Jesus in the desert
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19-10-2014, 12:58 PM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(18-10-2014 10:34 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  When I first learned about this story (I was in college at the time) that's the very first thing I thought of. Who was there to record it?

The devil obviously. Drinking Beverage

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19-10-2014, 01:58 PM
RE: Jesus in the desert
This exact thing was pointed out in a book called the atheists critique of the new testament. I find it really funny how a lot of the stuff of X person being alone somewhere is somehow recorded perfectly later on by people who couldn't write or have witnessed what actually may had happened.

Example: How do we know the voices from the sky "god" was not just their own voices inside their head.

Like, they had no idea the difference between the voice they hear when someone thinks to themselves and auditory voices from the outside? People were kinda stupid back then.


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19-10-2014, 02:27 PM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(19-10-2014 12:58 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(18-10-2014 10:34 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  When I first learned about this story (I was in college at the time) that's the very first thing I thought of. Who was there to record it?

The devil obviously. Drinking Beverage

You make one hell of an argument. Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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19-10-2014, 02:31 PM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(19-10-2014 01:58 PM)Shadow Fox Wrote:  This exact thing was pointed out in a book called the atheists critique of the new testament. I find it really funny how a lot of the stuff of X person being alone somewhere is somehow recorded perfectly later on by people who couldn't write or have witnessed what actually may had happened.

Example: How do we know the voices from the sky "god" was not just their own voices inside their head.

Like, they had no idea the difference between the voice they hear when someone thinks to themselves and auditory voices from the outside? People were kinda stupid back then.

Or possibly The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind, Julian Jaynes.
Or possibly not.

Someone here (Girly?) succinctly commented that this is either a work of genius or utter nonsense.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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19-10-2014, 03:07 PM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(19-10-2014 01:58 PM)Shadow Fox Wrote:  This exact thing was pointed out in a book called the atheists critique of the new testament. I find it really funny how a lot of the stuff of X person being alone somewhere is somehow recorded perfectly later on by people who couldn't write or have witnessed what actually may had happened.

Example: How do we know the voices from the sky "god" was not just their own voices inside their head.

Like, they had no idea the difference between the voice they hear when someone thinks to themselves and auditory voices from the outside? People were kinda stupid back then.

I think when writers write novels they sort of hear the voices of each characters in their heads. It's probably the same type of thing.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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19-10-2014, 06:42 PM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(19-10-2014 02:31 PM)Chas Wrote:  Or possibly The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind, Julian Jaynes.
Finally, someone else who has seen that book!
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20-10-2014, 06:07 AM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(18-10-2014 10:34 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  So Jesus is alone in the desert being tempted by the devil and has this conversation with the Bad Guy . Ok, so who wrote down what was said? How do theists know that these were the exact words Jesus said to the devil? Theists go crazy over each and every little word and treat each word like it's a gold nugget to be weighed and discussed ad nauseam. Yet theists never think about the practicalities of getting the precise words from Jesus' mouth onto a page especially when the guy was supposed to be alone out in the desert.
Who was taking notes when Moses talked with the burning bush?

Ditto when he came down from the mountain with the tablets. How do we know he didn't make it up himself? Most of the commandments are plagiarized from the Code of Hammurabi.

Also, he made two trips up the mountain. When he came down the first time he found the Israelites worshiping a golden idol and he smashed the tablets. Did anyone bother to pick up the shards of the first set, put the back together like a jigsaw puzzle and compare them with the second set?

With all these prophets walking around Israel in the Old Testament did anyone ever vet any of them? How do you vet a prophet?

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20-10-2014, 10:33 AM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(20-10-2014 06:07 AM)f stop Wrote:  
(18-10-2014 10:34 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  So Jesus is alone in the desert being tempted by the devil and has this conversation with the Bad Guy . Ok, so who wrote down what was said? How do theists know that these were the exact words Jesus said to the devil? Theists go crazy over each and every little word and treat each word like it's a gold nugget to be weighed and discussed ad nauseam. Yet theists never think about the practicalities of getting the precise words from Jesus' mouth onto a page especially when the guy was supposed to be alone out in the desert.
Who was taking notes when Moses talked with the burning bush?

Ditto when he came down from the mountain with the tablets. How do we know he didn't make it up himself? Most of the commandments are plagiarized from the Code of Hammurabi.

Also, he made two trips up the mountain. When he came down the first time he found the Israelites worshiping a golden idol and he smashed the tablets. Did anyone bother to pick up the shards of the first set, put the back together like a jigsaw puzzle and compare them with the second set?

With all these prophets walking around Israel in the Old Testament did anyone ever vet any of them? How do you vet a prophet?

And then there's Mary, when she's told by an angel that's she's pregnant with Jesus, Who was around to confirm this? No one.

Also, the age of consent for women in Biblical times was 12 so Mary might have been just a child. A child with quite an imagination.

This would be considered statutory rape today. God, the rapist of little girls.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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20-10-2014, 10:58 AM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(18-10-2014 10:51 PM)Fodder_From_The_Truth Wrote:  Critical thinking is not a requirement of a believer. Quite frankly its frowned upon.

Wish i could give you more rep points!!!

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20-10-2014, 11:24 AM
RE: Jesus in the desert
(18-10-2014 10:34 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  So Jesus is alone in the desert being tempted by the devil and has this conversation with the Bad Guy . Ok, so who wrote down what was said? How do theists know that these were the exact words Jesus said to the devil? Theists go crazy over each and every little word and treat each word like it's a gold nugget to be weighed and discussed ad nauseam. Yet theists never think about the practicalities of getting the precise words from Jesus' mouth onto a page especially when the guy was supposed to be alone out in the desert.

When I first learned about this story (I was in college at the time) that's the very first thing I thought of. Who was there to record it?

The other "alone story" is the Garden of Gethsemane when he goes out alone while the others are asleep.

To those of you who were at one time believers, did this ever cross your mind?

It has crossed my mind. And I am surprised that no one so far has provided some simple possibilities (assuming text is accurate). Jesus could have told the story of his desert pilgrimage to followers--one rather simple explanation. Moses was both a writer (if you believe Moses wrote some of his five books, I don't think he wrote all their content) and wrote down what he experienced.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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