Is human life sacred?
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13-03-2012, 12:19 PM
RE: Is human life sacred?
Actually, I love nature.

Animals kill for food. In most (not all) cases it is done as fast and painless as possible.

Exceptions are young animals learning how to kill for food, and house cats who still have the instinct but not the necessity.

Humans are the only animal that treats other animals with extreme cruelty despite being aware these fellow creaturs have the exact same physical pain and anguish as we do.

And back to the empathy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empathy

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13-03-2012, 02:10 PM
RE: Is human life sacred?
(13-03-2012 12:19 PM)Dom Wrote:  Actually, I love nature.

Animals kill for food. In most (not all) cases it is done as fast and painless as possible.

Exceptions are young animals learning how to kill for food, and house cats who still have the instinct but not the necessity.

Humans are the only animal that treats other animals with extreme cruelty despite being aware these fellow creaturs have the exact same physical pain and anguish as we do.

And back to the empathy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empathy

I am well aware what empathy is, and most animals have it as well.

Animals do not kill just for food at all. Animals kill when they feel threatened, when something has dared stepped on where it has pissed, or kill because it naturally aggressive. Nature is not as simple as, "I am hungry, therefore I will kill another animal."

Humans kill more animals for food than for any other activity. This includes recreation and deforestation.

I view animal abuse as wrong. Mistreating an animal is not right. However, killing it for food at a farm is perfectly fine. Nature is not a cute, peaceful, cuddly place.




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13-03-2012, 05:21 PM
RE: Is human life sacred?
(13-03-2012 08:48 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(13-03-2012 08:41 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(13-03-2012 08:20 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  It is asking whether or not you consider humans to be special among other thing.

The most special thing in the known universe is Gwyneth Paltrow; but in thus saying, the hidden variable is I. Thus, a duality and not unique. Wink

Never did I say that it was the most special thing. I simply said it was a remarkable thing.

The least special thing in the universe is the organic over the inorganic and for me, the beginning of morality. A chemical count, morality, for decision making in organics, I'm thinking. Cell does something, chemical tells cell "do again" or "fuck no." Rather than remember the names of the streets from here to San Francisco; at every corner, right or wrong. Simple memory, the beginning of the count.

Between the two, what is sacred? My Gwynnies. More precious that the universe that contains her for the simple reason she's made of "do again." Absolutely. Big Grin

Between me and you lies a black cat named Mofo, the twenty thousand mites that groom my eyelashes; a entire ecology. Humans cannot live but for the non-human symbiotes they contain. Therefore it makes sense to begin the count at two, I and my environment; being I is judging my environment. And so it begins.

Should not end, what I say. One God? Yeah, Gwyneth for me; you can have Ashley Greene. ;P

More specifically, the Gwyneth from 2000-2001 that I loved once in 2005 and forevermore. Seven billion of us could actually love a Gwynnie in such a manner where the only limit is the judgement of I. Who else limits god? Sure as fuck not an atheist. Big Grin

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13-03-2012, 05:49 PM
RE: Is human life sacred?
Well I can only answer this from my point of view Confused

My life to me is sacred...... I know of nothing else. Through reflections of bad experiences, morally wise I wouldnt want these things to happen to other living things. So in that lesson I see and try to treat everything as sacred.

On a bigger scale the universe does not revolve around this planet...... the universe was here long before we came along......and when our sun finally croaks it this planet shall become cold and possibly uninhabitable unless we evolve somehow or start mooching about other planetary systems.

If you have had a very hard life..... if instead of breaking the cycle of "negativity" you decide to continue it and repeat the "bad" because its all you have had the oppurtunity to know.... if you have a very sour outlook on yourself and life in general or even if you are simply having a bad day then I imagine life is not sacred...... It could become tiresome or even a burden.

So my answer is like many philosophical questions.......... paradoxal. Life is just as sacred as it isnt.....it is also neither.

For no matter how much I use these symbols, to describe symptoms of my existence.
You are your own emphasis.
So I say nothing.

-Bemore.
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14-03-2012, 08:32 AM
RE: Is human life sacred?
(13-03-2012 05:21 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(13-03-2012 08:48 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(13-03-2012 08:41 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(13-03-2012 08:20 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  It is asking whether or not you consider humans to be special among other thing.

The most special thing in the known universe is Gwyneth Paltrow; but in thus saying, the hidden variable is I. Thus, a duality and not unique. Wink

Never did I say that it was the most special thing. I simply said it was a remarkable thing.

The least special thing in the universe is the organic over the inorganic and for me, the beginning of morality. A chemical count, morality, for decision making in organics, I'm thinking. Cell does something, chemical tells cell "do again" or "fuck no." Rather than remember the names of the streets from here to San Francisco; at every corner, right or wrong. Simple memory, the beginning of the count.

Between the two, what is sacred? My Gwynnies. More precious that the universe that contains her for the simple reason she's made of "do again." Absolutely. Big Grin

Between me and you lies a black cat named Mofo, the twenty thousand mites that groom my eyelashes; a entire ecology. Humans cannot live but for the non-human symbiotes they contain. Therefore it makes sense to begin the count at two, I and my environment; being I is judging my environment. And so it begins.

Should not end, what I say. One God? Yeah, Gwyneth for me; you can have Ashley Greene. ;P

More specifically, the Gwyneth from 2000-2001 that I loved once in 2005 and forevermore. Seven billion of us could actually love a Gwynnie in such a manner where the only limit is the judgement of I. Who else limits god? Sure as fuck not an atheist. Big Grin

I see what you are getting at, though I respectfully disagree.

