Jesus prayed to himself!?
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31-07-2014, 08:33 AM
Jesus prayed to himself!?
There are various scenes in the gospels where Jesus was praying. If the trinity doctrine is accepted does this mean Jesus is praying to himself? How does the whole "take this cup from me" prayer when he was about to be crucified make any sense? I know it's all crap to begin with but at least have a religion that makes some sense.
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31-07-2014, 09:07 AM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
Most religions impose the supernatural for their proof, but are unable to show that supernatural event or being. So sense, is likely something that a religion will lack. If I tell a christian that I walked on water, they'd call me a liar, but when Jesus did it, it's cool. As far as the trinity, there are way more crazy scenarios and images that come to mind with the trinity mind-f*** than simply if he was praying to himself. But yes, its still silly.

And yet another interesting topic I am not interested in.
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31-07-2014, 09:28 AM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
Perhaps the trinity is a case of multiple personality disorder undiagnosed. Medical coverage at the time lacked provisions for mental health, so people with MPD would go untreated. Sometimes something one personality would do would cause trouble and pfft, the whole person would be executed. Thus, while praying to one of one's alter egos to have a care for the others would technically be praying to oneself, in the context of MPD it could have life saving consequences. It didn't work so well for Jesus, but then there's no call to condemn a whole paradigm on the basis of a single failure.

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31-07-2014, 10:35 AM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
Verses like that are the reason my two cults (Jehovah's Witnesses and The Way International) refuse to believe in the Trinity. Bart Ehrman makes a decent case that the earliest Christians did not believe Jesus was God, but that the belief developed over time. That's why you can't find a trace of the doctrine in Matthew Mark and Luke, but suddenly you can't get rid of it with John, the last of the gospels to be written.

Having participated in the "Trinitarian v. Biblical Unitarian" debate for a good chunk of my adult life, I can say with confidence that both sides are adept at ignoring or "explaining away" conflicting evidence. Ultimately, there can be no winning argument because the Bible genuinely sends conflicting messages about who Jesus is or was.

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31-07-2014, 11:01 AM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
(31-07-2014 08:33 AM)john2 Wrote:  If the trinity doctrine is accepted does this mean Jesus is praying to himself?

I know I am.

#sigh
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31-07-2014, 11:43 AM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
We're not "supposed" to understand. I was taught about the trinity, and that god was so powerful and wise that we could never understand his ways. Even Jesus, who supposedly walked the earth as a man, was beyond anything we could comprehend. And that's how it's done--if things get too confusing, or they start to contradict each other, it's "God is beyond everything."

It's amusing to me, what you bring up. Jesus did cry out to god, his father, on the cross. So was he actually crying out to himself? I suppose it's the same kind of thing. Maybe while he was praying he was just thinking of random things. Like what he'd eat for dinner lol.

It's all very silly.

"Did IQs just drop sharply while I was away?" --Ellen Ripley
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31-07-2014, 01:56 PM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
I recently wondered about this. Did they miss the "If possible take this cup from me, but not my will, but thine be done" thingy. Laughat

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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31-07-2014, 03:09 PM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
The Trinity was a concept invented by the Catholic church well after the gospels were written, so you'll find these verses that aren't really aware of the future doctrine of the Trinity.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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31-07-2014, 04:50 PM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
Supposedly Jesus prayed to inform Christians about the importance of communicating with God. and Jesus was supposed to be the example. John 13:15 says "For I have set you an example, that you also should do as I have done to you."

Jesus prayed right before He raised Lazarus from the dead: "Father, I thank you for having heard me. 42 I knew that you always hear me, but I have said this for the sake of the crowd standing here, so that they may believe that you sent me," John 11:41-42.

So it seems quite silly regardless. He is the second person of the Trinity yet He has a Father who is himself. And in Gethsemane he prayed that His Father would remove the Cup (of suffering). So he is asking Himself to remove the Cup but then saying "Not my will be done but thy will be done".

Luke 22:42"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."

Extremely Bizzare!
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01-08-2014, 07:15 PM
RE: Jesus prayed to himself!?
(31-07-2014 04:50 PM)Wicked Clown Wrote:  Supposedly Jesus prayed to inform Christians about the importance of communicating with God. and Jesus was supposed to be the example. John 13:15 says "For I have set you an example, that you also should do as I have done to you."

Jesus prayed right before He raised Lazarus from the dead: "Father, I thank you for having heard me. 42 I knew that you always hear me, but I have said this for the sake of the crowd standing here, so that they may believe that you sent me," John 11:41-42.

So it seems quite silly regardless. He is the second person of the Trinity yet He has a Father who is himself. And in Gethsemane he prayed that His Father would remove the Cup (of suffering). So he is asking Himself to remove the Cup but then saying "Not my will be done but thy will be done".

Luke 22:42"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."

Extremely Bizzare!

Being the very pragmatic person that I am, I always wondered who wrote this prayer down. The disciples were asleep so how did they know what exactly Jesus said.

40: Then he returned to his disciples and found them sleeping.


Did Jesus have a stenographer who followed him around and wrote down everything that he said? If that was the case then he really wasn't alone in the garden, was he. Orrrrr, perhaps Jesus told his disciples all about what took place in the garden sometime later "Yeah, I was out in the garden and while you guys were sleeping I talked to god.....or maybe I was talking to myself when I was talking to myself........" Sounds like he was either bragging about his experience in the garden or on some funny mushrooms to me...... but what do I know.

Actually I wonder where any and all of the dialogue came from that Jesus was supposed to have said. What about Mary, when the angel came and told her she was with child. Was there some guy in the corner writing this down or did Mary tell someone later. Mary: "Hey, this angel came and told me I was so pure and wonderful that I was going to have the son of god." Girlfriend next door: Ummm, sure Mary, what ever you say."

It's all so utterly stupid. Facepalm

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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