Is Jesus God?
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01-11-2012, 04:44 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(01-11-2012 03:42 PM)fstratzero Wrote:  Anyways whether or not jesus is god, a god, or a part of god doesn't really matter to me.

It's what your beliefs tell you to do that bothers me. The way a label hides extremism and become the cause by which destructive behaviors are justified.

The tool used by preachers, and creatures of their ilk to try and assert control over groups of people through sophistry.

When society learns how to tell truth from lies, we'll have a truly free society.

Guess when that's going to happen.
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01-11-2012, 04:59 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(01-11-2012 04:44 PM)The Theist Wrote:  
(01-11-2012 03:42 PM)fstratzero Wrote:  Anyways whether or not jesus is god, a god, or a part of god doesn't really matter to me.

It's what your beliefs tell you to do that bothers me. The way a label hides extremism and become the cause by which destructive behaviors are justified.

The tool used by preachers, and creatures of their ilk to try and assert control over groups of people through sophistry.

When society learns how to tell truth from lies, we'll have a truly free society.

Guess when that's going to happen.

That's hard to say, so I will not guess. Rather I will suspend my speculations.

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The atheist is a man who destroys the imaginary things which afflict the human race, and so leads men back to nature, to experience and to reason.
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01-11-2012, 05:06 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
What a box of trolls. Big Grin

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02-11-2012, 10:32 AM
RE: Is Jesus God?
Quote:It's not "very hypothetical".


Excuse me? Of course it is very hypothetical. There's absolutely not one stitch of evidence to support it. Everything said about it is assumed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q_source


Quote:It's the ONLY proposed explanation that answers the questions to date. Got a better one?

Fallacious reasoning. Just because I don't have a better explanation does not make the Q source factual.

Quote:Yes we do know that every word was "placed in his" mouth. It's the equivalent, but passive form, of saying he said something. It just puts another light on saying the SAME thing. If I write something about what you just said to me, and I quote you, I am "placing words in your mouth". It says nothing about whether I actually heard you correctly, or what you actually said. All it means is that I am *saying*, that's what I'm saying you said.

What the hell? Everybody and his brother knows that the term "putting words in his mouth" means to falsely quote the utterances of someone else. It doesn't mean what you are asserting at all.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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02-11-2012, 11:00 AM (This post was last modified: 02-11-2012 11:26 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Is Jesus God?
(02-11-2012 10:32 AM)Free Wrote:  
Quote:It's not "very hypothetical".


Excuse me? Of course it is very hypothetical. There's absolutely not one stitch of evidence to support it. Everything said about it is assumed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q_source


Quote:It's the ONLY proposed explanation that answers the questions to date. Got a better one?

Fallacious reasoning. Just because I don't have a better explanation does not make the Q source factual.

Quote:Yes we do know that every word was "placed in his" mouth. It's the equivalent, but passive form, of saying he said something. It just puts another light on saying the SAME thing. If I write something about what you just said to me, and I quote you, I am "placing words in your mouth". It says nothing about whether I actually heard you correctly, or what you actually said. All it means is that I am *saying*, that's what I'm saying you said.

What the hell? Everybody and his brother knows that the term "putting words in his mouth" means to falsely quote the utterances of someone else. It doesn't mean what you are asserting at all.
It is the best explanation for how things happened. A "hypothesis" is confirmed or refuted. There is NOT ONE piece of evidence refuting it. Got a better one ? There is NO legitimate scholar that questions it. If so, lets see it.

YOU have no better explanation. It remains the best explanation.

Your modern day idiom "putting" words in their mouth", and "literary" "placing words in their mouth" are NOT the same thing. You obviously are ignorant about literature in general, and ancient literature in particular. And BTW, the authors of the gospels were not eye-witnesses. ANYTHING they wrote, "placed words in his mouth" as they picked and chose what stories to use, and what to "have him say". So YES. They did "put words in his mouth".

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Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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03-11-2012, 04:21 AM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(01-11-2012 03:35 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(01-11-2012 03:31 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  I take the "reputation" arguments back. I can see now why The Theist's reputation is suffering.

I wasn't trying to be insulting, The Theist... I'd actually like to see Bucky Ball grow as a person and become more rational. I'm aiming for constructive criticism... and I don't see that in your post.

That's mighty patronizing. You need to provide examples as well. I specifically answered you. You are making a generally patronizing comment. YOU are no better than anyone here, or more "grown up" than anyone else here. I told you once before, if I need any advice, I'll be sure and ask.
People who are incapable of seeing themselves as flawed are also incapable of asking for advice.

I don't have to be "better than you" to see problems with your logic. In respect to understanding logical argument, I do indeed think I'm better than you. Why? Because I've learned from past mistakes and used them to improve my method.

