Jesus historicity
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15-11-2014, 04:04 PM
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 03:48 PM)Free Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 03:35 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  I was going to go to the movies, but this is way better and surely will keep me entertained all night. Keep beating the horse, it never gets old.

For fuck sakes, some of these bastards have resurrected Jesus, who has now resurrected that dead fucking horse.

I don't know if I have enough interest to keep this going. All these dumb mythicist arguments have been destroyed many many MANY times.

I'll come back if I get bored of doing something more interesting.

Right, 'dumb' because you have no rational argument to make against it.

I also believe a historical Jesus existed, simply because its not an extraordinary claim to think a legend was inspired by a real man. The fact is though, there is no evidence to suggest he actually did exist. You and I are simply speculating to a non-evident person only. Just like I said before, like Achilles.

For a supposed historian that you claim to be. You throw up a lot of red flags to me. Such as stating that no one in history can be known to exist if we question the authenticity of that person source (in this case Tacitus). Well failing to understand that all other historical figures have other supporting 'contemporary' evidences and sources to collaborate to and not just hearsay.

I like the part where you stated 'I win' while plugging your ears and screaming la-la-la-la.

Arguing with a Christian is a lot like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be the greatest player in the world, yet the pigeon will knock over all the pieces, shit on the board and strut away triumphantly.
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15-11-2014, 04:23 PM (This post was last modified: 15-11-2014 04:42 PM by Free.)
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 04:04 PM)StorMFront Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 03:48 PM)Free Wrote:  For fuck sakes, some of these bastards have resurrected Jesus, who has now resurrected that dead fucking horse.

I don't know if I have enough interest to keep this going. All these dumb mythicist arguments have been destroyed many many MANY times.

I'll come back if I get bored of doing something more interesting.

Right, 'dumb' because you have no rational argument to make against it.

I also believe a historical Jesus existed, simply because its not an extraordinary claim to think a legend was inspired by a real man. The fact is though, there is no evidence to suggest he actually did exist. You and I are simply speculating to a non-evident person only. Just like I said before, like Achilles.

For a supposed historian that you claim to be. You throw up a lot of red flags to me. Such as stating that no one in history can be known to exist if we question the authenticity of that person source (in this case Tacitus). Well failing to understand that all other historical figures have other supporting 'contemporary' evidences and sources to collaborate to and not just hearsay.

I like the part where you stated 'I win' while plugging your ears and screaming la-la-la-la.

No, it's "dumb" because your fucking arguments are not arguments at all. Let me give you a very simple demonstration of how fucking stupid these mythicist arguments are, okay?

Watch and learn. Here is goodwithoutgod's "pasted" argument regarding Philo:

Quote:Philo of Alexandria
The early years of the Roman Republic is one of the most historically documented times in history. One of the writers alive during the time of Jesus was Philo-Judaeus (sometimes known as Philo of Alexandria).

Philo was born before the beginning of the Christian era, and lived until long after the reputed death of Christ. He wrote an account of the Jews covering the entire time that Christ is said to have existed on earth. He was living in or near Jerusalem when Christ’s miraculous birth and the Herodian massacre occurred. He was there when Christ made his triumphal entry into Jerusalem. He was there when the crucifixion happened with its attendant earthquake, supernatural darkness and resurrection of the dead took place – when Christ himself rose from the dead and in the presence of many witnesses ascended into heaven. These amazing marvelous events which must have filled the world with amazement, had they really occurred, were all unknown to him.

Lesson two:

It was Philo who developed the doctrine of the Logos, or Word, and although this Word incarnate dwelt in that very land and in the presence of multitudes revealed himself and demonstrated his divine powers, Philo saw it not.

Philo might be considered the investigative reporter of his day. He was there on location during the early first century, talking with people who should have remembered or at least heard the stories, observed, taking notes, documenting. He reported nothing about Jesus.


Justus of Tiberius
There was also a historian named Justus of Tiberius who was a native of Galilee, the homeland of Jesus. He wrote a history covering the time when Christ supposedly lived. This history is now lost, but a ninth century Christian scholar named Photius had read it and wrote: “he [Justus] makes not the least mention of the appearance of Christ, of what things happened to him, or other wonderful works that he did.”

Okay so Philo didn't say anything. How the fuck does saying nothing prove anything? An argument from silence is somehow an argument? Because someone didn't say something, well by golly, it never happened?

How the fuck does that utter stupidity ever make it into a discussion?

Not only that, the big question is this:

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

Do you know that Philo lived in Egypt and NOT Judea?
Do you know he was a Hellenistic Jew who attempted to combine Jewish and Greek philosophies?
Do you know he was not accepted in Orthodox Jews/Judaism at ALL?

Do you really think they had mass communication in ancient times where news of a localized "historical" Jesus somewhere in Judea would have reached some obscure Hellenistic Jew in Egypt?

So ...

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

And that is why the mythicist's arguments are so fucking retarded.

