Is agnosticism even a religion?
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06-09-2012, 09:23 PM
Is agnosticism even a religion?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIKeC9k2-Jg

In this video she explains that agnosticism actually isn't a religion. Is she right?
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06-09-2012, 09:30 PM
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
Atheism is not a religion, it's the complete absence of any religion, watch this clip of Bill Maher I think it will explain it to you easily. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A41WZBcmnfc
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06-09-2012, 10:34 PM
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
Run - did you watch the video link that you posted ?

She didn't explain what you thought she explained. Maybe you posted the wrong link ?
The link I watched simply explained the relationship between atheism and agnosticism.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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06-09-2012, 10:46 PM (This post was last modified: 07-09-2012 08:49 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
The video is confused. "A"-anything is "absence", NOT a positive assertion. A-theism is ABSENCE of Theism. "Absence" of Theism/Deism is a
"default", neutral position. Asymptomatic is absence of symptoms.
If something is "a"-symmetrical, it lacks symmetry. I'm not making a further assertion about what it actually looks like. I'm saying what it DOESN'T look like.

Atheism, in its basic form, is not a belief; it is the absence of belief. An atheist is not primarily a person who believes that a god does not exist; rather, he rejects belief in gods. She/he dismisses positive assertions about god(s). Absence of belief is not belief of absence.

Some dictionaries quibble, about narrow and broad definitions.
The "narrow definition" is often confused with the "broad definition".
Most atheists hold the broad definition.

Some theists like to pretend the word has only their narrow definition.

Dismissing an assertion, ("there is a 1957 Chevy orbiting Pluto"), is not a belief system.
It's just a dismissal. It's the position that the concept is dismissed, and further consideration of the notion does not merit further discussion, or consideration
It asserts nothing further, after the dismissal.

Actually, she asserts HER definitions, as she understands them, and essentially says everyone else is wrong if they don't agree. People mean many different things when they say words. It's helpful if they they tend to mean the same things. But there is no absolute requirement that we fit in (her) little definitions.

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06-09-2012, 11:47 PM
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
I believe she is right. I believe people say they are Agnostic is to seem more friendly to theists. You either worship God or do not. There is no, I don't believe and worship your God but I won't "deny it". To me it unfortunately makes no sense.

It is either you believe and worship a particular being or deity or you do not. I don't see a real in between. Its a simple yes or no answer.

"Mankind must put an end to war, or war will put an end to mankind." -John F Kennedy

The way to see by Faith is to shut the eye of Reason.” -Benjamin Franklin

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07-09-2012, 02:10 AM
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
Agnosticism partains to knowledge. Agnosticism means that you do not know whether or not there is a God. It is not a religion, no. Christianity is a religion. Islam is a religion. Agnosticism just means "I don't know, but I'm open to whatever possibility may arise".

Through profound pain comes profound knowledge.
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07-09-2012, 08:09 AM
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
Hey, Shiruba.

Fortunately there is no need for you to see a middle. We Agnostics will simply live there happily Cool

And I'm not an Agnostic to be friendly. I'm an Agnostic because I'm a logical human being Cool

We're here!
We're Agnostic!
Upon your terminology, run a diagnostic!

Yeah, we're still working on our chant... Drinking Beverage

Hey, Run.

Agnosticism isn't a creed. It's a method.

Some people simply think it's about not having knowledge. They're entitled to their opinion and I'm entitled to disagree.

Hey, Bucky.

Word up on the narrow definitions.

Do you like the Weak Atheist, Strong Atheist dichotomy, or do you think there is another term for people who don't simply lack belief, but make positive statements as well?

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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07-09-2012, 08:37 AM
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
(07-09-2012 08:09 AM)Ghost Wrote:  Some people simply think it's about not having knowledge. They're entitled to their opinion and I'm entitled to disagree.

Established definitions are not a matter of opinion.

With all due respect (and I mean that sincerely), agnostics - at least those I've encountered - don't have a full grasp on what it means to be an agonstic (or even an atheist, for that matter). I too once identified heavily as an agnostic, and people kept telling me that I did so because I hadn't thought the whole thing through. Vehemently, I disagreed.

Well, to my dismay, they were correct. If you look up the definition of Agnosticism, you'll find that it is as I have described it. It partains to knowledge. Atheism (or Theism, for that matter) partains to belief. Knowledge and belief are two different things. That is why many atheists, myself included, identify as "agnostic atheists". When it comes to what we know; we don't know if God exists or not. Currently, we can't know. Perhaps one day we'll be able to, but for now, we simply do not know. As per the definition of Agnosticism.

When it comes to belief, though, we do not believe in the existence of God. That's not to say that we believe he doesn't exist, because that would enter the realm of knowledge, and we don't know. We're agnostic about God. But we while we don't believe that he doesn't exist; instead, we don't believe that he *does*.

This was once said to me when I was in your position, so I'm going to say it to you as well: you may want to check your definitions a bit. It's not a matter of opinion; it's a matter of what a word means, as well as what it doesn't mean.

Through profound pain comes profound knowledge.
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07-09-2012, 08:54 AM (This post was last modified: 07-09-2012 12:27 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
(06-09-2012 11:47 PM)ShirubaDangan Wrote:  I believe she is right. I believe people say they are Agnostic is to seem more friendly to theists. You either worship God or do not. There is no, I don't believe and worship your God but I won't "deny it". To me it unfortunately makes no sense.

It is either you believe and worship a particular being or deity or you do not. I don't see a real in between. Its a simple yes or no answer.

Actually this is not the traditional definition of Agnosticism. You have a right to define it however you choose. However, the traditional definition, at least in part, includes the concept that whether or not there is a god is not "knowable". Agnosticism says it is not possible to know.

The traditional definition is not about the content of belief, but the ABILITY to know.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism

Agnosticism says it is not POSSIBLE to know, or not know.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein Certified Ancient Astronaut Theorist
Political skeptic .. if there is a bad reason something bad might have happened, you can bet your ass, that's why it happened.
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07-09-2012, 09:22 AM
RE: Is agnosticism even a religion?
Hey, Misanthrope.

What you're saying is in fact the definition of Agnostic... if one ignores all of the other definitions of the word.

Thomas Henry Huxley. Agnosticism is a method, not an end result. One cannot be Agnostic "about" something; in our view. One is simply an Agnostic because of the vigorous application of the Agnostic method.

I have a very firm grasp of what it means to be an Agnostic. It's just that some people dismiss what I have to say. They're entitled, but their opinion has absolutely no bearing on who I am or what I believe.

For the record, I'm not dismissing your definition of the word. I am simply taking the position that there is another definition (that the word is polysemous) and that I am best defined using that definition.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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