Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
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27-08-2012, 11:32 AM
Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
Let's suppose that after you die, scientists are somehow able to create a computer simulation of your brain, as it was in your final moments. A simulation with the accuracy down to the atomic level.

Would the simulation actually be you or just a copy?

And if you think it would be a copy; why would it just be a copy?


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Epicurus Wrote:Death means nothing to us...when we exist, death is not yet present, and when death is present, then we do not exist.
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27-08-2012, 11:39 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
I... I don't know Sad

I can't even begin to answer this and it's been bugging me from quite some time

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27-08-2012, 11:43 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
(27-08-2012 11:39 AM)nach_in Wrote:  I... I don't know Sad

I can't even begin to answer this and it's been bugging me from quite some time

It's a copy. Problem solved. Dodgy
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27-08-2012, 11:45 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
(27-08-2012 11:43 AM)Red Celt Wrote:  
(27-08-2012 11:39 AM)nach_in Wrote:  I... I don't know Sad

I can't even begin to answer this and it's been bugging me from quite some time

It's a copy. Problem solved. Dodgy

but would it be a continuation of my conciousness or not? and if not, how can we prove it? because the copy would say it is, but maybe it isn't... it's a conundrum!

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27-08-2012, 11:49 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
(27-08-2012 11:45 AM)nach_in Wrote:  
(27-08-2012 11:43 AM)Red Celt Wrote:  It's a copy. Problem solved. Dodgy

but would it be a continuation of my conciousness or not? and if not, how can we prove it? because the copy would say it is, but maybe it isn't... it's a conundrum!

It would be a continuation of your consciousness, but it wouldn't be "you"; it would be a copy of you. The copy would seem like you to everyone else... but it wouldn't be the original.

A more-favoured thought experiment involves Star Trek. Each time the teleporter is used, the original person is destroyed and a copy is produced. But it's not the same person. Smile Let that idea play around with your consciousness when you next watch an episode.
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27-08-2012, 11:52 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
As much as I am a sufficiently complex simulation of a sponge. Once a bunch of numbers like me is acted on by the environment, it becomes a different bunch of numbers. No big. Angel

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27-08-2012, 11:54 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
(27-08-2012 11:49 AM)Red Celt Wrote:  
(27-08-2012 11:45 AM)nach_in Wrote:  but would it be a continuation of my conciousness or not? and if not, how can we prove it? because the copy would say it is, but maybe it isn't... it's a conundrum!

It would be a continuation of your consciousness, but it wouldn't be "you"; it would be a copy of you. The copy would seem like you to everyone else... but it wouldn't be the original.

A more-favoured thought experiment involves Star Trek. Each time the teleporter is used, the original person is destroyed and a copy is produced. But it's not the same person. Smile Let that idea play around with your consciousness when you next watch an episode.

but... uhhh... the important question is, do I die? because continuing being alive is a somewhat important thing for me, so I'd like not to die for now...

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27-08-2012, 11:58 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
(27-08-2012 11:54 AM)nach_in Wrote:  but... uhhh... the important question is, do I die? because continuing being alive is a somewhat important thing for me, so I'd like not to die for now...

Yes, you die. A copy of you lives, so (to everyone else) you remain alive... but, is that any more comforting to you, that an identical copy of you is alive when you aren't?
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27-08-2012, 11:59 AM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
(27-08-2012 11:45 AM)nach_in Wrote:  
(27-08-2012 11:43 AM)Red Celt Wrote:  It's a copy. Problem solved. Dodgy

but would it be a continuation of my conciousness or not? and if not, how can we prove it? because the copy would say it is, but maybe it isn't... it's a conundrum!

Depends. It is not likely that a testing model could be invented, which would meet ethical standards, which could get the system maker advanced enough to test absolute "identicalness", as both the copy, and a real consciousness would, if running, instantly diverge. Assuming a copy could be made...if a system is running 1 copy, and the one it was copied from is dead, then until a second copy is made, or a second system boots up the copy, (in which case there might be two), it is you, if one copy runs. If two copies are begun simultaneously, (exactly), then "you" are two, etc, and there is no longer 1 "you". You would have to re-name each copy, as a sufficiently complex model, would mean they would instantly become non-identical. You could, hypothetically, *decide*, which "you" to copy, (later), if one of the "yous" decided to do that. Control of the copied "you" would be a problem.

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Isaiah 45:7 "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things" (KJV)

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27-08-2012, 02:21 PM
RE: Is a sufficiently complex simulation of you....you?
I think we're going to need Bishadi to be able to answer this. It's pretty complex. Consider

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