Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
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11-11-2014, 01:42 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
(11-11-2014 12:48 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  Someone in an earlier post mentioned that Poe married his first cousin. As someone related to that family through marriage (my aunt was married to a Poe) I can tell you...they are messed up. Thats not a good case for first cousin marriage Tongue

But on the other hand, in small villages (several hundreds), everyone will inevitably be first or second cousins, simply due to the statistics of the matter. The sorts of population levels the vast majority of all of our ancestors would have been living with...

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11-11-2014, 02:30 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
(11-11-2014 12:48 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  Someone in an earlier post mentioned that Poe married his first cousin. As someone related to that family through marriage (my aunt was married to a Poe) I can tell you...they are messed up. Thats not a good case for first cousin marriage Tongue

No doubt. Even Darwin, for all his genius, was pretty messed up in regards to his views on relationships. The main point, however, was that most marriages in history have been between first cousins, and the idea of looking outside your relatively small community for romance is a very new concept made possible by a combination of industrialization creating a different demographic and modern medicine allowing for the successful breeding of otherwise incompatible people. The farther away from your family tree you stray, the more likely you are to need a caesarian section or some other kind of medical intervention if you want to survive giving birth to a slightly more genetically dissimilar baby.

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11-11-2014, 02:36 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
(11-11-2014 02:30 PM)yakherder Wrote:  
(11-11-2014 12:48 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  Someone in an earlier post mentioned that Poe married his first cousin. As someone related to that family through marriage (my aunt was married to a Poe) I can tell you...they are messed up. Thats not a good case for first cousin marriage Tongue

.... The farther away from your family tree you stray, the more likely you are to need a caesarian section or some other kind of medical intervention if you want to survive giving birth to a slightly more genetically dissimilar baby.

Oh yeah? I've never heard this before. Where did you find out about that? Smile
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11-11-2014, 02:44 PM (This post was last modified: 11-11-2014 02:56 PM by yakherder.)
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
(11-11-2014 02:36 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  
(11-11-2014 02:30 PM)yakherder Wrote:  .... The farther away from your family tree you stray, the more likely you are to need a caesarian section or some other kind of medical intervention if you want to survive giving birth to a slightly more genetically dissimilar baby.

Oh yeah? I've never heard this before. Where did you find out about that? Smile

To be honest I can't seem to find the original source, which was from a discussion I was having several years ago. As silly as this seems, "Cousin marriage" in Wikipedia is pretty informative, in particular the "biological aspects" sections on genetics and fertility.

I am not in any way trying to promote cousin marriage btw, or even imply that it has anything to do with the south, just being devil's advocate in a sense since it was brought up as a negative. The advantages of marrying close have become somewhat obsolete in the modern industrial world, but are still relevant in many parts of the undeveloped world. My ex-wife (rural Chinese) had first cousin parents. Maybe that's what was wrong :/ Jk... They were actually very good people.

Edit: Another reference that goes into it to some degree is a book I've mentioned before called Sex at Dawn. It's about sexual evolution as a whole, and I highly recommend it to anyone that wants to have a better understand not only of the cultural evolution of monogamy, but much of the reasoning as to why modern religion became so powerful. A lot of it stems from the concept of a woman's reproductive capacity as a scarce resource to be controlled, like any other resource on which civilization depends ranging from arable land to precious metals. Interesting stuff.

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11-11-2014, 02:51 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
(11-11-2014 02:44 PM)yakherder Wrote:  
(11-11-2014 02:36 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  Oh yeah? I've never heard this before. Where did you find out about that? Smile

To be honest I can't seem to find the original source, which was from a discussion I was having several years ago. As silly as this seems, "Cousin marriage" in Wikipedia is pretty informative, in particular the "biological aspects" sections on genetics and fertility.

I am not in any way trying to promote cousin marriage btw, or even imply that it has anything to do with the south, just being devil's advocate in a sense since it was brought up as a negative. The advantages of marrying close have become somewhat obsolete in the modern industrial world, but are still relevant in many parts of the undeveloped world. My ex-wife (rural Chinese) had first cousin parents. Maybe that's what was wrong :/ Jk... They were actually very good people.

I didn't think you were promoting it. But even if you were I wouldnt mind. I dont see anything wrong with letting first cousins marry each other. It's not something I would choose to do, but its not my place to tell anyone who they should marry.
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11-11-2014, 03:09 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
Your views on incest and cousin marriage shock me.

Ever heard of king Phillip the third of Spain? Or king Charles the Second of Spain? Or emperor Franz the first of Austria?

Well all of these monarchs had 2 things in common.

First, they were all the results of a long line of royal families keeping "bloodlines clean" by marrying their cousins with each other.

