Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
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16-11-2015, 11:08 AM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(13-11-2015 02:27 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(13-11-2015 01:43 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  I don't think I need to repeat myself yet again on this topic. Everyone who reads the scriptures in English or the original languages can find hundreds of examples of prophecies that came true between days and years later after their utterance. You may have the last word.

Only by interpreting them as omens ... and none are actually SPECIFIC things that could have been one event and not another. There are at least as many that didn't come true. I realize your life is BUILT on this false and ignorant notion of what prophecy is, but that's not my problem. And BTW, you have no idea what he did or said. You forgot to provide evidence for you fairy tale.

Fine. Here are two recent examples that came up in "Quiet Time devotional reading just this weekend":

"But they shall serve the Lord their God, And David their king, Whom I will raise up for them." Jeremiah 30:9 NKJV -- David was dead, so how could this not be a future prophecy of resurrection?!

"For thus says the Lord : After seventy years are completed at Babylon, I will visit you and perform My good word toward you, and cause you to return to this place."
- Jeremiah 29:10 NKJV -- The Jews were to be in diaspora and then returned in the future.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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16-11-2015, 12:34 PM (This post was last modified: 16-11-2015 03:31 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(16-11-2015 11:08 AM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(13-11-2015 02:27 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Only by interpreting them as omens ... and none are actually SPECIFIC things that could have been one event and not another. There are at least as many that didn't come true. I realize your life is BUILT on this false and ignorant notion of what prophecy is, but that's not my problem. And BTW, you have no idea what he did or said. You forgot to provide evidence for you fairy tale.

Fine. Here are two recent examples that came up in "Quiet Time devotional reading just this weekend":

"But they shall serve the Lord their God, And David their king, Whom I will raise up for them." Jeremiah 30:9 NKJV -- David was dead, so how could this not be a future prophecy of resurrection?!

"For thus says the Lord : After seventy years are completed at Babylon, I will visit you and perform My good word toward you, and cause you to return to this place."
- Jeremiah 29:10 NKJV -- The Jews were to be in diaspora and then returned in the future.

Has David been raised ? No. It's ALLEGORY and metaphor, (as Aliza also has attempted to educated you on).
You really are a dolt. It's a metaphor for the nation.

The diapora has never been "undone", so
a. nothing happened,
b. it's clearly allegory. Jeremiah didn't write (all of) Jeremiah. Everyone knows that. THEY thought they were advising the peopel of their OWN time. Get used to it.

You fundie literalists CHEAPEN and DISRESPECT the nature of ancient literature by slapping modern literalism onto it's meaning, thereby MISS the very essense of it's meaning. Too bad you know so little about ancient literary forms, uses and styles Your ignorance belittles what could/should be read as interesting and respected "literature".

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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16-11-2015, 02:51 PM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(16-11-2015 12:34 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  The diapora has never been "undone", so
a. nothing happened,

Shitora happenora?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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16-11-2015, 03:05 PM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(16-11-2015 11:06 AM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(13-11-2015 02:18 PM)docskeptic Wrote:  1. What if your wife had miscarried or if your child was born with Trisomy 13 or anencephaly? Would you have considered your "pregnancy fulfilled"?

2. Please quote some examples of "double fulfillment"- sounds kinky.

Doc

What does question #1 have to do with God's ability to complete/fulfill prophecy?

As for question #2, please do the research. There are dozens of examples.

1. I don't know. You're the one who injected pregnancies into the discussion. You say that having a normal child is like having a prophecy fulfilled. In the same vein then, an abortion is like a prophecy that never came true and a mutated child is a prophecy that went awry. And we have plenty of those in this world.

2. Give me a specific example of a "doubly-fulfilled prophecy". It's a simple question. I'm not interested in what other people say. I want to hear it from you.

Doc
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16-11-2015, 03:29 PM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(16-11-2015 03:05 PM)docskeptic Wrote:  
(16-11-2015 11:06 AM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  What does question #1 have to do with God's ability to complete/fulfill prophecy?

As for question #2, please do the research. There are dozens of examples.

