Is my brother spiritual?
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27-01-2014, 04:23 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
I like candles and soothing music. Not sure about the music, but the candles and fire in general seem to be something that tells us we're back at camp or home and safe. I think that even just having the flickering of a flame as an ambient source lets us drop our guard and relax.

Creating what seems to be a shrine might just be things that relax him. Perhaps he has anxiety or feels compelled by ritual, not for supernatural reasons, but for very real and measurable ones.
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27-01-2014, 04:57 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
He is doing the incantations to invoke the God woozxhanyahewamoomu

Seriously whats the problem ?

I have used hypnotherapy, NLP & Tarot as an atheist, with aromatherapy, weird music and candle lighting etc because these relax, can enhance creativity, evoke the senses and can be meditative or enhance mindful awareness.
Eg There are Buddhist practices which many be interpret as "spiritual" whilst Buddhism is generally considered atheistic.

A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence -
David Hume


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29-01-2014, 04:02 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
These people are hilarious.

I do the same thing. I asked a similar question a while back and was told that I had to drop the spiritual trappings in order to be considered an atheist but the people who told me that on another thread do not like me so perhaps they just were attacking everything I said at that point.

I have since started exploring something called Naturalistic Paganism and then there is also Pantheism, maybe he should look into them, I do not know, are there any religious symbols or tools on his altar?

Simply having an altar to me is spiritual but I believe you can be a spiritual atheist but again that is MY opinion.

Many times when you lose your faith in God, you do not automatically lose your love of ritual, church, celebration. That takes time to eliminate but I am not sure its healthy to do so, Life is such an adventure and we should explore and experience as much as we can so why not spirituality as well?

why should that be off limits to us?
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29-01-2014, 04:14 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
Every day when I get home I vacuum, check Facebook, and take my pants off. That's my method of unwinding after a shit day. Maybe the candles and music are what make him happy..nothing more, nothing less.

~Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned.~
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29-01-2014, 04:55 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
(29-01-2014 04:02 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  These people are hilarious.

I do the same thing. I asked a similar question a while back and was told that I had to drop the spiritual trappings in order to be considered an atheist but the people who told me that on another thread do not like me so perhaps they just were attacking everything I said at that point.

I have since started exploring something called Naturalistic Paganism and then there is also Pantheism, maybe he should look into them, I do not know, are there any religious symbols or tools on his altar?

Simply having an altar to me is spiritual but I believe you can be a spiritual atheist but again that is MY opinion.

Many times when you lose your faith in God, you do not automatically lose your love of ritual, church, celebration. That takes time to eliminate but I am not sure its healthy to do so, Life is such an adventure and we should explore and experience as much as we can so why not spirituality as well?

why should that be off limits to us?
I can't speak for anyone else, but the term "spirituality" means absolutely nothing to me; I couldn't tell you what it is if my life depended on it.

I can look up its definition in a dictionary to understand what the word means, sure, but I've never had an experience that could be called "spiritual."

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29-01-2014, 05:00 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
(29-01-2014 04:55 PM)Vosur Wrote:  
(29-01-2014 04:02 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  These people are hilarious.

I do the same thing. I asked a similar question a while back and was told that I had to drop the spiritual trappings in order to be considered an atheist but the people who told me that on another thread do not like me so perhaps they just were attacking everything I said at that point.

I have since started exploring something called Naturalistic Paganism and then there is also Pantheism, maybe he should look into them, I do not know, are there any religious symbols or tools on his altar?

Simply having an altar to me is spiritual but I believe you can be a spiritual atheist but again that is MY opinion.

Many times when you lose your faith in God, you do not automatically lose your love of ritual, church, celebration. That takes time to eliminate but I am not sure its healthy to do so, Life is such an adventure and we should explore and experience as much as we can so why not spirituality as well?

why should that be off limits to us?
I can't speak for anyone else, but the term "spirituality" means absolutely nothing to me; I couldn't tell you what it is if my life depended on it.

I can look up its definition in a dictionary to understand what the word means, sure, but I've never had an experience that could be called "spiritual."

I'm with you on that, Vosur. While I do have a working knowledge of what spirituality means in theory, it just seems to be a word used to describe something that feels good for no reason~much like theists would explain the feeling they get from the "holy ghost"~~but people with no god needed a word to describe that same feeling...if that makes any sense at all.

~Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned.~
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29-01-2014, 05:23 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
(29-01-2014 05:00 PM)kellyrm Wrote:  
(29-01-2014 04:55 PM)Vosur Wrote:  I can't speak for anyone else, but the term "spirituality" means absolutely nothing to me; I couldn't tell you what it is if my life depended on it.

I can look up its definition in a dictionary to understand what the word means, sure, but I've never had an experience that could be called "spiritual."

I'm with you on that, Vosur. While I do have a working knowledge of what spirituality means in theory, it just seems to be a word used to describe something that feels good for no reason~much like theists would explain the feeling they get from the "holy ghost"~~but people with no god needed a word to describe that same feeling...if that makes any sense at all.

You know....unless you are God yourself, You cannot know what a person besides yourself is feeling and experiencing, You also cant really know that its for no reason at all.

I think meditation and the results of it are very spiritual. I think just going into a trance state is a spiritual experience. Casting a spell/practicing Magic and having it work is a very spiritual experience to me. Receiving an instruction or a suggestion from your divination source (whether it be a psychological practice or not) and having the events confirmed is incredibly spiritual to me.

This-My way or the highway sort of thought is the thing that has chased me out of every religion including Satanism over the past few years, I just cannot stand it anymore, Christians think everyone who is not a believer in Jesus is a moron that is heading to hell, Satanists view everyone who is not like them as weak and stupid, Its really the same thing to me.