Get bent.

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15-11-2014, 05:19 PM (This post was last modified: 15-11-2014 05:41 PM by StorMFront.)
RE: Jesus historicity
OK, now I know you are no historian. Philo says absolutely nothing on Jesus, he only speaks of Christians. What a joke, stating you are a historian you got to be fucking kidding me. If anyone believes that, I also have a bridge in London to sell them.

All you have done is demonstrate your ignorance on Jesus historicity and how disingenuous you are.

Arguing with a Christian is a lot like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be the greatest player in the world, yet the pigeon will knock over all the pieces, shit on the board and strut away triumphantly.
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15-11-2014, 05:29 PM
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 04:23 PM)Free Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 04:04 PM)StorMFront Wrote:  Right, 'dumb' because you have no rational argument to make against it.

I also believe a historical Jesus existed, simply because its not an extraordinary claim to think a legend was inspired by a real man. The fact is though, there is no evidence to suggest he actually did exist. You and I are simply speculating to a non-evident person only. Just like I said before, like Achilles.

For a supposed historian that you claim to be. You throw up a lot of red flags to me. Such as stating that no one in history can be known to exist if we question the authenticity of that person source (in this case Tacitus). Well failing to understand that all other historical figures have other supporting 'contemporary' evidences and sources to collaborate to and not just hearsay.

I like the part where you stated 'I win' while plugging your ears and screaming la-la-la-la.

No, it's "dumb" because your fucking arguments are not arguments at all. Let me give you a very simple demonstration of how fucking stupid these mythicist arguments are, okay?

Watch and learn. Here is goodwithoutgod's "pasted" argument regarding Philo:

Quote:Philo of Alexandria
The early years of the Roman Republic is one of the most historically documented times in history. One of the writers alive during the time of Jesus was Philo-Judaeus (sometimes known as Philo of Alexandria).

Philo was born before the beginning of the Christian era, and lived until long after the reputed death of Christ. He wrote an account of the Jews covering the entire time that Christ is said to have existed on earth. He was living in or near Jerusalem when Christ’s miraculous birth and the Herodian massacre occurred. He was there when Christ made his triumphal entry into Jerusalem. He was there when the crucifixion happened with its attendant earthquake, supernatural darkness and resurrection of the dead took place – when Christ himself rose from the dead and in the presence of many witnesses ascended into heaven. These amazing marvelous events which must have filled the world with amazement, had they really occurred, were all unknown to him.

Lesson two:

It was Philo who developed the doctrine of the Logos, or Word, and although this Word incarnate dwelt in that very land and in the presence of multitudes revealed himself and demonstrated his divine powers, Philo saw it not.

Philo might be considered the investigative reporter of his day. He was there on location during the early first century, talking with people who should have remembered or at least heard the stories, observed, taking notes, documenting. He reported nothing about Jesus.


Justus of Tiberius
There was also a historian named Justus of Tiberius who was a native of Galilee, the homeland of Jesus. He wrote a history covering the time when Christ supposedly lived. This history is now lost, but a ninth century Christian scholar named Photius had read it and wrote: “he [Justus] makes not the least mention of the appearance of Christ, of what things happened to him, or other wonderful works that he did.”

Okay so Philo didn't say anything. How the fuck does saying nothing prove anything? An argument from silence is somehow an argument? Because someone didn't say something, well by golly, it never happened?

How the fuck does that utter stupidity ever make it into a discussion?

Not only that, the big question is this:

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

Do you know that Philo lived in Egypt and NOT Judea?
Do you know he was a Hellenistic Jew who attempted to combine Jewish and Greek philosophies?
Do you know he was not accepted in Orthodox Jews/Judaism at ALL?

Do you really think they had mass communication in ancient times where news of a localized "historical" Jesus somewhere in Judea would have reached some obscure Hellenistic Jew in Egypt?

So ...

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

And that is why the mythicist's arguments are so fucking retarded.

Get bent.

Is this guy an atheist? lol

You seem to get worked up a lot over this topic. Normally people with rational arguments will stay calm. Why are you getting agitated and resorting to irrational behaviour over a civil conversation? When people start displaying emotional responses it tends to indicate they have lost the debate.

Really, what have you presented other then speculation and assertions? Nothing at all.
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15-11-2014, 05:32 PM
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 05:19 PM)StorMFront Wrote:  OK, now I know you are no historian. Philo says absolutely nothing on Jesus, he only speaks of Christians. What a joke, stating you are a historian you got to be fucking kidding me. If anyone believes that, I also have a bridge in London to sell them.

Oh ... so he speaks of Christians, does he? Laughat

Go ... a ... way.

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15-11-2014, 05:33 PM
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 05:29 PM)StorMRising Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 04:23 PM)Free Wrote:  No, it's "dumb" because your fucking arguments are not arguments at all. Let me give you a very simple demonstration of how fucking stupid these mythicist arguments are, okay?

