Jeremy Walker the nihilist
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15-05-2014, 01:53 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 01:49 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 01:46 PM)rampant.a.i. Wrote:  So you would, without question, accept the verse as describing God, because it is God's word?

what verse?

Pretty sure that, if it's a verse, the answer would be "yes."

Because... god's word. Whatever that's worth.

Especially given his attitude towards what is spoken by entities that he views as authorities.

A person very dear to me was badly hurt through a misunderstanding and miscommunication. For this, I am sorry, and he knows it. That said, any blaming me for malicious intent is for the birds. I will not wear some scarlet letter, I will not be anybody's whipping girl, and I will not lurk in silence.
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15-05-2014, 01:59 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 01:52 PM)Charis Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 01:49 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Start in Genesis. End with Revelation. Most of your questions will be answered. Not all. But most.

Genesis through Rev. IS THE CLAIM.

Looking for evidence. Not looking to repeat the claim. Claim is not true because claim. Nuh-uh.

Genesis is a book of the bible. Revelation is a piece of apocalyptic literature that concludes the NT.

Read it. All of it. Without a commentary. If you can read Hebrew Aramaic and Greek thats great. If not, An ESV or NASB will suffice.

Ask yourself while you read:

Is this what I would expect to read about if God existed?

Does what I am reading cohere with what I hold to be true about reality?

Does this jive with what I would expect to read if God was involved in the affairs of men thousands of years ago in the ancient near east?

If you decide not to do the above then that is your choice.
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15-05-2014, 02:02 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 01:52 PM)Timber1025 Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 01:45 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  When I say wrath, I do not mean wrath in the sense you imagine it. I see wrath as flowing from God's Just nature which are demanded by His holiness and righteousness. Wrath is the expression of hate and judgment against the profane and wicked. I myself as a human hate wickedness and when I see people subjected to it desire to make it right. How much more would a God who is Holy who can see all the wrongs and evils committed in the earth desire to make it right by assigning to the wicked that which their deeds merit?

Really - what is wrong with you? Your god sounds pretty "Human" you dolt! Think about it.

God is a person. He is a free moral agent like we are. We were created in His Image and Likeness. What we are in small, God is in large, save our sins of course.
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15-05-2014, 02:03 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 01:23 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 12:41 PM)Impulse Wrote:  Nice attempt at diverting the topic of why you believe in your god. (Well, not really because it makes no sense at all.) By your reply, you seem to agree then that you believe in your god NOT for the same reason that I would believe in a person as you originally claimed. So back to the drawing board. Why do you believe in your god?

"The actual existence of the person is what makes you believe another person exists. You can see, touch, talk with, and interact with the person. The person also answers back, interacts back, touches you back, and sees you as well. Although you might claim you can, the fact is you can't say any of that about your gawd."

Your argument assumes materialism is true.

I stated earlier, I am not a materialist.

You equate actual existence with existing in space, in time, with physical concrete constituents.

Why?
Irrelevant to the question so I'll ignore it again. Still waiting to hear why you believe in your god... Drinking Beverage

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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15-05-2014, 02:04 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 01:59 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 01:52 PM)Charis Wrote:  Genesis through Rev. IS THE CLAIM.

Looking for evidence. Not looking to repeat the claim. Claim is not true because claim. Nuh-uh.

Genesis is a book of the bible. Revelation is a piece of apocalyptic literature that concludes the NT.

Read it. All of it. Without a commentary. If you can read Hebrew Aramaic and Greek thats great. If not, An ESV or NASB will suffice.

Ask yourself while you read:

Is this what I would expect to read about if God existed?

Does what I am reading cohere with what I hold to be true about reality?

Does this jive with what I would expect to read if God was involved in the affairs of men thousands of years ago in the ancient near east?

If you decide not to do the above then that is your choice.

It's interesting that you assume that I have not done this. I have.

And doing this repeatedly contributes to my atheism.

But there's still this issue.... me READING THE CLAIM yet AGAIN will not change that fact that it is still THE CLAIM! Laugh out loadWeeping

The claim without commentary is the CLAIM without commentary.
The claim in Greek/Hebrew is the CLAIM in Greek/Hebrew.

