Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
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03-05-2012, 09:04 AM (This post was last modified: 03-05-2012 09:24 AM by LadyJane.)
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
Oh my gosh! I just pictured bringing my 80 yr/old Grandpa to the clinic to be Euthanized on his birthday. Wow. Sad Sad. Birthdays would SUCK. No dancing the funky chicken on 80th birthdays Sad
Wait! It wouldn't be grandpa's, it would be my mom's at 60 when she retires. EVIL!
(03-05-2012 09:04 AM)germanyt Wrote:  [Image: ak-yall-niggas-postin-in-a-troll-thread....1272645256]
Too hard not to sometimes. Guilty!
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03-05-2012, 06:06 PM (This post was last modified: 03-05-2012 06:08 PM by mysticjbyrd.)
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
(03-05-2012 08:49 AM)robotworld Wrote:  Well, the main problem is too many people living on EARTH.

Solution: Colonise the Solar System, and create more planets. Alternatively open wormholes to "import" planets from other star systems. There, problem solved Wink

Another more rational and less insane option would be through education of course, campaigns which encourage birth control.
I was going to say the first 2 options were fantasy options, but the more I thought about it i had to conclude that they are all 3 fantasy options.

A serious child limit law might work, but simply telling teens or even adults to use birth control would accomplish nothing.



(03-05-2012 08:58 AM)LadyJane Wrote:  I would not want to be a part of a species that kills off its own kind in mass amounts who are unwilling. That is genocide. I would rather be a species who fights to support its life even if it's unsuccessful and dies out. Nothing is going to stop me from dying at the (hopefully) natural time I do, life just isn't forever.
That sounds nice, but when push comes to shove the primitive need and desire to survive will kick in.
That too is nothing but a cute fantasy.
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03-05-2012, 06:46 PM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
(03-05-2012 06:06 PM)mysticjbyrd Wrote:  
(03-05-2012 08:49 AM)robotworld Wrote:  Well, the main problem is too many people living on EARTH.

Solution: Colonise the Solar System, and create more planets. Alternatively open wormholes to "import" planets from other star systems. There, problem solved Wink

Another more rational and less insane option would be through education of course, campaigns which encourage birth control.
I was going to say the first 2 options were fantasy options, but the more I thought about it i had to conclude that they are all 3 fantasy options.

A serious child limit law might work, but simply telling teens or even adults to use birth control would accomplish nothing.



(03-05-2012 08:58 AM)LadyJane Wrote:  I would not want to be a part of a species that kills off its own kind in mass amounts who are unwilling. That is genocide. I would rather be a species who fights to support its life even if it's unsuccessful and dies out. Nothing is going to stop me from dying at the (hopefully) natural time I do, life just isn't forever.
That sounds nice, but when push comes to shove the primitive need and desire to survive will kick in.
That too is nothing but a cute fantasy.
OOOOHHH Marge we all gotta die to save mankind! Ohmy
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03-05-2012, 07:15 PM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
(03-05-2012 06:46 PM)Mr Woof Wrote:  OOOOHHH Marge we all gotta die to save mankind! Ohmy
You don't have to die, just stop having kids.

Child limit laws work.
China's population is about to skyrocket DOWN over the next few decades.
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05-05-2012, 09:29 AM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
Hey Mystic, time to put your money where your mouth is.

You think people in their 60s and 70s should be terminated? Well then, as the leader of the movement, YOU need to set the right example. Take the pledge right here and now for all of us to see: "If and when I reach my 70th decade, I pledge to kill myself for the sake of all humankind."

'Course we'll have to wait a while to see if you live up to the bargain or wimp out at the end. (For some reason I'm assuming you're currently on the young side.) But it should be a fun show. I'm putting my money on a change of heart when you near 60, but hey, I could be wrong. Maybe you'll surprise us and show us how a man of integrity follows through with his promises.

Religious disputes are like arguments in a madhouse over which inmate really is Napoleon.
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05-05-2012, 10:04 AM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
Just felt the need to point out that ageism is the same as racism or sexism.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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05-05-2012, 08:08 PM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
(05-05-2012 09:29 AM)cufflink Wrote:  Hey Mystic, time to put your money where your mouth is.

You think people in their 60s and 70s should be terminated? Well then, as the leader of the movement, YOU need to set the right example. Take the pledge right here and now for all of us to see: "If and when I reach my 70th decade, I pledge to kill myself for the sake of all humankind."

'Course we'll have to wait a while to see if you live up to the bargain or wimp out at the end. (For some reason I'm assuming you're currently on the young side.) But it should be a fun show. I'm putting my money on a change of heart when you near 60, but hey, I could be wrong. Maybe you'll surprise us and show us how a man of integrity follows through with his promises.
Yah its sort of like social security. People generally aren't going to pay into it willingly. You have to force them to play ball, this is no different.

I seriously doubt I will live it hit 70 actually.
So the pledge would have almost no meaning at all, not that it had much to begin with.
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05-05-2012, 08:13 PM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
Can I reply to this whole thread with one word?
Ok


Wut.

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05-05-2012, 08:17 PM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
(05-05-2012 08:13 PM)Cetaceaphile Wrote:  Can I reply to this whole thread with one word?
Ok


Wut.
Which is the more moral course of action.

Kill the elderly when they reach a certain age limit.
or
Allow an endless cycle of suffering caused by a lack of resources.
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05-05-2012, 09:36 PM
RE: Is it immoral to allow the elderly to live?
Hey, Jack.

Quote:Kill the elderly when they reach a certain age limit.
or
Allow an endless cycle of suffering caused by a lack of resources.

That, though, is a very specific frame. It frames the options as 1 - the proposal OR 2 - a terrible situation. It's like:
-Give up freedoms OR let the terrorists bomb us
-Ban all religious practice OR live in a theocracy
-Continue the occupation of Palestine OR watch Israel be destroyed
-Pass "tough on crime" legislation OR criminals will butcher your family
-Allow people to own every kind of weapon imaginable OR throw the constitution in the garbage and live in a police state

Framing is a POWERFUL rhetorical tool. It limits discourse and causes cognitive bias.

Generally speaking it's best to avoid dichotomies.

It's better to frame things as open ended questions.

For example. What do you think of the idea of euthanising (right here, a loaded term. It could just as easily been murder/kill/put out of their misery/mercy kill/making the tough call and putting down/sacrificing; they all colour the response) the elderly to the specific end of preserving resources?

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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