"Jane, you ignorant slut!"
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26-09-2013, 09:00 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 07:39 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  Do you think truth is wholly facts and logic or may truth be felt or perceived otherwise?

Truth to me is something that can be shown to be true. The effects of gravity are mostly known and have been shown to be true. It is also true that I prefer vanilla ice cream over chocolate, and brunettes over blonds, and that is obviously a personal truth.

However, when we start talking about topics such as religion, politics, philosophy, etc. then the word "truth" becomes very muddied. Its at that point that I ignore any claims to truth, and view such claims as personal preference, not unlike my preference for vanilla though more involved.
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26-09-2013, 09:29 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 07:58 AM)Anjele Wrote:  
(26-09-2013 07:36 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  Good question. I don't come here for you to accept my beliefs. There are more open people elsewhere by far. I come here because here everything I say is challenged and I can discard more of the usual crap I hear from Christians and learn!

As for the occasional mention of Hell 1) I never have to mention it unless it's in response since atheists always play this card as indicative of something wrong with god's justice 2) I think it should be mentioned regardless if on a sporadic basis because a) it's real b) a caring person wouldn't shy away from talk about it that can assist you.

My point with regard to hell is that it is supposed to be something that is decided by your god's judgement. When a man says, 'you are going to go to hell because...fill in the blank', isn't that man placing himself in the position of god?

Or in other words...Judge not lest ye be judged.

Yes, and that's one reason Jesus was accused of blasphemy. By making statements like "If you reject me you suffer Hell" and "Today, you will be with me in Paradise" he equated himself with god.
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26-09-2013, 09:31 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 08:17 AM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  
(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  I was saying neither of those things. I was saying rather that many (not all) atheists show their lack of true spirituality and true, exalted knowledge by behaving like obnoxious jerks to people, and particularly when their houses of cards are toppled.

I come here to learn and I recognize the vast intellect of many atheists. However, every time there is a snot-nosed "evidence, PJ or STFO" rather than a calm "evidence?", I know:

1) The personal bitterness prompts the remark

2) The lack of confidence in one's untenable position prompts the remark

3) The Bible, that predicts this exact behavior from scoffers, is upheld again

To be honest, I have tons more I'd like to share by way of evidence, reason and personal conviction, but cannot because of my own biblical understanding that I should save the best pearls for the open, not closed-minded. "Digging your own grave" was never more true than here.

Behold, a typical post by PleaseJesus. It contains the usual statements:

1. Atheists lack some true, hidden, mysterious knowledge that he apparently has.
2. For some reason, he doesn't want to share this knowledge with us. He could, but he won't, despite persistently writing on this forum.
3. He is a saint and a martyr, and those who don't believe him are "obnoxious jerks."
4. The Bible predicted something obvious or ambiguous.
5. Those who don't believe in his message are doomed.

Now let me try to explain it to you. When I first came to this forum, I also thought that many members were harsh with you. However, I soon realized why it was so. It's because you're intellectually dishonest, arrogant, and downright annoying, because you constantly repeat the same assertions without proof. And when you are called out on it, you change the topic until you think the previous one is forgotten, and then the cycle re-starts again. And people dislike that. This has nothing to do with theism or atheism, it's a dishonest manner of debating.

As for why you're coming here, I don't know, but I knew people who would intentionally provoke trouble so they could claim themselves to be victims or martyrs of people who "don't understand them" or "hate them without a reason." I don't understand what motivates such a behavior, but it's clear that it happens. And I suspect that you act in a similar way. Your passive-aggressive, bullshitty stance proves that you're here to irritate people, and when you succeed, you pat yourself on the back, because that supposedly "proves" that atheists are afraid of your "truth." You're a joke. Go hide under a rock.

Huh? I just told you why I won't share all knowledge with everyone all the time:

1. Jesus's (wise) admonition to be discerning with time

2. It's related to your schmuckiness level at any given moment

If those aren't the precise reasons you just wrote me that you are wasting time with me and are responding to my jerk-i-ness, I'll be hornswaggled, but thanks for demonstrating again your double standards.
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26-09-2013, 09:32 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
Wow. Holy horseshit. What the actual fucking fuck?

I'm just sayin here.....why the hell do you guys hate PJ so much?? I'm not gonna go running through all his posts searching for nasty shit he's said, but it must be some pretty awful shit. Ya ya, theism is awful shit, blablabla.

What I've seen in this thread (my first encounter with my new friend PJ) is a dude who seems pretty reasonable in his expectations.