1. I don't know. You're the one who injected pregnancies into the discussion. You say that having a normal child is like having a prophecy fulfilled. In the same vein then, an abortion is like a prophecy that never came true and a mutated child is a prophecy that went awry. And we have plenty of those in this world.

2. Give me a specific example of a "doubly-fulfilled prophecy". It's a simple question. I'm not interested in what other people say. I want to hear it from you.

Doc

I predict that Q's response will be full of shit and that he will be a right twat. Doubly fulfilled betcha betcha.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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17-11-2015, 12:12 PM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(16-11-2015 12:34 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(16-11-2015 11:08 AM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  Fine. Here are two recent examples that came up in "Quiet Time devotional reading just this weekend":

"But they shall serve the Lord their God, And David their king, Whom I will raise up for them." Jeremiah 30:9 NKJV -- David was dead, so how could this not be a future prophecy of resurrection?!

"For thus says the Lord : After seventy years are completed at Babylon, I will visit you and perform My good word toward you, and cause you to return to this place."
- Jeremiah 29:10 NKJV -- The Jews were to be in diaspora and then returned in the future.

Has David been raised ? No. It's ALLEGORY and metaphor, (as Aliza also has attempted to educated you on).
You really are a dolt. It's a metaphor for the nation.

The diapora has never been "undone", so
a. nothing happened,
b. it's clearly allegory. Jeremiah didn't write (all of) Jeremiah. Everyone knows that. THEY thought they were advising the peopel of their OWN time. Get used to it.

You fundie literalists CHEAPEN and DISRESPECT the nature of ancient literature by slapping modern literalism onto it's meaning, thereby MISS the very essense of it's meaning. Too bad you know so little about ancient literary forms, uses and styles Your ignorance belittles what could/should be read as interesting and respected "literature".

It is common nonsense to allegorize ALL scripture--the JWs and Mormons do so, let alone atheists. No, there are multiple prophecies about David being raised--and in fact, no other king is mentioned in them--and Abraham et all were also promised to be resurrected in Israel in the FUTURE.

The diaspora was prophesied to last 70 years in Babylon and history and scripture both record the return of some of Israel to the land following.

I hate to sound like a broken record here but you are wrong.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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17-11-2015, 12:15 PM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(16-11-2015 03:05 PM)docskeptic Wrote:  
(16-11-2015 11:06 AM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  What does question #1 have to do with God's ability to complete/fulfill prophecy?

As for question #2, please do the research. There are dozens of examples.

1. I don't know. You're the one who injected pregnancies into the discussion. You say that having a normal child is like having a prophecy fulfilled. In the same vein then, an abortion is like a prophecy that never came true and a mutated child is a prophecy that went awry. And we have plenty of those in this world.

2. Give me a specific example of a "doubly-fulfilled prophecy". It's a simple question. I'm not interested in what other people say. I want to hear it from you.

Doc

No, I didn't say those things. You asked me for a natural example and I said the promise of a new child is fulfilled again as the child matures, and then you made comments about disabled children I didn't say or imply.

A great example of doubled prophecy touches Israel. Prophecies have Israel being "birthed" (sorry but there's birth again) in a single day, TWO times:

1) The Exodus from Egypt--slaves to a free nation

2) May 15, 1948--voted their land back by the United Nations--May 14 not a country, May 15 a country

You should study prophecy on your own, carefully, rather than have me dictate it to you. Prophecy is a tremendous apologetic for the truthfulness of the Bible.

Thanks.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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17-11-2015, 12:19 PM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(17-11-2015 12:12 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(16-11-2015 12:34 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Has David been raised ? No. It's ALLEGORY and metaphor, (as Aliza also has attempted to educated you on).
You really are a dolt. It's a metaphor for the nation.

The diapora has never been "undone", so
a. nothing happened,
b. it's clearly allegory. Jeremiah didn't write (all of) Jeremiah. Everyone knows that. THEY thought they were advising the peopel of their OWN time. Get used to it.