Second, they were all mentaly disabled.

Phillip the third of Spain managed to get a rebellion in the Netherlands out of control which subsequently declared their independence from the Spanish crown, he lost a war against France that resulted in Spanish terretory north of the Pyrenes being handed over to the French, he enterd his nation into the 30 years war which would show to be catastrophic for Spain and created a economic crisis which his successor hardly managed to control.

Charles the second of Spain was a full blown catastrophy. A man with the mind of a child who spent Spain into a financial crisis, a famine and who had the "curious hobby" of watching people being burned alive and tortured to death in various other ways. If you google him and take a look at his portraits you can see for yourself that he looked somewhat "special". In the end his wife and relatives were scared shitless of him and for some reason (probably medical) he couldnt produce any offspring. Which in the end lead to the death of his dynasty, the outbrake of the war of Spanish succession and a French Bourbon monarchy for Spain that exstits to this day.

And Franz? Well, he was the opposite of Charles. A cuddly "special" person, who enjoyed eating cake and being driven through villages throwing chocolate and sweets at peasants and getting drunk together with them. Yet his inability to manage the affairs of the state resulted in Austria losing 3 invasions by Napoleon and Metternich taking over the state who built a cruel, ruthless and brutal police state.

Long story short, any European will give you the example of European nobility as a showcase of what incest does to offsprings minds. Lessons to be seen by everyone in Europe since the 15th century.
And you Americans dont even need to know the history of European royal families to know that. Just watch the first 4 seasons of Game of Thrones.

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11-11-2014, 03:17 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
Southern mother
Southern born
Living in the south most of my life
Have never been a bigot
Not stupid or uneducated
Have all my teeth
Have never had sex with a sibling or cousin

TGAC ya'll can fuck right off

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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11-11-2014, 03:18 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
If I were to marry a cousin... I think I'd be bloody careful with contraceptives, is all. Other than that, I got no issue with it.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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11-11-2014, 03:20 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
(11-11-2014 03:09 PM)The Germans are coming Wrote:  Your views on incest and cousin marriage shock me.

Ever heard of king Phillip the third of Spain? Or king Charles the Second of Spain? Or emperor Franz the first of Austria?

Well all of these monarchs had 2 things in common.

First, they were all the results of a long line of royal families keeping "bloodlines clean" by marrying their cousins with each other.

Second, they were all mentaly disabled.

Phillip the third of Spain managed to get a rebellion in the Netherlands out of control which subsequently declared their independence from the Spanish crown, he lost a war against France that resulted in Spanish terretory north of the Pyrenes being handed over to the French, he enterd his nation into the 30 years war which would show to be catastrophic for Spain and created a economic crisis which his successor hardly managed to control.

Charles the second of Spain was a full blown catastrophy. A man with the mind of a child who spent Spain into a financial crisis, a famine and who had the "curious hobby" of watching people being burned alive and tortured to death in various other ways. If you google him and take a look at his portraits you can see for yourself that he looked somewhat "special". In the end his wife and relatives were scared shitless of him and for some reason (probably medical) he couldnt produce any offspring. Which in the end lead to the death of his dynasty, the outbrake of the war of Spanish succession and a French Bourbon monarchy for Spain that exstits to this day.

And Franz? Well, he was the opposite of Charles. A cuddly "special" person, who enjoyed eating cake and being driven through villages throwing chocolate and sweets at peasants and getting drunk together with them. Yet his inability to manage the affairs of the state resulted in Austria losing 3 invasions by Napoleon and Metternich taking over the state who built a cruel, ruthless and brutal police state.

Long story short, any European will give you the example of European nobility as a showcase of what incest does to offsprings minds. Lessons to be seen by everyone in Europe since the 15th century.
And you Americans dont even need to know the history of European royal families to know that. Just watch the first 4 seasons of Game of Thrones.

Yep. I know all about it. Still not my place to decide who gets married.

Where do you draw the line on who should be allowed to have children and who shouldnt. Mentally handicapped people who are related? How about not related? Does that mean that people with disabilities that dont effect them mentally shouldnt be allowed to marry either?

Nope. Thats not something I'm willing to do.
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11-11-2014, 03:24 PM
RE: Is there a single decent person below the Mason Dixon line?
That area is the epicenter of poor, uneducated, ignorant and clueless. Not to say there aren't of course some erudite, highly educated and insightful people living in the area as well...but a vast number......

"Belief is so often the death of reason" - Qyburn, Game of Thrones

"The Christian community continues to exist because the conclusions of the critical study of the Bible are largely withheld from them." -Hans Conzelmann (1915-1989)
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