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Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
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03-09-2016, 11:19 AM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
I disagree that it is "needless." No one needs to be shaken out of their comfort zones more than religitards.

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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04-09-2016, 05:53 AM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
Apparently, the thin piece of wood was used to prevent the victim from pulling his foot over the nail-head in any attempt to relieve his agony. (Suggested correctly as a 'washer' earlier on.)

Jehohanan, son of Hagakol, was also put to death by crucifixion in the 1st century CE, and whose ossuary was found in 1968 when building contractors working in Giv'at ha-Mivtar, a Jewish neighbourhood in East Jerusalem, uncovered a Jewish tomb. That's allegedly his ankle in the top right-hand corner of the image.

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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04-09-2016, 08:08 AM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(03-09-2016 11:11 AM)Gert Heide Wrote:  Talk about religion or sex or politics, by all means, but remember that in many cases, it's a waste of time and only causes needless offence.
That's true in some cases, but remember when it was considered to be offensive if you complained about people smoking in restaurants and public transport?

It's discussion that leads to change IMO. I will agree though that the value of the discussion is another matter if that's what you mean.
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10-09-2016, 07:42 PM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(31-08-2016 12:45 AM)Firefighter01 Wrote:  Why the tomb wasn't able to be 100% verified and also venerated as the most important shrine in the word is beyond comprehension for any "Son of God".

The "Son of God" thing has been greatly magnified since the time of Jesus of Nazareth. Note the Psalm below:

Psa 82:6 I have said, 'You are gods; and all of you sons of the Most High.'

Regardless of whether or not anyone believes that some of the things said in the Gospels were actually said by Jesus, the fact remains that what we see in these Gospels were what was believed- at least by the writers- as early as the first century. Now, in relation to that Psalm I quoted above, let's take a look at something attributed to Jesus from the Gospel of John:

Joh 10:30 - John 10:36

Jesus said, "I and the Father are one!"
It was then that the Jews picked up some stones again to stone him. But then Jesus asked them, "I have shown you many good works from my Father; for which of these do you stone me?"
The Jews replied to him, saying, "We are not stoning you for doing any good works, but rather for blasphemy because you, being but a mere man, have presented yourself as a god."
Jesus replied, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said, You are gods?' If God regarded those whom had the word of God with them as being 'gods,' and that Scripture cannot be changed, then why do you accuse me- whom the Father has sanctified and sent into the world- by saying 'You blaspheme,' just because I have said that I am also a son of God?"


Now, the point here is not an argument over whether or not Jesus said what was quoted above, but rather the point is that in the 1st century this kind of philosophy regarding being gods and sons of God was a known philosophy, otherwise this writer of this Gospel wouldn't be writing about it.

So what does it mean?

Well, it doesn't mean what it has come to mean after all these centuries. Modern understanding of the meaning of "Son of God" bears no resemblance to how it was understood during the 1st century. Whoever wrote this section of the Gospel of John literally tells us that- according to that Psalm- it was believed that anyone who taught the word of God was considered to be a son of God and/or a god.

But back to your point here ...

If what I have said here is reasonable and correct, then it was no big deal for a historical Jesus to have been buried in a tomb that has long since been forgotten. There were no Christians during the time of Jesus, only Jews. Therefore, nobody was going to be creating a shrine out of some tomb where a person who was accursed (because he was hung and crucified) was supposedly buried.

It simply doesn't make any sense at all for non believing Jews to embellish the life of a cursed man by building a shrine to him. No sense at all.
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10-09-2016, 08:33 PM (This post was last modified: 10-09-2016 08:44 PM by Deltabravo.)
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(02-09-2016 10:13 PM)Firefighter01 Wrote:  
(02-09-2016 01:20 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I find it noteworthy that the earliest version we have of Mark shows the women leaving the empty tomb without telling anyone about it (which would include, presumably, where it is), after which the book ends.

So even if we assume parts of the story are true, and that there was such a tomb, it stands to reason that the other apostles didn't bother going there, and the women didn't tell anyone about the missing body, so none of the 2nd-generation Christians who started writing the Gospels would have had a clue where this place was. So, by the 3rd generation (or later), somebody figures they need to add a bit to Mark, to make it fit with the legend that was included in the next two Gospels written, Matthew and Luke.