Watch and learn. Here is goodwithoutgod's "pasted" argument regarding Philo:


Okay so Philo didn't say anything. How the fuck does saying nothing prove anything? An argument from silence is somehow an argument? Because someone didn't say something, well by golly, it never happened?

How the fuck does that utter stupidity ever make it into a discussion?

Not only that, the big question is this:

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

Do you know that Philo lived in Egypt and NOT Judea?
Do you know he was a Hellenistic Jew who attempted to combine Jewish and Greek philosophies?
Do you know he was not accepted in Orthodox Jews/Judaism at ALL?

Do you really think they had mass communication in ancient times where news of a localized "historical" Jesus somewhere in Judea would have reached some obscure Hellenistic Jew in Egypt?

So ...

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

And that is why the mythicist's arguments are so fucking retarded.

Get bent.

Is this guy an atheist? lol

You seem to get worked up a lot over this topic. Normally people with rational arguments will stay calm. Why are you getting agitated and resorting to irrational behaviour over a civil conversation? When people start displaying emotional responses it tends to indicate they have lost the debate.

Really, what have you presented other then speculation and assertions? Nothing at all.

Anyone wanna deal with what appears to be a couple of sock puppets?

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15-11-2014, 05:38 PM
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 05:29 PM)StorMRising Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 04:23 PM)Free Wrote:  No, it's "dumb" because your fucking arguments are not arguments at all. Let me give you a very simple demonstration of how fucking stupid these mythicist arguments are, okay?

Watch and learn. Here is goodwithoutgod's "pasted" argument regarding Philo:


Okay so Philo didn't say anything. How the fuck does saying nothing prove anything? An argument from silence is somehow an argument? Because someone didn't say something, well by golly, it never happened?

How the fuck does that utter stupidity ever make it into a discussion?

Not only that, the big question is this:

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

Do you know that Philo lived in Egypt and NOT Judea?
Do you know he was a Hellenistic Jew who attempted to combine Jewish and Greek philosophies?
Do you know he was not accepted in Orthodox Jews/Judaism at ALL?

Do you really think they had mass communication in ancient times where news of a localized "historical" Jesus somewhere in Judea would have reached some obscure Hellenistic Jew in Egypt?

So ...

WHY THE FUCK WOULD PHILO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT JESUS?

And that is why the mythicist's arguments are so fucking retarded.

Get bent.

Is this guy an atheist? lol

You seem to get worked up a lot over this topic. Normally people with rational arguments will stay calm. Why are you getting agitated and resorting to irrational behaviour over a civil conversation? When people start displaying emotional responses it tends to indicate they have lost the debate.

Really, what have you presented other then speculation and assertions? Nothing at all.

Haha ...

Am I an atheist? Why the fuck do idiots like you automatically play the "he isn't an atheist" card whenever an atheist accepts the historicity of Jesus?

Is there some private club or creed that atheists need to take that entails something to the effect of "Deny Jesus ever existed, even if he showed up at your front door with a harp and 1000 angels in tow?"

For fuck sakes get over yourselves.

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15-11-2014, 05:39 PM (This post was last modified: 15-11-2014 05:46 PM by StorMRising.)
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 05:38 PM)Free Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 05:29 PM)StorMRising Wrote:  Is this guy an atheist? lol

You seem to get worked up a lot over this topic. Normally people with rational arguments will stay calm. Why are you getting agitated and resorting to irrational behaviour over a civil conversation? When people start displaying emotional responses it tends to indicate they have lost the debate.

Really, what have you presented other then speculation and assertions? Nothing at all.

Haha ...

Am I an atheist? Why the fuck do idiots like you automatically play the "he isn't an atheist" card whenever an atheist accepts the historicity of Jesus?

Is there some private club or creed that atheists need to take that entails something to the effect of "Deny Jesus ever existed, even if he showed up at your front door with a harp and 1000 angels in tow?"

For fuck sakes get over yourselves.

I explained why, because you are becoming ignorant and blatantly hostile to what is being said. I typically only see this behaviour from Christians that have no argument.
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15-11-2014, 05:43 PM (This post was last modified: 15-11-2014 05:48 PM by StorMRising.)
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 05:32 PM)Free Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 05:19 PM)StorMFront Wrote:  OK, now I know you are no historian. Philo says absolutely nothing on Jesus, he only speaks of Christians. What a joke, stating you are a historian you got to be fucking kidding me. If anyone believes that, I also have a bridge in London to sell them.

Oh ... so he speaks of Christians, does he? Laughat

Go ... a ... way.
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15-11-2014, 05:48 PM
RE: Jesus historicity
(15-11-2014 05:43 PM)StorMRising Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 05:32 PM)Free Wrote:  Oh ... so he speaks of Christians, does he? Laughat

Go ... a ... way.

Citations of what he said on Jesus?

Dude, he said nothing on Jesus, or Christians.

That's the point.

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