Atheists deny very real experiences because they are either labeled as spiritual or because they have not themselves had the experience.

Just words to think about, I need to fix notifications so I can move on from this site, I really have reached a point where I HATE religion, I hate debates, message boards and chat rooms do not do it for me any longer, sure, Id love to find a friend to discuss spirituality with or even practice but I have hit this place where I would be solitary and be left alone.

No book-Christian, Satanic or otherwise and certainly no person is going to tell me how to live my life or tell me that my experiences/practices are invalid because they have not had them.

This would be like a woman saying she has never had an orgasm so it must not be a real and measurable event. Yes, well, its not MY fault that you have not had an orgasm. Keep trying. or miss out. I do not care.
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29-01-2014, 05:29 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
(29-01-2014 05:23 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  
(29-01-2014 05:00 PM)kellyrm Wrote:  I'm with you on that, Vosur. While I do have a working knowledge of what spirituality means in theory, it just seems to be a word used to describe something that feels good for no reason~much like theists would explain the feeling they get from the "holy ghost"~~but people with no god needed a word to describe that same feeling...if that makes any sense at all.

You know....unless you are God yourself, You cannot know what a person besides yourself is feeling and experiencing, You also cant really know that its for no reason at all.

I think meditation and the results of it are very spiritual. I think just going into a trance state is a spiritual experience. Casting a spell/practicing Magic and having it work is a very spiritual experience to me. Receiving an instruction or a suggestion from your divination source (whether it be a psychological practice or not) and having the events confirmed is incredibly spiritual to me.

This-My way or the highway sort of thought is the thing that has chased me out of every religion including Satanism over the past few years, I just cannot stand it anymore, Christians think everyone who is not a believer in Jesus is a moron that is heading to hell, Satanists view everyone who is not like them as weak and stupid, Its really the same thing to me.

Atheists deny very real experiences because they are either labeled as spiritual or because they have not themselves had the experience.

Just words to think about, I need to fix notifications so I can move on from this site, I really have reached a point where I HATE religion, I hate debates, message boards and chat rooms do not do it for me any longer, sure, Id love to find a friend to discuss spirituality with or even practice but I have hit this place where I would be solitary and be left alone.

No book-Christian, Satanic or otherwise and certainly no person is going to tell me how to live my life or tell me that my experiences/practices are invalid because they have not had them.

This would be like a woman saying she has never had an orgasm so it must not be a real and measurable event. Yes, well, its not MY fault that you have not had an orgasm. Keep trying. or miss out. I do not care.

I wasn't speaking for everybody, not even close. But I have experienced what I assumed to be the holy ghost as well as love and a closeness with nature that can only be classified as a feeling for no reason...just a feeling. Sometimes I get a warm feeling, because it's hot outside...sometimes I get pissed off, because of an irritating outside source....and sometimes I get a "spiritual" relaxed feeling for no obvious source other than the mood feels good. So yes, I will call spirituality a feeling you get for no reason...just bc it's a good day, the mood is right, and it feels good. At the same time, your surroundings will determine when/if you get that feeling, so lighting candles, taking a bath, etc can be just as spiritual as meditation, nature, or yoga. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, I'm saying we all define it differently and experience that same feeling for different reasons.

~Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned.~
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29-01-2014, 05:31 PM
RE: Is my brother spiritual?
(29-01-2014 05:29 PM)kellyrm Wrote:  
(29-01-2014 05:23 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  You know....unless you are God yourself, You cannot know what a person besides yourself is feeling and experiencing, You also cant really know that its for no reason at all.

I think meditation and the results of it are very spiritual. I think just going into a trance state is a spiritual experience. Casting a spell/practicing Magic and having it work is a very spiritual experience to me. Receiving an instruction or a suggestion from your divination source (whether it be a psychological practice or not) and having the events confirmed is incredibly spiritual to me.

This-My way or the highway sort of thought is the thing that has chased me out of every religion including Satanism over the past few years, I just cannot stand it anymore, Christians think everyone who is not a believer in Jesus is a moron that is heading to hell, Satanists view everyone who is not like them as weak and stupid, Its really the same thing to me.

Atheists deny very real experiences because they are either labeled as spiritual or because they have not themselves had the experience.

Just words to think about, I need to fix notifications so I can move on from this site, I really have reached a point where I HATE religion, I hate debates, message boards and chat rooms do not do it for me any longer, sure, Id love to find a friend to discuss spirituality with or even practice but I have hit this place where I would be solitary and be left alone.

No book-Christian, Satanic or otherwise and certainly no person is going to tell me how to live my life or tell me that my experiences/practices are invalid because they have not had them.

This would be like a woman saying she has never had an orgasm so it must not be a real and measurable event. Yes, well, its not MY fault that you have not had an orgasm. Keep trying. or miss out. I do not care.

I wasn't speaking for everybody, not even close. But I have experienced what I assumed to be the holy ghost as well as love and a closeness with nature that can only be classified as a feeling for no reason...just a feeling. Sometimes I get a warm feeling, because it's hot outside...sometimes I get pissed off, because of an irritating outside source....and sometimes I get a "spiritual" relaxed feeling for no obvious source other than the mood feels good. So yes, I will call spirituality a feeling you get for no reason...just bc it's a good day, the mood is right, and it feels good. At the same time, your surroundings will determine when/if you get that feeling, so lighting candles, taking a bath, etc can be just as spiritual as meditation, nature, or yoga. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, I'm saying we all define it differently and experience that same feeling for different reasons.


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