On a more realistic note, I find it hilarious that (as was just pointed out) these later-generation Christians would try to make Pilate seem like a nice-enough guy to give in to religious sentiments of ONE Jew (Joseph of Arimathea) on the council and skip making an example of the crucified traitor who declared himself king.

"Well, sure, Joe... I realize that we're having trouble with this recently-conquered province, and that your religious fanatics want to declare their independence under a king who is not the Emperor's chosen subject, but for this one particular self-declared 'King of the Jews', why not make an exception and let him be buried in a noble manner, anyway, thereby publicly affirming my doubts about whether or not he was rightfully king after all? I was gonna let him rot without a decent burial, to discourage future such Messiah claimants, but I guess it couldn't hurt to make an exception right now. What's the worst that could happen if I did? Permission granted!"

It's so asinine that only True Believers™ could have put that idea forward.
Yep, I have also admired the Romans for showing Jesus the respect of covering his modesty with a loin cloth. Suuuure they did! I know there are a few depictions of a naked Jesus on the cross, but then you have the problem of how big to make his weiner.

In The Sexuality of Christ in Renaissance Art and in Modern Oblivion, art historian and critic Leo Steinberg notes that a number of Renaissance era artists depicted Jesus Christ after the crucifixion with a post-mortem erection. The artwork was suppressed by the Roman Catholic Church for several centuries.

[Image: JesusHChrist1.png]

In The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, Edward Gibbon relates an anecdote attributed to Abulfeda that Ali, on the death of Muhammad, exclaimed, O propheta, certe penis tuus cælum versus erectus est (O prophet, thy penis is erect unto the sky).


In Egyptian religion, the deceased pharoah is depicted with an erection. It was the norm at one time: http://www.livescience.com/42290-king-tu...ained.html

In 637AD Jerusalem fell to the Muslims and remained under the Muslim Caliphate until the 1920s when the Ottoman Empire was broken up. Muslims woudn't look for a grave of Jesus because they didn't think he was crucified so they would have suppressed anything to do with the Christian version of his death: https://www.missionislam.com/comprel/jesuscrucified.htm
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10-09-2016, 08:51 PM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(10-09-2016 08:33 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  
(02-09-2016 10:13 PM)Firefighter01 Wrote:  Yep, I have also admired the Romans for showing Jesus the respect of covering his modesty with a loin cloth. Suuuure they did! I know there are a few depictions of a naked Jesus on the cross, but then you have the problem of how big to make his weiner.

In The Sexuality of Christ in Renaissance Art and in Modern Oblivion, art historian and critic Leo Steinberg notes that a number of Renaissance era artists depicted Jesus Christ after the crucifixion with a post-mortem erection. The artwork was suppressed by the Roman Catholic Church for several centuries.

[Image: JesusHChrist1.png]

In The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, Edward Gibbon relates an anecdote attributed to Abulfeda that Ali, on the death of Muhammad, exclaimed, O propheta, certe penis tuus cælum versus erectus est (O prophet, thy penis is erect unto the sky).


In Egyptian religion, the deceased pharoah is depicted with an erection. It was the norm at one time: http://www.livescience.com/42290-king-tu...ained.html

In 637AD Jerusalem fell to the Muslims and remained under the Muslim Caliphate until the 1920s when the Ottoman Empire was broken up. Muslims woudn't look for a grave of Jesus because they didn't think he was crucified so they would have suppressed anything to do with the Christian version of his death: https://www.missionislam.com/comprel/jesuscrucified.htm

Woah nelly! Shocking I've heard of men getting an erection during a hanging but not during a crucifixion. Will wonders ever cease.

Can you provide a link to the deceased Egyptian pharoah erection ?

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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10-09-2016, 09:17 PM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(10-09-2016 08:33 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  
(02-09-2016 10:13 PM)Firefighter01 Wrote:  Yep, I have also admired the Romans for showing Jesus the respect of covering his modesty with a loin cloth. Suuuure they did! I know there are a few depictions of a naked Jesus on the cross, but then you have the problem of how big to make his weiner.

In The Sexuality of Christ in Renaissance Art and in Modern Oblivion, art historian and critic Leo Steinberg notes that a number of Renaissance era artists depicted Jesus Christ after the crucifixion with a post-mortem erection. The artwork was suppressed by the Roman Catholic Church for several centuries.

