Jeremy Walker the nihilist
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15-05-2014, 11:24 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 11:16 AM)Leo Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 11:12 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I question everything that does not cohere with what God has said.

So if god say you must kill 1000 people today , you will do it?

No.
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15-05-2014, 11:24 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(14-05-2014 06:44 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(14-05-2014 06:42 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Don't think I actually start "decaying" until I die. And cremation bypasses all that anyway. Until then I'm just regenerating at a decelerating rate.

right right...

you are aging, decaying, dying. who cares girlyman. soon you will die and soon after your many words will be forgotten long before the sun loses its energy and ceases to shine.

I sometimes deal with those feelings, too, but I've been getting more positive. I hope that perhaps Science will eventually solve our problems and that all that matters now is helping others along on their journey through this life.
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15-05-2014, 11:24 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 11:22 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 11:18 AM)Leo Wrote:  Why not ? You like a circular discussion heh. You don't like to get to the point because people will destroy your pathetic beliefs.

I have no good reason to believe in Santa because there are none.

What's the difference between believing in Santa and your god? I can play your circular game for a long time. I don't mind.Laugh out load
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15-05-2014, 11:24 AM (This post was last modified: 15-05-2014 11:31 AM by rampant.a.i..)
Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 11:03 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 10:57 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  So the math quip was a non sequitur, then. Why include it?

to illustrate why it is not a circular argument when I say: God caused me to believe in Him.

God is the cause of me believing in Him. Without God, I would not believe in Him.

What caused you to believe in someone you believe in?

Is it not the person you believe in?

But it's not circular reasoning, according to you.

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“It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts.”
― Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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15-05-2014, 11:25 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 11:21 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 11:16 AM)djhall Wrote:  Oh, come now... even you are better than this. If you question everything that does not cohere with what God has said, that just means you implicitly trust god. Unless you have always implicitly trusted God, which you have admitted is not the case, there was a time when you didn't trust him and something caused that to change. Something you believe is sufficient evidence for you.

The only reason it needs to be spelled out is that you are deliberately dodging the intent of the question.

Of course I implicitly trust God. I have a strange habit of trusting people who are trustworthy.

You are right. I have not always trusted God. You cannot trust someone if you do not know them.

I have not always known God.

What changed this? God changed this.

And this ladies and gentlemen is why 'faith' and 'gullibility' are synonymous... Facepalm

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15-05-2014, 11:25 AM (This post was last modified: 15-05-2014 01:00 PM by Charis.)
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
Quote:when my math teacher told me two and two was four i trusted her.
Becaaaauuuuse??? Because she held up two fingers on one hand and two fingers on the other and SHOWED you that 2+2=4? Hopefully, you trusted her because she was a good teacher, and not just because she was an adult in authority. Blind trust in authority figures is a huge contributing factor in kidnappings and rapes... including my own.

Quote: i did not demand proof. i accepted what she said as true because i recognized she was a TEACHER.
*insert loud buzzer sound here*
WAY WRONG ANSWER! You should have SEEN that what she said was true because of her being able to comptetently demonstrate that two plus two does, in fact, equal FOUR. And again, you don't trust trust someone's every word just because they're a teacher! What is wrong with you?! Have you spent your whole life in the appeal to authority fallacy or something???




Quote: when she told me two and two was four i was not suspicious of her intentions.
You likely had very good reason to trust her intentions. I'm not going to debate her intentions.
What I'm talking about here is accepting a claim about something based only on the word of someone who is in authority over you. And please don't digress into inane analogies of "types of claims" and stuff, because you and I and everyone else here knows the context of all this.



Quote: i believed she was trying to help me not hurt me...
That's fair enough, and very likely true. I'm not going to question that one. There's an emotional trust between student and teacher, usually. I'm not contesting that.



Quote: ...nor did what she tell me seem to be so off the wall as to warrant skepticism.
Well color me relieved. FINALLY! *hugs Jeremy* Omg, you don't know how happy this statement makes me. Finally there's something to work with here. You know that there are qualifications for good teaching and bad teaching, and that there are certain "red flags" when skepticism is brought in. Her teaching was not throwing up these "red flags" because why? If she's like most teachers, she will be demonstrating how what she is teaching is true. 2+2=4 is a VERY demonstrable fact. There's nothing difficult about teaching its truth, and so no skepticism is usually warranted.




