Is it OK to have sex with kids?
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14-10-2011, 07:38 AM (This post was last modified: 14-10-2011 07:44 AM by Peterkin.)
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
Quote:Hughsie:
I think that in a perfect world you would judge an appropriate to have sex on a case by case basis. However, we don't live in a perfect world and such a system wouldn't be feasible.

The question wasn't what is but what should be. Must we wait for a perfect world to use common sense and empathy?

Quote: NotSoVacuous:
Correct me if I am wrong but it seems as if you are trying to say it is okay for post puberty children, despite their adolescence, should be allowed to have intercourse. There are repercussions to sex, children are not able to support children they have. Simple as that. I think sex should go hand in hand with the ability to support a child.

I said the cases should be judged individually. Where the consenting post-pubescents are both equally capable of guilt or are both innocent, and are properly educated.... so neither std's nor babies should be an issue.
Besides, you can prohibit sex between teenagers, but you can't prevent it. So, what's to be gained by punishing them after the fact?

Quote: Lady Jane:
Even if a person, a child, at 17 thinks or says they want sex, they are too immature to understand everything the act encompases. It is NOT ok. It is the responsibility of the adult to recognize this and make the correct judgement NOT to do it.

If the 17-year-old "child" is a girl and the 18-year-old "adult" is a boy - he is supposed to be more mature? Even if the girl makes all the moves, the "man" is responsible?

Quote: banjofrog:
"Adults with kids is absolutely, unquestionably NOT okay."

Can you explain why? Or is this just another arbitrary, emotive moral conclusion. Is it wrong to be gay? Is it wrong the wear red shoes?

I thought i did explain, but here you go again:
Because pre-pubescent children have no understanding of sex and no physical desire (They might be curious what all the fuss is about, and if two six-year-olds play doctor behind the garage, no harm is done). A grownup who desires a physically immature child ought to get help asap.
Sex, like every other human transaction, should be undertaken only by equals. It's wrong to exploit anyone with less power than oneself.
If that's arbitrary and emotive, oh well, it's my moral conclusion.
Gay and red don't signify, and i wish you wouldn't drag in extraneous material.


Okay, we keep our pampered North American middle-class offspring infantile much longer than any previous or other culture. We say they should not be allowed to do this or that, but we have neither physical nor moral control over them. We seem to consider everybody under 18 total nincompoops (which suddenly, magically changes at the stroke of midnight!) who can't be trusted with their own bodies - but keep them in at close quarters in mixed herds largely controlled by peer-pressure, let them run around loose in cars and with money, recruit them for future military service (at 14 and 15, even!) hire them to prepare and serve food.
We give them a crappy, disjointed, piecemeal education and subject them to our own schizophrenic views on sexuality: Aunt Prue swatting them with a rolled-up Hustler whenever they touch the body parts that a constant stream of advertisement tells them to decorate, show off, covet and swathe in scent, while a constant stream of games and entertainments show them scantily-clad, sexually overdeveloped avatars committing violent acts. WTF?

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14-10-2011, 08:15 AM
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
(14-10-2011 07:38 AM)Peterkin Wrote:  
Quote: NotSoVacuous:
Correct me if I am wrong but it seems as if you are trying to say it is okay for post puberty children, despite their adolescence, should be allowed to have intercourse. There are repercussions to sex, children are not able to support children they have. Simple as that. I think sex should go hand in hand with the ability to support a child.

I said the cases should be judged individually. Where the consenting post-pubescents are both equally capable of guilt or are both innocent, and are properly educated.... so neither std's nor babies should be an issue.
Besides, you can prohibit sex between teenagers, but you can't prevent it. So, what's to be gained by punishing them after the fact?

Although I agree with this method, it would be too hard to implement for individuals. Besides, despite being educated doesn't stop the fact accidents can happen. At the age of 16-17 and even 18 accidents like that can ruin lives. And over what? Sex? They have their whole life ahead of them. 10 minutes in the sack over lust a few times a week isn't worth social and financial distraught.

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14-10-2011, 09:00 AM
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
Sure is easy to pick out the parents vs the non-parents in this thread.

Tell you what, instead of giving my two cents, I'll leave it to you guys. Just so you know though, touch my daughters and expect to meet a bullet. Probably in the groin.

And Pete, I just got a great new scope on my deer rifle if you wanna borrow it.

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14-10-2011, 10:11 AM
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
Yeah, Stark, the problem is that you do not need to know what your daughter is doing. She sure is not gonna come home and tell you about her sex life, basically, if she want it, she will have it. It is up to you to be a good parent and to teach her about some stuff before she does anything you wouldn't like. I do not talk like a parent or non-parent, I am telling you my second-hand experience, stories that I have heard directly from girls (now women) who had sex really young, before 16. Those things are real, that is happening around you, like it or not, I'm just a messenger.

Is it OK to have sex with kids?
- If you put it that plainly, NO, it is not, and it is punishable by law.

Do kids do it, nonetheless?
- Every day.

What can you do?
- Almost nothing, only educate them in time.

Do every kid who had sex under 16 years feel bad about it?
- No. Some do, some don't, it all depends on million different tings. Can not be generalized.

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14-10-2011, 10:28 AM
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
Actually, yes, I do need to know what my daughter is doing. I may NOT know everything, but that doesn't mean I shouldn't. And by the way, my daughter DOES talk about sex with me, in fact, quite openly, since that's the type of family we are. This whole idea that parents don't have a clue what their kids are doing is absurd. I grew up in a household where I could talk to my parents, and I did. I do my best to create the same type of environment for my kids.

