still not plausible.

You're shifting the goal post from non-man-made IC to easter bunny made IC.

The easter bunny is one of the possibilities the imagination offers. Could also be a pink dragon with purple polka dots. Or Minnie Mouse. No limits to the imagination.

It is, however, unlikely that anything exists that can create what we create. Possible, but not probable.

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14-12-2013, 08:46 AM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 08:26 AM)Dom Wrote:  It is, however, unlikely that anything exists that can create what we create. Possible, but not probable.

Well since you seemingly agree that it is possible that non-man-made IC could exist, where do you think one should look for it that would maximize their chances of finding it?
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14-12-2013, 08:52 AM
RE: Irreducible complexity
WHY DO YOU PEOPLE HATE LYNN MARGULIS?

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14-12-2013, 08:53 AM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 08:46 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 08:26 AM)Dom Wrote:  It is, however, unlikely that anything exists that can create what we create. Possible, but not probable.

Well since you seemingly agree that it is possible that non-man-made IC could exist, where do you think one should look for it that would maximize their chances of finding it?

I think that it is too unlikely to warrant the time to look for it.

And, since we are dealing with an imaginary thing, there is no telling where to look for it. Like I said, anything is possible. No limits to the imagination.

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14-12-2013, 09:00 AM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 08:52 AM)Cephalotus Wrote:  WHY DO YOU PEOPLE HATE LYNN MARGULIS?

What the fuck are you on about?

She was a brilliant biologist and advanced the field of evolutionary biology.

She won the Darwin-Wallace Medal, primarily for The Origin of Mitosing Eukaryotic Cells - she probably should have gotten a Nobel for that.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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14-12-2013, 12:10 PM (This post was last modified: 14-12-2013 12:18 PM by Azaraith.)
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 04:51 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(09-12-2013 02:31 PM)Chas Wrote:  Nothing. Because this is not what anyone here is talking about. That is clearly man-made.

If you are merely contending that humans can create something that did not and could not evolve, then that is so obvious as to not be worth discussing.

Chas, post 1 of this thread talks about man made irreducible complexity. Its been a part of the discussion from the beginning. I'm glad to see that you are now back peddling on your claim that irreducible complexity doesn't exist. You can be taught after all.

Really? A human-engineered example is irreducibly complex, that's not even remotely interesting or applicable to evolution. No surprise it didn't evolve, we created it. Only examples naturally occurring without human involvement are interesting or relevant to the discussion, but of course Creationists have presented a grand total of zero examples of truly irreducibly complex organisms.

No one's arguing that the existence of an organism that is irreducibly complex is fundamentally impossible, just that no one has ever found an example of one. Feel free to keep looking, but you'll just be wasting your time.

You're running at the problem completely wrong - you've got a conclusion that you want to be true, so you're trying to find ways to prove it with evidence. If you were actually intellectually honest and scientific you would be looking at the evidence that you see in nature and deriving your conclusion from that. But unfortunately that approach doesn't support your religious ideology, so you don't want to do that. That's why I find creationists so funny, particularly those that play scientist and call themselves "Intelligent Designists" as if they were approaching the question of life's origins and development scientifically.
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14-12-2013, 07:11 PM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 09:00 AM)Chas Wrote:  What the fuck are you on about?

I've said about four times that I think serial endosymbiosis theory fixes i.c. right up, and just like when I have this conversation irl, everyone passed right by it without comment. O_o

I have to whine every now and then. It's fun.

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14-12-2013, 07:49 PM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 08:10 AM)Dom Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 07:45 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  If we can create it then in principle so can some other intellect. Unless it is proven we are the only intellect, non man made IC is plausible.

Heck yeah, the easter bunny could have created the universe. Tongue In your imagination, anything is possible. But still not plausible.

Or *we* could have. So much for IC "proving" BabbleGawd.

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14-12-2013, 09:49 PM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 07:11 PM)Cephalotus Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 09:00 AM)Chas Wrote:  What the fuck are you on about?

I've said about four times that I think serial endosymbiosis theory fixes i.c. right up, and just like when I have this conversation irl, everyone passed right by it without comment. O_o

I have to whine every now and then. It's fun.

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15-12-2013, 03:40 AM
RE: Irreducible complexity
(14-12-2013 07:49 PM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  
(14-12-2013 08:10 AM)Dom Wrote:  Heck yeah, the easter bunny could have created the universe. Tongue In your imagination, anything is possible. But still not plausible.

Or *we* could have. So much for IC "proving" BabbleGawd.

Even if non man made IC were found, or believed to be found, it wouldn't prove God.
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