Is Jesus God?
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30-10-2012, 09:51 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 09:48 PM)SomeOne Wrote:  Is there an argument here to debate or this was just some preaching?

Everything is up for debate, just like everything is up for ridicule.
Feel free to try, it's outta my league for both.

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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30-10-2012, 09:54 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 09:48 PM)SomeOne Wrote:  Is there an argument here to debate or this was just some preaching?

The theist position tends to lean almost exclusively towards Jesus as God, the atheist rightfully see that as a contradiction. It's a response to The Skeptic's Annotated Bible, Is Jesus God? The Bible and myself, side with the atheists. Jesus isn't God.
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30-10-2012, 09:57 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 09:48 PM)SomeOne Wrote:  Is there an argument here to debate or this was just some preaching?

Add a dash of copy-paste in there. These and other posts by TheTheist are from his blog site where he first posted it. I colored it in with 'Sorry, page no longer available'.

I like to call it a Drive-by Sermon.

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30-10-2012, 09:58 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 09:51 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(30-10-2012 09:48 PM)SomeOne Wrote:  Is there an argument here to debate or this was just some preaching?

Everything is up for debate, just like everything is up for ridicule.
Feel free to try, it's outta my league for both.

The stuff I write isn't anything special. I have known children and mentally handicapped people who have no problem with it. Anyone can easily learn it.
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30-10-2012, 10:01 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 09:54 PM)The Theist Wrote:  
(30-10-2012 09:48 PM)SomeOne Wrote:  Is there an argument here to debate or this was just some preaching?

The theist position tends to lean almost exclusively towards Jesus as God, the atheist rightfully see that as a contradiction. It's a response to The Skeptic's Annotated Bible, Is Jesus God? The Bible and myself, side with the atheists. Jesus isn't God.

Now I think I get your point, but when you say
Quote:The Bible and myself, side with the atheists. Jesus isn't God.
you are not entirely "sided" with atheist in this case since you just don't believe Jesus is God, and on the other side atheists dont even believe that Jesus (if ever existed) had any kind of "super-human powers".

if your faith can move mountains it should be able to withstand criticism
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30-10-2012, 10:06 PM (This post was last modified: 30-10-2012 11:27 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Is Jesus God?
100 % Circular Argument : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_reasoning
No Bible quote proves anything about any Bible concept.
The authority of the Bible must be established a priori.
That has not been established.

Etymological Fallacy re words :god and Jehovah
Fallacy of Equivocation.
Post is Argumentum Verbosium.
Fallacy of the Suppressed Corelative.
Ignoratio elenchi Fallacy
Onus probandi Fallacy
Petitio principii Fallacy
Chery picking Bible texts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%...ger_effect
What The-Conflicted-Gay-Theist is suffering from.

(30-10-2012 08:44 PM)The Theist Wrote:  "A god is anything that anyone attributes might or venerates."

False. Betrays utter lack of education on the subject. Redefinition of the term.


(30-10-2012 08:44 PM)The Theist Wrote:  " The Bible calls Moses, Jesus, the judges of Israel, Tammuz - all mortal men who are called gods. It also calls angels, including Satan and Michael as gods. Also pagan Gods like Dagon, Molech, Baal, Bel, Astarte. Carved idols."

False. Not one reference, either in English, Greek, Hebrew or Archaic (Biblical Hebrew). Fallacy of the False Premise. Argument from Ignorance. There were hierarchies of divine beings both in Hebrew culture, and Babylonian culture, where El Elyon, and Yahweh came from. Moses was a Prophet, not a divine being.
In the hierarchy of divine beings they in no way approached equality to Yahweh. Saying someone is a "divine" being is not saying that person is a "god".
The angels were servants or messengers, or ministers of the god, (Micha-el. Rapha-el), and were not gods.

"I will surely multiply thy seed, and it shall not be numbered for multitude. Behold thou art with child, and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ishma-el, for the Lord hath hearkened to thy humiliation. He shall be a wild man, his hands against all, and the hands of all against him, and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren" [Gen. 16:1-16]. Clearly, Ishma-el is NOT a god, or a divine being, and has a name with "el" in it.

This is simply nonsense on the part of this delusional poster.

(30-10-2012 08:44 PM)The Theist Wrote:  Atheists don't agree because they are influenced by the apostate and uninformed teachings of Christianity

False. No proof. No poll. Speculation. No data. Delusional.

