Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
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06-01-2017, 08:33 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
(29-12-2016 12:07 AM)Disciple 21x Wrote:  Rocket: I have been a student of the Bible for the last three years. I have found no reason in the text itself to not accept evolution. The Bible merely claims God created the universe and everything in it. But it says nothing of His exact methods. I have also found that many Fundamentalist Christians don't even know what it is they claim to believe. For example they claim their most fundamental doctrines (Trinity, Immortal Soul,etc) come from the Bible. But an objective view of the text itself one can see the Bible makes no such claims. And that these views are more Platonic views and pagan beliefs woven into Christianity. But most fundamentalists either fail to realize this or refuse to do so. But thank you Rocket.

Sorry disciple. The Babble does too make claim as to exactly how God created the world and the universe and everything else. By speaking over a 7 day period. I don't believe it, but that is what it says.
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06-01-2017, 09:49 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
(28-12-2016 11:12 PM)Disciple 21x Wrote:  What I mean by that is instead of worshipping a cosmic being whose existence cannot be proven or even disproven (Much like a flatlander attempting to prove the existence of a space lander or debunk the existence thereof) you just merely worship science, technology, the laws of physics, or simply yourselves. Could you be doing this without even realizing it?

Actually, I don't worship anything. I merely utilize it. I find that the physical universe and its contents are considerably more useful than the Bible.

Quote:Yet {Dawkins} has no problem with a Darwinian multi-verse...

Evolution only applies to living organisms. It's inappropriate to apply it to non-living processes such as those described in physical cosmology, including the big bang.

Quote:... (which is infinity regressive not to mention must be very complicated by it's very nature)...

"Infinitely regressive" could actually exist, although I don't see why it would have to. Perhaps the whole thing started from nothingness a billion universes ago, though, when a quantum fluctuation caused a single subatomic particle to pop briefly into existence for no particular reason, starting a chain reaction of "nothings" changing into "somethings" -- again, just because it could rather than because it had to.

I see the universe as being comprised of simple structures created and maintained by simple forces. It is intricate, and it is complex, but at a process level I wouldn't call it complicated.
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07-01-2017, 04:40 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
(06-01-2017 09:35 AM)Heath_Tierney Wrote:  
(01-01-2017 03:14 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:  Down here in Texas, where the creationists have been battling teaching of evolution in schools tooth and nail for decades, atheism is labelled a religion.

Sincere question here: Does it then follow that atheist "churches" or assemblies also enjoy tax-free status in TX?

Just by the sheerest accident, I ran across this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Texa...reethought

So the answer to you question is, there is 1 (one) atheist church officially in Texas and yes, they get the same tax breaks as any other church.

----

On May 18, 2006, the Texas State Comptroller's office granted tax-exempt status to the NTCOF as a result of actions taken by Americans United for Separation of Church and State, which had previously secured tax-exempt status for the Ethical Society of Austin.[6] This status had been previously denied to the NTCOF and other non-traditional churches because they did not profess "a belief in God, or gods, or a higher power."[7]

When I shake my ignore file, I can hear them buzzing!

Cheerful Charlie
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07-01-2017, 04:44 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
In order of questions: No, no, yes, no, no, no, and no.

Anything else I can help you with?
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07-01-2017, 04:57 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
(06-01-2017 08:20 PM)Logisch Wrote:  Evolution has zero doctrine regarding anything to do with a belief in god or lack in belief in god. Evolution discusses how species change over time. That's it. That's all there is to it. You're welcome to try and pull some "atheist teaching" out of that, but there's none to be had. It's neutral. Period. That's some seriously terrible logic.

By that logic we can also conclude that teaching geology is also atheistic as it doesn't include god, or lack of one, and therefore is religious, and geology should not be taught. Lava is now invalid, and no one can learn about lava, rock formations, etc, because it's religious now!

And gravity is also atheistic.

*sigh*

Just wow.

Long ago, when Creationism became a big issue, and the ICR was formed, a number of scientists objected to scientific creationism on those very grounds. If because of the Bible, we had to stop teaching evolution is schools, we had to likewise abandon modern geology, astronomy and anything else that contradicted the Bible.

There was an incident bak in the 80's where at an ICR convention, a bunch of Biblical geocentrists came and complained that geocentrism was not taken seriously by scientific creationism, despite being failrly explicitly found in the OT.


Google geocentrism if you have a strong stomach. Some of them are still around and kicking.

When I shake my ignore file, I can hear them buzzing!

Cheerful Charlie
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07-01-2017, 04:58 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
(28-12-2016 11:12 PM)Disciple 21x Wrote:  Is atheism just a religion of nonreligion? What I mean is are atheists especially ones in this forum just trying to proselytize people into atheism?

