Poll: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
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Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
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22-03-2012, 06:31 PM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
(22-03-2012 02:45 PM)TarzanSmith Wrote:  Although I agree that a lot of religion is indoctrination, I would also argue that so is many aspects of society. Sports, nationalism, politics and many others are mostly based on indoctrination or the more popular term is peer pressure.

A popular website I go on (funnyjunk) has a rival (9gag) and a very popular joke is that " I have never seen 9gag or met anyone from 9gag, all I know is that I hate them"

The main thing I think is that humans are not rational by nature preferring emotion over reason. It's why we have the line " it's not what you know but who you know". And this is not a religious trait, I have found many atheists who are just as ignorant as Christians. Atheists just seem smarter because the people who are doing the thinking for them happen to be scientists instead of theologians. Not to say that scientists are in any way smarter than the theologians, its just easier for someone to comment on one than the other. In the sense that being of by a fraction in math means a question is wrong but in English (a much softer science) your answer being slightly different can still be right.

Both sides are just regurgitating the arguments of their current head of belief.

A joke I made up is that "an atheist is a skeptic because someone else tells him he is" (I tried to have a christian counterpart to that joke it being "and a christian is good because someone tells him he is good" but it lacked the irony of the first so i dropped it. it just makes the joke more biased.)

I'm a 9gager, we don't hate you, we hate 4chan, we should join forces Tongue

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22-03-2012, 07:54 PM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
Look up Gregory S. Paul's research:

http://gspaulscienceofreligion.com/

The evidence suggests that people hold religious beliefs as superficial opinions which they lose interest in when they grow up in secure conditions, like in most developed democratic countries. The U.S. lags behind for complicated reasons, mainly because we lack social democracy, Paul argues. Yet our consumerism has done a lot of to erode religious belief regardless; look at all the people who buy beer and junk food and watch sports on Sunday instead of going to church. This pretty much blows up all the pseudo-explanations for religion like "god genes," "god parts of the brain," existential anxieties and so forth.

Regarding the last, Paul said on a talk show a couple years back that the French die like everyone else, but a majority of the French population by now lacks religious belief, partly because they have universal health coverage.
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22-03-2012, 08:42 PM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
(22-03-2012 07:54 PM)advancedatheist Wrote:  Look up Gregory S. Paul's research:

http://gspaulscienceofreligion.com/

The evidence suggests that people hold religious beliefs as superficial opinions which they lose interest in when they grow up in secure conditions, like in most developed democratic countries. The U.S. lags behind for complicated reasons, mainly because we lack social democracy, Paul argues. Yet our consumerism has done a lot of to erode religious belief regardless; look at all the people who buy beer and junk food and watch sports on Sunday instead of going to church. This pretty much blows up all the pseudo-explanations for religion like "god genes," "god parts of the brain," existential anxieties and so forth.

Regarding the last, Paul said on a talk show a couple years back that the French die like everyone else, but a majority of the French population by now lacks religious belief, partly because they have universal health coverage.

lol, I wonder if that's why they don't want that kind of health coverage in the States. Probably not... at least not on the surface, but it's funny.

I'm wondering if it's schools also. How are the private schools in France? They are all over the place in the States.

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23-03-2012, 12:21 AM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
Quote:I'm a 9gager, we don't hate you, we hate 4chan, we should join forces
sorry but funnyjunk and 4chan have reconciled our differences by finding common ground in our hatred of 9gag

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23-03-2012, 12:37 AM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
(23-03-2012 12:21 AM)TarzanSmith Wrote:  
Quote:I'm a 9gager, we don't hate you, we hate 4chan, we should join forces
sorry but funnyjunk and 4chan have reconciled our differences by finding common ground in our hatred of 9gag

it's funny because 4chan hates us because they tried to take us down and couldn't Tongue
Doesn't matter, we should all unite, there are bigger causes for idle people Big Grin

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23-03-2012, 03:20 AM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
I think indoctrination is a huge tool in the arsenal but really anyone without critical thinking can be won over.

I would say it's a lack of counter indoctrination that has really lent itself well to religion.
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25-03-2012, 09:42 PM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
I think there are a few different things that keep religion alive, well, and misleading. Indoctrination has to be high on the lists of culprits. Ignorance and lack of answers of course plays a huge role for inventing stories and reasons to explain the unknown and unseen. I can see how our emotional side could also yearn for a religion (fear of death, wanting to be with loved ones after death, wanting to be taken care of in this chaotic life, etc... )
This topic makes me think of the cargo cults.


I really don't know if we will ever be free of religion. While we are learning more and more about our world and there is less "room" for a god to fit in the gaps, it seems as though humans have always sought out religion in some way. Religion is always evolving, sprouting new religions while others fizzle out.
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26-03-2012, 12:46 AM
RE: Is indoctrination THE reason religion is so strong today?
I stopped to visit on old family friend last week who is a nun, in a very wealthy religious order. They know their days are numbered, as there are no new young women joining. The feeling I got there was like the PD James' book, "The Children of Men", closing down the insitutions, cuz no one was having a baby. (Don't start with the nuns having babies stuff.. Tongue ). Very real, and kind of shocking. Religion, in this part of the world, among educated young people seems to be on the way out. I know I can't generalize from one anecdotal incident, but things are NOT the same as 50 years ago. That CNN guy, John Allen Greene wrote "The Future Church". It's full of tons of interesting, and unexpected demographic and trend data about church stuff.

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