Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
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09-12-2015, 04:33 PM
Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
I need help getting my thoughts together for a conversation i'm going to have to have in a few days.

X is a friend of mine, a pastor, and fun to banter with. I admire his tenacity in that he never gives up trying to convert me. X recently introduced me to Kim, a lady that graduated out of the local faith based homeless shelter where he volunteers at. He wanted me to hear her story, her miracle story. I love listening to christians tell their stories, most especially "the moment" part. That moment in every christians story where they "just knew" it was god, that there is no other explanation for what happened, and thats when they became christians.

My problem with Kim's story, well, one of the problems, is the fact that she became a christian after she had a child. Three years prior, she'd had a child, and when it was just a few months old, it had died. At this point, Kim became an atheist, blaming god for the death, even though she was a believer before the child was born. Five years later, she became pregnant again, and had a child, and the child looked identical to the first child that had died. It was upon this recognition that she became a christian once again.

Can you help me form my thoughts on why childbirth is no reason to believe in god? I've searched and searched for articles dedicated to this topic, but I keep coming up empty handed.

Thanks.
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09-12-2015, 04:49 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
Welcome to TTA.

It's an obvious non sequitur ... perhaps not obvious to someone who wants to find an excuse for believing.

I wonder why Kim classified herself as an atheist ... one has to believe in a god to apportion blame to it. Right?

It's an unpleasant line of thinking but would Kim call herself an atheist again if her second child also died?

I think there might be some deficiency in her reasoning skills. It seems emotional rather than rational.

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09-12-2015, 04:49 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
Hahaha! Hahaha! If anything childbirth is proof enough there is no god.

You can't be an atheist and hate god. That just makes you an angry christian, nit an atheist. As for the babies looking alike.....genetics.
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09-12-2015, 04:53 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
If the child looked the same as the first then why not become Buddhist?

To anyone who has witnessed childbirth (I was with my ex wife for all 3 of ours), it is an amazing awe inspiring, terrifying, messy event that although leaves you holding a precious person leaves you in no doubt that there is nothing godly in the process.

My first born got stuck and was born using venteuse, bless her she is still known 18 years later as my baby smurf. My son and second born was breached and his mum required emergency cesarian. My youngest thankfully had no issues but the older 2 we nearly lost.

So no, it is very much of nature and biology and subject to the elements. No god here!!
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09-12-2015, 04:55 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
Just think how many babies are born every day. It's not a fucking miracle. And i haven't heard any rave reviews about how pleasant and enjoyable childbirth is either.

A man should not believe in an ism, he should believe in himself. -Ferris Bueller

That's what a ship is, you know. It's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs but what a ship is... what the Black Pearl really is... is freedom. -Jack Sparrow
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09-12-2015, 05:00 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
No. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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09-12-2015, 05:44 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
If god gave her the second child, why did he/she allow the first child to die? If anything the birth of #2 should have strengthened her atheism.
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09-12-2015, 06:02 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
Have they even seen what a vagina looks like?

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09-12-2015, 06:18 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
If god is involved in childbirth then this god also participates in millions of spontaneous abortions (miscarriages) each year. Almost half of pregnancies are miscarried, many happen when the woman isn't even aware she's pregnant.

Also if god is the reason for childbirth then he's a total asshole. If I were a great and powerful god running things I'd come up with a better way for babies to come into this world.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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09-12-2015, 06:28 PM
RE: Is childbirth a reason to believe in god?
(09-12-2015 06:18 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  If god is involved in childbirth then this god also participates in millions of spontaneous abortions (miscarriages) each year. Almost half of pregnancies are miscarried, many happen when the woman isn't even aware she's pregnant.

Also if god is the reason for childbirth then he's a total asshole. If I were a great and powerful god running things I'd come up with a better way for babies to come into this world.

Nuh-uh. No

Sex is under Satan's purview and childbirth is under God's. There's a big gray area in between that's hands-off for both of them.
They don't want to step on each other's dicks. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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