I will only answer your first question.

No. Atheism is not a religion. One needs to understand that this is an atheist forum. Theist come here. We don't go there.

There is no bother trying to convert people. What happens is an idiot theist says something stupid and has it answered with the correct scientific information.

This is not proselytising.

Go and read the responses from guys like Rocket and Goodwithoutgod. They write amazing posts showing this info'. It's educational. The theists just post stupid crap. Look at Popsthebuilder. Total nutcase with no grip on reality.

He's worse than I, and I have the worst chemo brain I've ever seen.

If they don't want to come here they can stay away.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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07-01-2017, 08:41 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
If atheism is a religion, it's the only true religion. This is my standard answer to the theists who insist atheism is a religion.

When I shake my ignore file, I can hear them buzzing!

Cheerful Charlie
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08-01-2017, 01:15 AM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
... like bald is a hair-style, sure.
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08-01-2017, 10:57 AM (This post was last modified: 08-01-2017 11:01 AM by mordant.)
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
(07-01-2017 04:40 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:  
(06-01-2017 09:35 AM)Heath_Tierney Wrote:  Sincere question here: Does it then follow that atheist "churches" or assemblies also enjoy tax-free status in TX?

Just by the sheerest accident, I ran across this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Texa...reethought

So the answer to you question is, there is 1 (one) atheist church officially in Texas and yes, they get the same tax breaks as any other church.

----

On May 18, 2006, the Texas State Comptroller's office granted tax-exempt status to the NTCOF as a result of actions taken by Americans United for Separation of Church and State, which had previously secured tax-exempt status for the Ethical Society of Austin.[6] This status had been previously denied to the NTCOF and other non-traditional churches because they did not profess "a belief in God, or gods, or a higher power."[7]
Actually there is a so-called "atheist church movement" that originated in the UK and spread to the US. I regard it as a flash-in-the-pan phenomenon that is already past its prime. A number of branches exist. One was trying to form in Syracuse NY last I heard, a year or so ago, and I don't know if it was successful.

Even if I'm wrong about this movement having sustainable "legs", all it represents is an attempt by atheists to gin up some of the benefits of community and common cause that churches have traditionally provided. This is also promoted as "Atheism 2.0" by Alain DeBotton et al. The idea is, we've dispensed with the boring question of the existence of deities, now let's try to understand the itches that religion attempts to scratch and figure out our own mechanisms for providing those. For example, one of the things that religion characteristically uses is ritual. Ritual is a habitual focus on certain concepts and ideas which the ideology considers to be (1) important but (2) easily lost sight of. One can easily identify things like that quite apart from theism or religious faith that are useful to remind people of using ritual as a vehicle.

So ... that a secular group would form a social structure with some similarities to churches and that some of those people would be atheists who would (unwisely in my view) label it an "atheist church" still does not mean that atheism is a religion. Theists do not, after all, have an exclusive lock on muddled thinking or ill-conceived ideas.

Atheism is one thing and one thing only -- a negative belief position on one question: do any invisible deities exist. How some people choose to embellish that and confuse the general public's understanding of atheism is beside the point. That says way less about atheism than it does about the attention span and depth of thinking of the public, and their need to stereotype atheism as some mirror image of their own world.

Fortunately at least in this present time where atheists are invariably a small minority, usually within a society with powerful theistic institutions enjoying large, entrenched majorities, atheists do not tend by nature to be joiners and they understand the downsides of such kinds of organizations. The number of atheists who even join political action groups like the American Atheists are miniscule. Freethinkers in a majority social world of conformists, are just not going to feel the need, for the most part, to compete with theist social structures by replicating them.

Personally what I have done in this regard is to seek out secular or eclectic organizations that already exist such as the humanist association or the post-Christian UU congregations. These have the broader ideological base to actually put something together while still at least in theory being welcoming to / tolerant of atheist members. I have not found these to be useful to me personally, but I can see how some, particularly extroverts with greater social needs, would. But I would never try to build something like this just by and for atheists. Atheism is far too narrow to support it.
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15-01-2017, 02:48 PM
RE: Is Atheism just another religion under guise of "non-religion"?
We end up with a semantic problem that many of today's atheists regard as logic.

One so called atheist told me that it meant "Not a Theist".

Back in the 60s, when I decided I was an agnostic, it meant a person that believed the non-existence of any God.

Therefore it was a Belief that could not be proven even if there were/is no God.

But my dictionary had a stupid definition of agnostic back in the day. It said: "a person that believes it is impossible to know whether or not any God existed".

So by agnostic I simply mean that I do not know.

But atheism is a Belief about a negative.

psik

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