NEWS FLASH: PleaseJesus is religious!
That means if you're gonna talk theism, you're gonna disagree. STRONGLY. But has anyone actually engaged this guy elsewhere? I mean, in a discussion NOT about theism? Because you are treating him like he is a bad person. And from what I can tell, based on the evidence (how KingsChosen is treated on this forum), most people here don't consider being a theist the determining factor of whether someone's a good person or a nasty fuck.

PJ,
Normally I'd say this in a PM (not much of a grandstander), but I think in this case it warrants saying right here.

I'm not in to debating religion. The simple fact is, I've heard what you have to say on the subject. Likewise, I suspect you've heard pretty much everything I have to say on it too. When I came here I had things to say, but now I stay more for the people (as asinine as some of them can be, they're kinda like family to me...or...something). what I'm getting at is, if you decide to stray from the atheism/theism threads, I'd be happy to talk. And I don't mind that on the occasion your beliefs are going to come up. I get that your beliefs are important to you.

Look in the food section....my guess is you're a Murican, which means odds are pretty good you BBQ. I'm always after advice from more experienced folk. Wink









Then again, maybe I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about.

So many cats, so few good recipes.
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26-09-2013, 09:48 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  I come here to learn and I recognize the vast intellect of many atheists. However, every time there is a snot-nosed "evidence, PJ or STFO" rather than a calm "evidence?", I know:

You also come here to provoke. What would you say if I went to a Christian forum and said "I have evidence for atheism, but first, you all have to prove your god exists?" What if, no matter what the topic, I claimed expertise? Why is it that other theists are capable of discussion, without any agreement on anything, that does not lead to insults and "snot nosed comments"? What is it about the way you act that provokes such behavior? Do you expect that everyone should simply suffer you when you're dishonest or boastful, when you ignore topics and rephrase others to be more manageable? Is standing up to this behavior "snot nosed"? Do you plan on repeating this behavior and then acting surprised when the insults continue?

What I consider truly immature is the inability to admit you don't know something and the inability to let go of even one bad idea or concept. You will not give an inch on even the most ridiculous of claims. You can't. You presuppose the bible to be 100% true. For you, the premise comes first and the facts must fit the premise or be discarded. That is, in my opinion, is just as "snot nosed" and childish as the insults.

My wife was with some friends the other day and one of the ladies admitted that she was uncomfortable admitting that she still believed in Jesus. She was surprised when not one atheist in the room tried to argue, debate, or scorn her. I think someone said, to paraphrase, "Cool, whatever works for you." End of discussion.

I'd say the same to you if you weren't so dishonest in your debates and so egotistical when referring to your own abilities and knowledge.

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  1) The personal bitterness prompts the remark

Humans get annoyed. I've even seen you get annoyed. You've also made some very harsh accusations towards, well beyond the scope of "STFU" and other petty insults. They haven't been used against you since. Are you really going to let an atheist set the example of how to 'turn the other cheek'?

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  2) The lack of confidence in one's untenable position prompts the remark

The core of the request is reasonable, regardless of the comments around it. I could say that feeling the need to mention that one is a "top academic," with lots of "published works" who preaches to "hundreds" stems from insecurity.

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  3) The Bible, that predicts this exact behavior from scoffers, is upheld again

That the bible predicts that people will have an opposing viewpoint is hardly a divine revelation; you've set the standard for your own 'evidence' and it's very low.

I've never seen a book that required as much spin, reinterpretation, apologetics, etc. as the bible. That speaks volumes to it's usefulness.

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  I have tons more I'd like to share by way of evidence, reason and personal conviction, but cannot because of my own biblical understanding that I should save the best pearls for the open, not closed-minded. "Digging your own grave" was never more true than here.

Do you have some Jesus blood? Tongue

If Jesus died for our sins, why is there still sin? If man was created from dust, why is there still dust? If Americans came from Europe, why are there still Europeans?
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26-09-2013, 09:49 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 07:39 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  
(25-09-2013 07:06 PM)Airyaman Wrote:  The word "truth" means different things to different people.
Do you think truth is wholly facts and logic or may truth be felt or perceived otherwise?

The word means different things. Like, "tack." It can be a pointy bit of metal, equipment for riding a horse, an action for achieving an goal, a sailing maneuver for going forward into the wind, the root of the word "tackle," which further divides into fishing and football, and so on, and so on.

No word like "truth," with so many different meanings, can be addressed by the binary approach you use. I can say, "I'm ambivalent about eggplant," and that's true. I can say, "Uranium is denser than helium," and that's true. I can say, "Peace leads to prosperity, and war leads to profit," and that's true. These are all different kinds of truth.