Despite me answering "no" to your questions there, what "I hold to be true about reality" would still be kinda irrelevant if based upon misinformation. Show me the fax, Max. Those, at least, are real. Not "what I hold." "What I think" is only true if it is CORRECT.

A person very dear to me was badly hurt through a misunderstanding and miscommunication. For this, I am sorry, and he knows it. That said, any blaming me for malicious intent is for the birds. I will not wear some scarlet letter, I will not be anybody's whipping girl, and I will not lurk in silence.
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15-05-2014, 02:05 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 02:03 PM)Impulse Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 01:23 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  "The actual existence of the person is what makes you believe another person exists. You can see, touch, talk with, and interact with the person. The person also answers back, interacts back, touches you back, and sees you as well. Although you might claim you can, the fact is you can't say any of that about your gawd."

Your argument assumes materialism is true.

I stated earlier, I am not a materialist.

You equate actual existence with existing in space, in time, with physical concrete constituents.

Why?
Irrelevant to the question so I'll ignore it again. Still waiting to hear why you believe in your god... Drinking Beverage

If I tell you, your materialistic mindset will demand you discard what I say as untrue a priori.

For you and I, the issue is not why I believe in God, but rather why I am not a materialist.
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15-05-2014, 02:06 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 01:45 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  How much more would a God who is Holy who can see all the wrongs and evils committed in the earth desire to make it right by assigning to the wicked that which their deeds merit?

This is quite ironic, given the thread subject. Any such distinctions God makes are arbitrary. God is [holy], and as such he hates X. Because he is [righteous], he deems that X deserves to be met with Y. So when Got meets X with Y, it is [just].

God could have arbitrarily decided that eating a tuna fish sandwich should be met with blessings of twinkies or running red lights should be met with a bullet to the knee. He just happened to not weigh in on those issues and instead say that male on male homosexuality should be met with stones to the face not being admitted to the kingdom of God (according to the Old New Testament).

Not only is the rule and punishment system quite arbitrary, it's entirely unnecessary, given that he can see the future and is the "author of all things".
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15-05-2014, 02:07 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 02:02 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  God is a person.
Laugh out load Laugh out load Laugh out load

*ahem* sorry, couldn't help myself.

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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15-05-2014, 02:08 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 02:05 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 02:03 PM)Impulse Wrote:  Irrelevant to the question so I'll ignore it again. Still waiting to hear why you believe in your god... Drinking Beverage

If I tell you, your materialistic mindset will demand you discard what I say as untrue a priori.

For you and I, the issue is not why I believe in God, but rather why I am not a materialist.
More excuses and still no answer to the question. Drinking Beverage

I am not accountable to any God. I am accountable to myself - and not because I think I am God as some theists would try to assert - but because, no matter what actions I take, thoughts I think, or words I utter, I have to be able to live with myself.
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15-05-2014, 02:09 PM
RE: Jeremy Walker the nihilist
(15-05-2014 02:04 PM)Charis Wrote:  
(15-05-2014 01:59 PM)Jeremy E Walker Wrote:  Genesis is a book of the bible. Revelation is a piece of apocalyptic literature that concludes the NT.

Read it. All of it. Without a commentary. If you can read Hebrew Aramaic and Greek thats great. If not, An ESV or NASB will suffice.

Ask yourself while you read:

Is this what I would expect to read about if God existed?

Does what I am reading cohere with what I hold to be true about reality?

Does this jive with what I would expect to read if God was involved in the affairs of men thousands of years ago in the ancient near east?

If you decide not to do the above then that is your choice.

It's interesting that you assume that I have not done this. I have.

And doing this repeatedly contributes to my atheism.

But there's still this issue.... me READING THE CLAIM yet AGAIN will not change that fact that it is still THE CLAIM! Laugh out loadWeeping

If after reading the Bible, you feel compelled to be an atheist, then fine.

I do not understand why you would still ask for evidence.

That strikes me as odd.
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