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14-03-2012, 05:55 PM
RE: Is human life sacred?
(14-03-2012 08:32 AM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(13-03-2012 05:21 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  The least special thing in the universe is the organic over the inorganic and for me, the beginning of morality. ...

I see what you are getting at, though I respectfully disagree.

Damn Human Logic, I'm impressed. Don't think I've seen anyone pick up the words of the prophet so quickly. Can you be John the Baptist to HoC's Jesus now? I grow weary of it and I think there's a beheading coming I'd rather avoid. Big Grin

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15-03-2012, 09:41 PM (This post was last modified: 15-03-2012 09:45 PM by Thomas.)
RE: Is human life sacred?
If you allow me I will indulge in a logical argument for the case that humans are secular animals, nothing more, nothing less.

The Loins chase a herd of Zebra. The slowest and youngest is singled out, caught and eaten alive. Its life was short, brutal and ended before it could know much of life. The unfortunate Zebra was not at fault in any way. It did not choose to be born at this time and was not responsible for the genes that made it slower than the others its age. We all know this story in the animal kingdom and accept nature as non-moral. We do not condemn the Lions for their actions. We do not consider them moral agents capable of understanding morality, right from wrong. We also do not claim them as understanding a creator or what the creator deemed sacred. If we believe that all life is sacred we must act now to stop the slaughter of innocent animals even by other animals who do not know better. We would not stand by as someone beat a human child to death then attempted to eat them on the spot, especially a lion.
All life then is not sacred. We consider human life as different from the rest of the animal kingdom. So we easily conclude that nonhuman animal life cannot be claimed a sacred or we would have to react the same way as when humans are mistreated or killed for food. We base this morality on religious teaching exclusively. God has declared human life special and the animal kingdom is there for man to exploit. Sacrificing innocent animals is common place in the Old Testament. There are many tribes of humans today that survive almost exclusively in animal protein.
I will argue very plainly that the scared status of human is exclusively a human ego driven creation coupled with religious doctrine that consistently places humans as a special existence in the universe. This belief is simply not true. Human life is claimed sacred, yet killing in war can be argued as just. No human has ever been held accountable for killing during war if they followed the rules of war. One human killing another human then is not immoral or illegal by any culture in some cases. This is paradoxical. Is human life sacred or not? War is simply humans killing humans with no more moral consideration than lions killing zebras. Logically, human life then is no more sacred then zebra life if the killing is within some rule we accept.
As God does not exist (we made him up) what God deems sacred is nothing more than our own invention. Invent a God then invent morals from a God. What if the zebra were to speak and ask for political asylum from the tyranny of the lions? Would we consider it a valid claim? Are they not worthy of mercy?
The conclusion is clear that there is nothing sacred outside of human claims.
If humans claim human life is sacred then all life must be sacred on the same grounds, just as the zebra would if it could make such a claim.
I do not argue that the rights of humans should now be extended to all animals as some animal rights proponents do, rather I reject the claim of human life being sacred or special in any way. The great human rights philosopher John Locke based his theories of human rights on divine command. Locke’s theories on human rights are the foundation for the US Constitution’s Bill of Rights. I claim he was wrong, and profoundly so. The entire basis of rights is dismissed when the divine is eliminated. We have no right to claim a special place in the universe.
35 million cows are slaughtered annually in the US for protein for human consumption. Once the divine command of sacredness for humans is removed the difference between us and cows is IQ score. Who would stand for 35 million humans being slaughtered annually for food for human consumption? Would that be justified? Not if you believe God made humans special. But if he didn’t, and he didn’t, what stops the 7 billion humans from killing and eating 35 million humans? Utilitarian ethics may be comfortable with this especially in the context of 35 million cows being slaughtered now and if considering humans as no more sacred than cows. Now let’s point out that the antonym for sacred is secular.

William Lane Craig and other Theologist are correct when they make the claim that without a God nothing is sacred. This is why the religious fear atheism so much and probably why so many religious leaders seem completely irrational in their arguments for the existence of God. They are afraid of what humans will do to humans if there is no God to set a moral agenda.

We have woken from our religious slumber and thrown away the core belief in the sacred nature of humankind.
Now we must deal with it.
We are the gods now.

Thanks for reading.

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.
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15-03-2012, 09:49 PM
RE: Is human life sacred?
Quote:We have woken from our religious slumber and thrown away the core belief in the sacred nature of humankind.
Now we must deal with it.
We are the gods now.


Said the Serpent to Eve.

How life could have been had she refused to believe in talking snakes.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of Calvinism is that good Atheists do nothing." ~Eric Oh My
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15-03-2012, 09:58 PM
RE: Is human life sacred?
(15-03-2012 09:49 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
Quote:We have woken from our religious slumber and thrown away the core belief in the sacred nature of humankind.
Now we must deal with it.
We are the gods now.


Said the Serpent to Eve.

How life could have been had she refused to believe in talking snakes.

I swear it wasn't an apple, it was some magic shrooms, that's where the talking snake story came from, I'm sure

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15-03-2012, 10:21 PM (This post was last modified: 15-03-2012 10:28 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Is human life sacred?
(15-03-2012 09:41 PM)Thomas Wrote:  We are the gods now.

We always were.

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