When you say that I can do next to nothing it doesn't make me concerned about what will happen with my kids, it makes me concerned about what will happen with yours.

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14-10-2011, 11:28 AM
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
I kinda agree with Filox. In society we seem to think that any pair of 14 year olds who get together will instantly regret it and live guilt-ridden lives. That isn't the case. In England half the population have lost their virginity by the age of 15 (I know some people who lost it at 12) and it didn't ruin the lives or cause any other of the overly dramatic consequences that we seem to assume it will. I'm not saying I think that we should encourage underage sex or allow sex with older people or anything, I just think if two people are of a similar age and truly feel ready then we should leave them to it. Maybe they will regret it but that's the risk we take with most decisions in life. Personally I think we ascribe too much in the way of emotional connotations to sex. We act like people should feel dirty for having sex outside of relationships. Why? What is wrong with two people going into the situation knowing the score just looking for fun?

@Peterkin

If you tried to have a system whereby you judge whether people are ready for sex on a case by case system then I guarantee you that 99.9% of paedophiles would walk free every time. It is not a feasible setup under our current legal system.

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14-10-2011, 12:52 PM (This post was last modified: 14-10-2011 01:16 PM by Peterkin.)
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
(14-10-2011 09:00 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  And Pete, I just got a great new scope on my deer rifle if you wanna borrow it.

I don't think deer pose a problem. Parents do. Commercial interests do.
It's easy to forbid and threaten; hard to get a handle on your child's environment. Hard to treat our kids like individual human beings, each with hir own maturation rate; easy to treat them like prized possessions. Easy to impose arbitrary strictures; hard to set an example they want to follow.
And i don't think violence is a solution.



(14-10-2011 11:28 AM)Hughsie Wrote:  @Peterkin

If you tried to have a system whereby you judge whether people are ready for sex on a case by case system then I guarantee you that 99.9% of paedophiles would walk free every time. It is not a feasible setup under our current legal system.

The law doesn't judge whether people are ready for sex. It sets an arbitrary age (different ages, even within the same country - that's how much we know) and everything outside that is illegal. In fact, when a sex crime is alleged, that case does have to be judged on its own merits, at each and every trial.
How the hell do you project anything about paedophiles and justice, from my refusal to shoot an over-eager teenaged daughter's besotted boyfriend?
The only consensual relationships about which we can make a blanket judgment are the hypothetical ones we don't actually know about. The particular ones we know about, we already judge case by case - we just don't all arrive at the same opinion.

Hypothetical question: If a 15-year-old boy rapes a 30-year-old woman, does she go to jail?

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14-10-2011, 01:28 PM
 
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
I can’t resist putting in my 2cents’ worth.

Sex is the most beautiful part of being human. If it involves two equally interested, motivated people who are in love, or only want to experiment, at any age. (That excludes dirty old men, pimps, rapists, any kind of exploiters.)

Hughsie is right, we often treat sex as something inherently dirty we want to protect our children from.

Capitalist society is treating sex both as dirty and as the most successful selling strategy. They manufacture “Do Me!” T-shirts for teenage girls and then scream at them if they wear it, while pocketing the money it brought in.

When young people start feeling horny, they are ready to experiment. I remember, I was.

Of course, there is a risk. There is a risk in everything: when crossing a street, when learning to drive, when volunteering for the army.

Yes, young girls can get pregnant. Yes, it can cause problems. It can cause problems at any age, if there is no social support group available.

If our daughter got pregnant at 16 (we knew she did have a pregnancy test) then we would have helped her raise the baby, while she continued going to school, and we would have had the joy of a new baby in our household. Our mother would have helped, so would our neighbours.

No tragedy, no shame, no dirt, no throwing her out on the street with her infant. No shooting the boyfriend either.

Pregnancy did not happen until much later and that was OK too.
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14-10-2011, 03:01 PM
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
I think there is a misunderstanding brewing. It seems that many are conflating "it is not ok to have sex with kids" as "kids should never have sex." I think the real issue is adult & kid having sex. I would hope most here would see what's wrong with that. Kids will have sex regardless, but it is our job to educate them. It is wrong for us to engage in it with them though.

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14-10-2011, 03:24 PM
RE: Is it OK to have sex with kids?
(14-10-2011 12:52 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  
(14-10-2011 09:00 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  And Pete, I just got a great new scope on my deer rifle if you wanna borrow it.

I don't think deer pose a problem. Parents do. Commercial interests do.
It's easy to forbid and threaten; hard to get a handle on your child's environment. Hard to treat our kids like individual human beings, each with hir own maturation rate; easy to treat them like prized possessions. Easy to impose arbitrary strictures; hard to set an example they want to follow.
And i don't think violence is a solution.

Meant Lucradis, not you.

As for your post above, it seems that part was directed at me, so I will respond.

I don't forbid sex, nor do I threaten my kids. If you read my post I made it clear (or so I thought) that being open with your kids is how I see the solution to these issues.

As for the new scope; it's for any adult that tries to lay a finger on my kids. And no that's not macho grandstanding, it's a fact. If some pedophile so much as looks at my kids the wrong way, violence will be the answer whether anyone here thinks it's right or not. My #1 job as a parent is to protect my child, and only as a close second to teach them. As they get older, you can protect them less and teach them more.

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