Is this a real scam?
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06-09-2014, 05:29 PM
Is this a real scam?
I have heard that in places other than the US that people use a chip and pin credit card rather than just a magnetic swipe, and some people use their debit cards which require a pin. So it makes me think this is a possibility but I'm not sure.

Lots of smart people here with more knowledge than me.

What do you think?





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06-09-2014, 05:35 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
Based off some quick searches, it sounds like it is likely something that exists. Although not cheap.
http://shop.flir.com/dp/B00K0PXFB6

I suppose if you wanted to be tricky, pretend to push a bunch of other buttons before and after your pin.

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06-09-2014, 05:41 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
Now and days there's an app for everything so it would not surprise me.

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06-09-2014, 05:41 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
(06-09-2014 05:35 PM)Logisch Wrote:  Based off some quick searches, it sounds like it is likely something that exists. Although not cheap.
http://shop.flir.com/dp/B00K0PXFB6

I suppose if you wanted to be tricky, pretend to push a bunch of other buttons before and after your pin.

Euro cards have had this for a long time now. I have a euro card I got some ten years ago that is chipped.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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06-09-2014, 05:53 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
(06-09-2014 05:41 PM)Dom Wrote:  Euro cards have had this for a long time now. I have a euro card I got some ten years ago that is chipped.

Yeah, I know the cards have been available for a long time, I just didn't know if stealing the PIN in this way was a real possibility.


I guess if you spend $350 on the gadget Logish posted you could give it a try.

But after you have the PIN, then what can you do with it if you don't have the card number? You would still need to steal the card (or atleast the number) right?


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06-09-2014, 10:19 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
What I don't get is why the smart card isn't used in the U.S. I worked on drivers for reading and writing these, the encryption algorithms, and their use in secure apps.
I would have bet serious money that they would replace mag stripe cards with in 5 years.

That was in 1995. WTAF? Common in Canada, widespread in Europe, but in the U.S.? Noooooo.
Not in the land of stupid weights and measures, fat ass greedy businessmen, and crooked politicians.

They are why this shit is prevalent. Assholes, stupid fucking assholes. Dodgy

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06-09-2014, 10:44 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
(06-09-2014 10:19 PM)Chas Wrote:  What I don't get is why the smart card isn't used in the U.S. I worked on drivers for reading and writing these, the encryption algorithms, and their use in secure apps.
I would have bet serious money that they would replace mag stripe cards with in 5 years.

That was in 1995. WTAF? Common in Canada, widespread in Europe, but in the U.S.? Noooooo.
Not in the land of stupid weights and measures, fat ass greedy businessmen, and crooked politicians.

They are why this shit is prevalent. Assholes, stupid fucking assholes. Dodgy

Simple, because replacing all of the old mag readers with newer ones would have been too costly, and why should businesses bend over backwards to protect consumers? So much for the free market fixing this shit, somebody better not tell Lumi... Dodgy

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06-09-2014, 11:35 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
(06-09-2014 10:44 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Simple, because replacing all of the old mag readers with newer ones would have been too costly, and why should businesses bend over backwards to protect consumers? So much for the free market fixing this shit, somebody better not tell Lumi... Dodgy

Over here we got new readers pretty damn quick Consider Banks changed the cards, pretty much everyone wanted to pay by card rather than cash, and businesses started losing money *fast* if they didn't have the right facilities to make it happen.

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06-09-2014, 11:59 PM
RE: Is this a real scam?
(06-09-2014 11:35 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(06-09-2014 10:44 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Simple, because replacing all of the old mag readers with newer ones would have been too costly, and why should businesses bend over backwards to protect consumers? So much for the free market fixing this shit, somebody better not tell Lumi... Dodgy

Over here we got new readers pretty damn quick Consider Banks changed the cards, pretty much everyone wanted to pay by card rather than cash, and businesses started losing money *fast* if they didn't have the right facilities to make it happen.

Corporate momentum is not so easily changed. Unless there is a massive push, things won't change; and why they mostly have yet to change in this instance. While a bank or banks could unilaterally introduce new cards, what would that do? If they were chip only and no mag strip, then they simply wouldn't work anywhere; making the cards too inconvenient and leaving the bank out in the cold as consumers either opted for more convenient cards or jump to other banks. Everyone has to be ready to switch over within a relatively close amount of time, and nobody wants to eat the costs to do so when there isn't a huge public outcry for change. The public simply doesn't know how bad it is, how much better it can be; and those who should be advocating on behalf of citizens and consumers in the government are already bought and owned by the banking industry.

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07-09-2014, 05:17 AM
RE: Is this a real scam?
(06-09-2014 10:44 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(06-09-2014 10:19 PM)Chas Wrote:  What I don't get is why the smart card isn't used in the U.S. I worked on drivers for reading and writing these, the encryption algorithms, and their use in secure apps.
I would have bet serious money that they would replace mag stripe cards with in 5 years.

That was in 1995. WTAF? Common in Canada, widespread in Europe, but in the U.S.? Noooooo.
Not in the land of stupid weights and measures, fat ass greedy businessmen, and crooked politicians.

They are why this shit is prevalent. Assholes, stupid fucking assholes. Dodgy

Simple, because replacing all of the old mag readers with newer ones would have been too costly, and why should businesses bend over backwards to protect consumers? So much for the free market fixing this shit, somebody better not tell Lumi... Dodgy

Yabbut, it's costly to monitor all purchases and contact card holders every time an unusual purchase is made. I have had significant issues with this - like one time I took my staff to Vegas for a meeting, and when I charged the rooms the card issuer blocked my card because it might be fraud. I then had to get on the phone with them to straighten things out, which took forever. Meanwhile my staff, some of whom had long trips behind them, had to huddle in the lobby waiting. Not a good kick off for my meetings, and it cost the card issuer time and money to deal with it and me. In the past 5 years I have had to take up their time confirming purchases at least 20 times. This might not happen with people who always pay at the same gas station and restaurants and what have you, who have a predictable pattern. As soon as a card holder does something new, the issuers have incurred a cost. It makes no frigging sense.

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