Some things, though, are not true. "An omnipotent being, conscious of every plant and animal's smallest wants and needs, and greatly concerned about the disposition of human genitals, created an observable universe of 3.5×10^80 m^3. He has deep love for all his favorite creation (us, aren't we lucky), and will torture most of us for all eternity," is not true. It's so unlikely as to be beneath consideration, and palpably ridiculous to boot. It's not one of the sub-categories of differently-true. It is false.

I AM he who is called... cat furniture.
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26-09-2013, 10:06 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
Stark, your surly is mellowing.

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
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26-09-2013, 10:10 AM
 
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 09:31 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  Huh? I just told you why I won't share all knowledge with everyone all the time:

1. Jesus's (wise) admonition to be discerning with time

2. It's related to your schmuckiness level at any given moment

If those aren't the precise reasons you just wrote me that you are wasting time with me and are responding to my jerk-i-ness, I'll be hornswaggled, but thanks for demonstrating again your double standards.

I didn't understand one word of what you just wrote. You're writing incoherent gibberish. You're as consistent as your Bible - maybe you've been reading it so often that it reflected on your writing.

So here you are, accusing me of "schmuckiness" (derived from the word that means penis,* very nice Christian vocabulary you've got), yet you started a thread complaining about how atheists on this forum are mistreating you, again publicly making a victim out of yourself. If you don't like it here, then what the fuck are you doing here? You never answered that, so I'll assume that my theory stands - that you seek to make a martyr out of yourself. As for why, I don't understand.

* http://books.google.hr/books?id=Ny1o6iXf...ck&f=false

(26-09-2013 09:32 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  I'm just sayin here.....why the hell do you guys hate PJ so much?? I'm not gonna go running through all his posts searching for nasty shit he's said, but it must be some pretty awful shit. Ya ya, theism is awful shit, blablabla.

Who mentioned hate? I don't hate anyone... but I have zero tolerance for dishonesty and deception.

(26-09-2013 09:32 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  What I've seen in this thread (my first encounter with my new friend PJ) is a dude who seems pretty reasonable in his expectations.

You admit that this thread is your first encounter with PJ; plus you also admit that you didn't even read this thread.
Therefore, you know nothing about him, yet you gave him a positive rating and accused others (including me) of hating him. How's that reasonable?

(26-09-2013 09:32 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  NEWS FLASH: PleaseJesus is religious!
That means if you're gonna talk theism, you're gonna disagree. STRONGLY. But has anyone actually engaged this guy elsewhere? I mean, in a discussion NOT about theism? Because you are treating him like he is a bad person. And from what I can tell, based on the evidence (how KingsChosen is treated on this forum), most people here don't consider being a theist the determining factor of whether someone's a good person or a nasty fuck.

You just answered your own question. Drinking Beverage

(26-09-2013 09:32 AM)Stark Raving Wrote:  Then again, maybe I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about.

In this case, you don't. Dodgy
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26-09-2013, 10:15 AM (This post was last modified: 26-09-2013 10:23 AM by kim.)
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 07:39 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  
(25-09-2013 03:10 PM)devilsadvoc8 Wrote:  PJ, I've ignored your threads for several weeks now b/c you have shown intolerance, lack of knowledge and closed mindedness. For example you actually are ignorant on many scientific topics especially evolution. You have been given road maps (e.g. books, courses, websites) to further educate yourself on the topic but have refused to do so. Even more comical is that you asked for books in a thread you started but then admitted you didn't read them. I have drawn the conclusion that you don't want to learn but want to only appear to do so in order to make your own completely ridiculous beliefs more legitimate.

This assumption must be convenient for you. Now you can close down more when I challenge with facts, a pet theory or other musing. Good job. Understand in return that even though most of you are consuming literature and personal thoughts that are wholly opposed to everything I hold dear and are very little interested in any opposing viewpoint other than to mock and curse, I treasure hearing your contrary opinions and I fear neither your arrogance, ignorance or closed-mindedness, and it's worth wading through garbage like yours to hear what other, open-minded and articulate atheists think and care about.

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  
(25-09-2013 03:19 PM)darv Wrote:  Ok... I admit that I've not interacted with you much at all, PJ. In your OP, you give us this...


That appears to claim we can be more knowledgeable by being nicer. The majority on this forum tend to value evidence... not feelings. So, I can see why you were ripped for making such a post.

Then, you give us this gem.


Are you trying to say you have some special knowledge that you won't share with us until we are nicer to you? If it is anything from the bible, we've heard it before. If it isn't from the bible and you are holding it hostage until we're nicer, that's not very christian of you is it?

My $0.02

Drinking Beverage

I was saying neither of those things. I was saying rather that many (not all) atheists show their lack of true spirituality and true, exalted knowledge by behaving like obnoxious jerks to people, and particularly when their houses of cards are toppled.