I'm sure I sound patronizing because I feel like I'm talking to a child. You're throwing a tantrum because I suggested that your reasoning was imperfect. We all make mistakes. Get over it. Part of being "grown up" is accepting responsibility.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
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03-11-2012, 06:33 AM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(03-11-2012 04:21 AM)Starcrash Wrote:  
(01-11-2012 03:35 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  That's mighty patronizing. You need to provide examples as well. I specifically answered you. You are making a generally patronizing comment. YOU are no better than anyone here, or more "grown up" than anyone else here. I told you once before, if I need any advice, I'll be sure and ask.
People who are incapable of seeing themselves as flawed are also incapable of asking for advice.

I don't have to be "better than you" to see problems with your logic. In respect to understanding logical argument, I do indeed think I'm better than you. Why? Because I've learned from past mistakes and used them to improve my method.

I'm sure I sound patronizing because I feel like I'm talking to a child. You're throwing a tantrum because I suggested that your reasoning was imperfect. We all make mistakes. Get over it. Part of being "grown up" is accepting responsibility.
1. You've never met me, oh "gets-off-on-lecturing one". I am flawed, as everyone else. I just don't get off on lecturing everyone else on how flawed they are, and feeling self-righteous and all superior about it.
2. I didn't say I didn't need to or or ask for advice. I ask for it when and if I want, and certainly NOT from those who feel the need to constantly dish it out, unsolicited.
3. I used to be afraid of you. No longer. YOU made an error in logic in criticizing me here, and YOU have not accepted that, or addressed that. The communities of scholars is not Argumentum ad populum. Argumentum ad populum would be EVERYONE'S opinion, scholar or not. The fact The Theist has a bizarre view that he developed completely on his own, and as a result on having NO interaction with what might have been his peers, to help adjust him, and give HIM advice, is why went he went off the rails, and is EXACTLY the opposite of "argumentum ad populum". My argument is an Appeal to Authority, AND it's the correct use of that argument, because my view IS the view of the accepted experts on this matter. So not only have you dished out unsolicited advice, you got the label wrong on the argument.
4. Not only have YOU NOT addressed the criticism I made of YOUR flawed argument, now your rant has taken on a life of it's own.
5. Have a good day.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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03-11-2012, 08:23 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(02-11-2012 11:00 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(02-11-2012 10:32 AM)Free Wrote:  Excuse me? Of course it is very hypothetical. There's absolutely not one stitch of evidence to support it. Everything said about it is assumed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q_source



Fallacious reasoning. Just because I don't have a better explanation does not make the Q source factual.


What the hell? Everybody and his brother knows that the term "putting words in his mouth" means to falsely quote the utterances of someone else. It doesn't mean what you are asserting at all.
It is the best explanation for how things happened. A "hypothesis" is confirmed or refuted. There is NOT ONE piece of evidence refuting it. Got a better one ? There is NO legitimate scholar that questions it. If so, lets see it.

YOU have no better explanation. It remains the best explanation.

Your modern day idiom "putting" words in their mouth", and "literary" "placing words in their mouth" are NOT the same thing. You obviously are ignorant about literature in general, and ancient literature in particular. And BTW, the authors of the gospels were not eye-witnesses. ANYTHING they wrote, "placed words in his mouth" as they picked and chose what stories to use, and what to "have him say". So YES. They did "put words in his mouth".



Uh-huh.

When I first engaged with you I expected you to employ yourself with reason. Unfortunately, you are not fulfilling your obligation to that employment position.

YOU ARE FIRED!

Drinking Beverage

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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03-11-2012, 08:35 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(03-11-2012 08:23 PM)Free Wrote:  
(02-11-2012 11:00 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  It is the best explanation for how things happened. A "hypothesis" is confirmed or refuted. There is NOT ONE piece of evidence refuting it. Got a better one ? There is NO legitimate scholar that questions it. If so, lets see it.

YOU have no better explanation. It remains the best explanation.

Your modern day idiom "putting" words in their mouth", and "literary" "placing words in their mouth" are NOT the same thing. You obviously are ignorant about literature in general, and ancient literature in particular. And BTW, the authors of the gospels were not eye-witnesses. ANYTHING they wrote, "placed words in his mouth" as they picked and chose what stories to use, and what to "have him say". So YES. They did "put words in his mouth".



Uh-huh.

When I first engaged with you I expected you to employ yourself with reason. Unfortunately, you are not fulfilling your obligation to that employment position.

YOU ARE FIRED!

Drinking Beverage
Sorry. You fire no one around here, jerk. You're gonna have to do a LOT better than that.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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