Quote:i am not a person that is suspicious and doubtful of everything people tell me.
Doesn't need to be literally everything. Nobody here is saying it does. Be suspicious of significant claims minus evidence until evidence is presented. Also note that "being suspicious of claims" does not equate to a paranoid frame of mind, in case you're concerned about that. It doesn't mean that, just because I don't accept my neighbor's Pagan beliefs and mentally question them when he speaks of them, that I'm operating in a constant state of suspicion, because I'm not. I don't suspect him of ill motives (well... he has very sexual motives, but that's not really relevant to his arguments), and I don't worry about his claims unless I was to believe that they would start having a negative impact on stuff.
There are different levels of suspicion, and they range from mild skepticism to outright paranoia (and this statement is just an opinion of mine that I cannot, at this time, back up, by the way).



Quote: i am not now nor was i when i was told what two and two was.
Nor were most people. Two plus two is fairly demonstrable.


Quote: if someone tells me something i take it as being true by default not false by default.
Do you have any qualifiers for this at all? Also, this is a false choice. And a possible strawman, if you're saying this is what Atheists do. There is not ONLY "true" or "false." There is also "not so sure about that. need more info. I'll wait and see."



Quote: if it seems at odds with what i think is true then i ask for further support for their assertion and also check what i believe to make sure i am not in error.
Alright, I can go along this. Smile


Quote:i do not walk around demanding proof from everyone when they tell me something if what they tell me sounds reasonable.
I'm glad of this. It means you're not retardedly socially awkward to the point of being a pest to literally everyone within physical earshot. This is also another strawman, if you're asserting that an atheist actually walks around demanding proof of people in their vicinity. But your phrase "if what they tell me sounds reasonable" is encouraging, because this means that you ARE, in fact, weighing their words against SOMETHING.... the question now is, what?



Quote:i had little number beads i played with and used them and put two on one side and two together with the two and counted to four. this was a visual cue that what she had already told me was true.
I sometimes used M&M's.

Quote:i was not poisoned with the whole "question everything" mantra until later in life and thankfully am free of it now.
The more you question, the more you learn. After all, if what you believe is actually TRUE, then it will be shown as true when the questions are posed to it, no matter what it is. I guess I don't really consider "question everything" a poison at all. After all, it doesn't sicken or weaken my position but solidifies it OR prompts me to take a more solid position than the one I previously held.
"Question everything" allows me to KNOW where the solid rock is, so that I don't mistakenly stand on sinking sand.

A person very dear to me was badly hurt through a misunderstanding and miscommunication. For this, I am sorry, and he knows it. That said, any blaming me for malicious intent is for the birds. I will not wear some scarlet letter, I will not be anybody's whipping girl, and I will not lurk in silence.
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15-05-2014, 11:25 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 11:20 AM)TheBear Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 10:51 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  i was not poisoned with the whole "question everything" mantra until later in life and thankfully am free of it now.


IOW, it's a lot easier for you to accept everything without question.


Do you realize how gullible and intellectually lazy that makes you? WC Fields had you pegged.

its easier for me to accept everything that is acceptable without questioning whether or not I should accept it once I have decided it is acceptable.
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15-05-2014, 11:26 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 10:59 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I do not believe in a monster god Yahveh.

sorry.
(15-05-2014 11:10 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I believe in the God of the Bible.

A and !A = anything you want!

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15-05-2014, 11:26 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 11:24 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 11:16 AM)Leo Wrote:  So if god say you must kill 1000 people today , you will do it?

No.

Why not ? It's the command of god , you are questioning the command of your god ?
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15-05-2014, 11:26 AM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 11:24 AM)Leo Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 11:22 AM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  I have no good reason to believe in Santa because there are none.

What's the difference between believing in Santa and your god? I can play your circular game for a long time. I don't mind.Laugh out load

The difference is that I have good reasons to believe in God.
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