I come here to learn and I recognize the vast intellect of many atheists. However, every time there is a snot-nosed "evidence, PJ or STFO" rather than a calm "evidence?", I know:

1) The personal bitterness prompts the remark

2) The lack of confidence in one's untenable position prompts the remark

3) The Bible, that predicts this exact behavior from scoffers, is upheld again

To be honest, I have tons more I'd like to share by way of evidence, reason and personal conviction, but cannot because of my own biblical understanding that I should save the best pearls for the open, not closed-minded. "Digging your own grave" was never more true than here.

Well, these are telling responses. Two posts with simple observations of behavior are actually responded to by PJ with that exact behavior - venomous and sarcastic responses, as well. And not just the stuff in bold, either - those things just caught my eye.

Hmm... I seem to recall some mention of a "double standard". ?
***

Pj, you say you want to learn stuff but then refuse.
You say people insult you, while you do the exact same thing.
You seemingly play ignorant while making back handed, sarcastic remarks about another's ideas being arrogant, closed-minded.... blah, blah, blah...

By the way, saying someone is ignorant is not an insult. It simply means one has not run across some information and it is very evident to all and so may be pointed out by others.

People have tried to help you become informed but you have refused and run away ... and now you cry about it.

Boo-hoo.

You made the decision to come here and for some reason, you've decided to stay. I guess you'll just have to whine to yourself. Drinking Beverage

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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26-09-2013, 10:27 AM
RE: "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
(26-09-2013 09:48 AM)guitar_nut Wrote:  
(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  I come here to learn and I recognize the vast intellect of many atheists. However, every time there is a snot-nosed "evidence, PJ or STFO" rather than a calm "evidence?", I know:

You also come here to provoke. What would you say if I went to a Christian forum and said "I have evidence for atheism, but first, you all have to prove your god exists?" What if, no matter what the topic, I claimed expertise? Why is it that other theists are capable of discussion, without any agreement on anything, that does not lead to insults and "snot nosed comments"? What is it about the way you act that provokes such behavior? Do you expect that everyone should simply suffer you when you're dishonest or boastful, when you ignore topics and rephrase others to be more manageable? Is standing up to this behavior "snot nosed"? Do you plan on repeating this behavior and then acting surprised when the insults continue?

What I consider truly immature is the inability to admit you don't know something and the inability to let go of even one bad idea or concept. You will not give an inch on even the most ridiculous of claims. You can't. You presuppose the bible to be 100% true. For you, the premise comes first and the facts must fit the premise or be discarded. That is, in my opinion, is just as "snot nosed" and childish as the insults.

My wife was with some friends the other day and one of the ladies admitted that she was uncomfortable admitting that she still believed in Jesus. She was surprised when not one atheist in the room tried to argue, debate, or scorn her. I think someone said, to paraphrase, "Cool, whatever works for you." End of discussion.

I'd say the same to you if you weren't so dishonest in your debates and so egotistical when referring to your own abilities and knowledge.

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  1) The personal bitterness prompts the remark

Humans get annoyed. I've even seen you get annoyed. You've also made some very harsh accusations towards, well beyond the scope of "STFU" and other petty insults. They haven't been used against you since. Are you really going to let an atheist set the example of how to 'turn the other cheek'?

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  2) The lack of confidence in one's untenable position prompts the remark

The core of the request is reasonable, regardless of the comments around it. I could say that feeling the need to mention that one is a "top academic," with lots of "published works" who preaches to "hundreds" stems from insecurity.

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  3) The Bible, that predicts this exact behavior from scoffers, is upheld again

That the bible predicts that people will have an opposing viewpoint is hardly a divine revelation; you've set the standard for your own 'evidence' and it's very low.

I've never seen a book that required as much spin, reinterpretation, apologetics, etc. as the bible. That speaks volumes to it's usefulness.

(26-09-2013 07:44 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  I have tons more I'd like to share by way of evidence, reason and personal conviction, but cannot because of my own biblical understanding that I should save the best pearls for the open, not closed-minded. "Digging your own grave" was never more true than here.

Do you have some Jesus blood? Tongue

Um, I've often prefaced remarks with "this is my lay understanding but..." and "tell me if I'm wrong, but..." or "I see you are really learned on this subject but..."

*Are you denying I've been told STFU for saying "thank you"?

*Are you denying I received multiple GTFOs this week alone?

*Are you affirming that atheists "can't help" petty insults because they lack self-control?

If you want I can treat people the way I'm treated here rather than the way I'd like to be treated, as an experiment...
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