You fundie literalists CHEAPEN and DISRESPECT the nature of ancient literature by slapping modern literalism onto it's meaning, thereby MISS the very essense of it's meaning. Too bad you know so little about ancient literary forms, uses and styles Your ignorance belittles what could/should be read as interesting and respected "literature".

It is common nonsense to allegorize ALL scripture--the JWs and Mormons do so, let alone atheists. No, there are multiple prophecies about David being raised--and in fact, no other king is mentioned in them--and Abraham et all were also promised to be resurrected in Israel in the FUTURE.

The diaspora was prophesied to last 70 years in Babylon and history and scripture both record the return of some of Israel to the land following.

I hate to sound like a broken record here but you are wrong.

Explain to me, if you will, the Christian perspective for this 70-year diaspora in Babylon. Do you believe that this prophecy was fulfilled at 70 years?
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17-11-2015, 12:21 PM
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(17-11-2015 12:15 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(16-11-2015 03:05 PM)docskeptic Wrote:  1. I don't know. You're the one who injected pregnancies into the discussion. You say that having a normal child is like having a prophecy fulfilled. In the same vein then, an abortion is like a prophecy that never came true and a mutated child is a prophecy that went awry. And we have plenty of those in this world.

2. Give me a specific example of a "doubly-fulfilled prophecy". It's a simple question. I'm not interested in what other people say. I want to hear it from you.

Doc

No, I didn't say those things. You asked me for a natural example and I said the promise of a new child is fulfilled again as the child matures, and then you made comments about disabled children I didn't say or imply.

A great example of doubled prophecy touches Israel. Prophecies have Israel being "birthed" (sorry but there's birth again) in a single day, TWO times:

1) The Exodus from Egypt--slaves to a free nation

2) May 15, 1948--voted their land back by the United Nations--May 14 not a country, May 15 a country

You should study prophecy on your own, carefully, rather than have me dictate it to you. Prophecy is a tremendous apologetic for the truthfulness of the Bible.

Thanks.

It's a great example of 100% intentionally acted upon fulfilling this idea of a prophecy you know of. The Zionists wanted to fulfill that prophecy so they politically did it made it a "event" to make Israel a place again, even though that's not really forming a nation, the moving of the people into there was.

How is wandering 40 years birthing a nation you're not even in, in a day? Because there are already civilizations living in that area? (plus it's been shown how the archaeology on that isn't backed up at all. The real takeover of Israel by the Hebrews was from a cultural shift over the Canaanites, not from a mass immigration/warfare take over from Egypt.

It's like people don't quite grasp the NT writers were able there to write stories in a manner to relate to the prophecies... Because they KNEW the prophecy. That's why you write it to proclaim that it is enacted POST the alleged event.

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17-11-2015, 12:32 PM (This post was last modified: 17-11-2015 01:49 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Jesus Christ, A Pointless Sacrifice
(17-11-2015 12:12 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  It is common nonsense to allegorize ALL scripture--the JWs and Mormons do so, let alone atheists. No, there are multiple prophecies about David being raised--and in fact, no other king is mentioned in them--and Abraham et all were also promised to be resurrected in Israel in the FUTURE.

The diaspora was prophesied to last 70 years in Babylon and history and scripture both record the return of some of Israel to the land following.

I hate to sound like a broken record here but you are wrong.

You are a broken record of complete nonsense. The "disapora" and the Babylonian EXILE were two completelty different things. The "exile" was not really what many think it was. Only SOME upper-class Jews were taken, in waves, over many many decades, NOT all at the same time. The "return" was also the same sort of PROCESS, No "prediction" could possibly pinpoint a LONG "process". So your complete ignorance of the period is yet again showing, Q. "History" *records* no such thing. They didn't even all "get there" in 70 years, much less "return" in 70 years.

Sorry. I'm not the one who's wrong here, and you have NOT ONE real historical reference to prove your nonsense. To say NOTHING of the fact, that you can in no way prove when anything was actually "recorded" or written.

Prophesy is NOT prediction of the future. That is a common street-level ignorant misconception by those who really have never studied that literature.

https://www.nytimes.com/books/first/f/fi...bible.html

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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