[Image: JesusHChrist1.png]

In The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, Edward Gibbon relates an anecdote attributed to Abulfeda that Ali, on the death of Muhammad, exclaimed, O propheta, certe penis tuus cælum versus erectus est (O prophet, thy penis is erect unto the sky).


In Egyptian religion, the deceased pharoah is depicted with an erection. It was the norm at one time: http://www.livescience.com/42290-king-tu...ained.html

In 637AD Jerusalem fell to the Muslims and remained under the Muslim Caliphate until the 1920s when the Ottoman Empire was broken up. Muslims woudn't look for a grave of Jesus because they didn't think he was crucified so they would have suppressed anything to do with the Christian version of his death: https://www.missionislam.com/comprel/jesuscrucified.htm

This appears to be a badly formed/carved set of abs. There is no way that anyone had a penis that size, notwithstanding the fact that the glans meatus is larger in diameter than the glans penis.
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10-09-2016, 09:27 PM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(10-09-2016 09:17 PM)Fireball Wrote:  
(10-09-2016 08:33 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  In The Sexuality of Christ in Renaissance Art and in Modern Oblivion, art historian and critic Leo Steinberg notes that a number of Renaissance era artists depicted Jesus Christ after the crucifixion with a post-mortem erection. The artwork was suppressed by the Roman Catholic Church for several centuries.

[Image: JesusHChrist1.png]

In The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, Edward Gibbon relates an anecdote attributed to Abulfeda that Ali, on the death of Muhammad, exclaimed, O propheta, certe penis tuus cælum versus erectus est (O prophet, thy penis is erect unto the sky).




In Egyptian religion, the deceased pharoah is depicted with an erection. It was the norm at one time: http://www.livescience.com/42290-king-tu...ained.html

In 637AD Jerusalem fell to the Muslims and remained under the Muslim Caliphate until the 1920s when the Ottoman Empire was broken up. Muslims woudn't look for a grave of Jesus because they didn't think he was crucified so they would have suppressed anything to do with the Christian version of his death: https://www.missionislam.com/comprel/jesuscrucified.htm

This appears to be a badly formed/carved set of abs. There is no way that anyone had a penis that size, notwithstanding the fact that the glans meatus is larger in diameter than the glans penis.

I think somebody is jealous....
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10-09-2016, 09:46 PM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(10-09-2016 09:17 PM)Fireball Wrote:  
(10-09-2016 08:33 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  In The Sexuality of Christ in Renaissance Art and in Modern Oblivion, art historian and critic Leo Steinberg notes that a number of Renaissance era artists depicted Jesus Christ after the crucifixion with a post-mortem erection. The artwork was suppressed by the Roman Catholic Church for several centuries.

[Image: JesusHChrist1.png]

In The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, Edward Gibbon relates an anecdote attributed to Abulfeda that Ali, on the death of Muhammad, exclaimed, O propheta, certe penis tuus cælum versus erectus est (O prophet, thy penis is erect unto the sky).


In Egyptian religion, the deceased pharoah is depicted with an erection. It was the norm at one time: http://www.livescience.com/42290-king-tu...ained.html

In 637AD Jerusalem fell to the Muslims and remained under the Muslim Caliphate until the 1920s when the Ottoman Empire was broken up. Muslims woudn't look for a grave of Jesus because they didn't think he was crucified so they would have suppressed anything to do with the Christian version of his death: https://www.missionislam.com/comprel/jesuscrucified.htm

This appears to be a badly formed/carved set of abs. There is no way that anyone had a penis that size, notwithstanding the fact that the glans meatus is larger in diameter than the glans penis.

I think you might be right. I enlarged it ( Rolleyes ) and it looks like a badly painted stomach. I think it's supposed to be a concave stomach, like that of some of the skinny Buddha's I've seen. Sorta like this one...

[Image: starving-buddha-statue-garland-image-39119743.jpg]

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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14-09-2016, 03:09 AM
RE: Jesus and His Forgotten Tomb
(10-09-2016 07:42 PM)GoingUp Wrote:  It simply doesn't make any sense at all for non believing Jews to embellish the life of a cursed man by building a shrine to him. No sense at all.

I was talking about the miracle working Jesus of the Bible, who Christians believe made a huge impact in Judea and was followed by thousands. If this was a real story, nobody would forget about it and would tell all of their friends and families for the rest of their lives.
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