(30-10-2012 08:44 PM)The Theist Wrote:  the very definition of atheism is a belief that there are no gods, and if anything, whether or not it exists, can be a god, that makes their position sort of silly and obviously influenced by the inaccurate teachings of modern day Christianity.

False. Dismissal of claims is no further assertion of anything. Common street level of knowledge only of a-theism.

(30-10-2012 08:44 PM)The Theist Wrote:  The very Hebrew word translated god is El and various forms of El (Elohim for example, applied to Jehovah, men and pagan gods and goddesses) which means simply "mighty" or "strong one." It is a similar title as Lord, which usually signifies authority over something or someone. Land lord, for example. God father.

False The use of the word "El" was a "devotional"/"relational" name, and PLACES, such as Beth-El, and even the NATION of Isra-EL meant they had a "relationship", not that they WERE the god, "El". More evidence of ignorance of this field.

Scripture scholarship has come a long way since this ancient person read all these ancient books.
Argument from Authority Fallacy. Has not demonstrated the quoted texts rest in the majority opinion of their day, or today.

Total cut and paste job.

There is no god. Therefore dead Jeebus could not be a god.

Try harder The-Conflicted-Gay-Theist
Another "F" grade for you, sonny.
Keep this up, and you will flunk out of Bible Beltery 101, and not get your Boy Scout merit badge in Bible.

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30-10-2012, 10:13 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 10:01 PM)SomeOne Wrote:  
(30-10-2012 09:54 PM)The Theist Wrote:  The theist position tends to lean almost exclusively towards Jesus as God, the atheist rightfully see that as a contradiction. It's a response to The Skeptic's Annotated Bible, Is Jesus God? The Bible and myself, side with the atheists. Jesus isn't God.

Now I think I get your point, but when you say
Quote:The Bible and myself, side with the atheists. Jesus isn't God.
you are not entirely "sided" with atheist in this case since you just don't believe Jesus is God, and on the other side atheists dont even believe that Jesus (if ever existed) had any kind of "super-human powers".


I'm going to play devil's advocate here... but technically, people can have the same stance on a subject without being a believer or non-believer. You could be a theist and not believe in jesus, or believe jesus is god.... as much as an atheist can not believe in jesus or believe he isn't god. It doesn't make you an atheist specifically, to not believe he is god, since a theist can have a different view on "what a god is" perhaps.. or perhaps a different take on the bible. So I think what he's saying is his stance on the subject is similar.

Although I think saying "the same stance as atheists" would be more eloquently put as instead, "I hold a non-traditional view of jesus"... since it's a lot of word play and I don't understand the point of trying to say, "Hey I'm on your side, sorta!" unless there is an underlying agenda.
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30-10-2012, 11:19 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
If you've going to make statements of fact -- and you've made a lot of them -- please cite them. Otherwise, why should we believe them?

Yes, this goes for our own statements of fact, too (I'm looking at you, Bucky Ball) but unless it's common knowledge, we need to see where it comes from so we know that you're not either making it up or pulling it from a source with a motivation to mislead.

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30-10-2012, 11:28 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 11:19 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  If you've going to make statements of fact -- and you've made a lot of them -- please cite them. Otherwise, why should we believe them?

Yes, this goes for our own statements of fact, too (I'm looking at you, Bucky Ball) but unless it's common knowledge, we need to see where it comes from so we know that you're not either making it up or pulling it from a source with a motivation to mislead.

What do you want supported ?

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Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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30-10-2012, 11:56 PM
RE: Is Jesus God?
(30-10-2012 11:28 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(30-10-2012 11:19 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  If you've going to make statements of fact -- and you've made a lot of them -- please cite them. Otherwise, why should we believe them?

Yes, this goes for our own statements of fact, too (I'm looking at you, Bucky Ball) but unless it's common knowledge, we need to see where it comes from so we know that you're not either making it up or pulling it from a source with a motivation to mislead.

What do you want supported ?

I meant in general, not for any specific reference made here. The general rule is that if something isn't common knowledge, generally accepted fact, or your own thoughts it needs citation.

But you're not going to believe or learn from that unless I give you examples. Iin your last post you listed several fallacies that I've never heard of (and I assume The Theist is not familiar with) and gave no explanation of how they were applicable or what they were. How do you expect those to be avoided in the future unless you take those steps? It's the same with your claim of "common street level of knowledge only of a-theism"... why would you expect that to change unless you educate him on what exactly he mistook about atheism?

Statements such as "there were hierarchies of divine beings both in Hebrew culture, and Babylonian culture, where El Elyon, and Yahweh came from" needs citation just as much and his claims to the contrary do.

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