"Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
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12-09-2011, 02:31 AM
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(09-09-2011 01:53 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Nice bump. Dunno why GrilyMan hadn't responded to these before now, must've missed them.

I'm gonna preface my comments with I don't accept any text as sacred. That gives me the clearing I need to pick and choose what I think feels right and ignore the bullshit. Granted this is kinda an end-around from the point Mark keeps trying to make that Jesus was an asshole. But I see him as a man just like me. In his finer moments he espoused compassion and empathy and liberation and enlightenment, in his lesser moments he was an asshole spewing forth shit. Just like me.

(03-09-2011 07:23 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  “There are eunuchs born that way from their mother’s womb, there are eunuchs made so by men and there are eunuchs who have made themselves that way for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let anyone accept this who can.” (Matthew 19:12 NJB).

Okay, this GirlyMan can't accept it. Which is why this pharmaceutically induced eunuch slaps testosterone gel on every day. Poof, no more GirlyMan.

(03-09-2011 07:23 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  “If a man looks at a woman lustfully, he has already committed adultery with her in his heart” (Matthew 5:28 NJB).

Well hell, since I've already fucked her in my heart, I might as well go home and beat off so that I've fucked her in my head too. What I won't do is actually try to physically fuck her lest I spooge a perfectly happy 25 year monogamous marriage.

(03-09-2011 07:23 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  “If your right eye should cause you to sin, tear it out and throw it away; for it will do you less harm to lose one part of you than to have your whole body thrown into hell. And if your right hand should cause you to sin, cut it off and throw it away” (Matthew 5:29 NJB).

As a diagnosed manic depressive in my teens followed by a decades long major depressive disorder with more than a little familiarity with OCD, I see this as completely allegorical and cautionary. Little obsessions can quickly degenerate into something far more dangerous and sinister. Nip them in the bud.

(03-09-2011 07:23 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  "To the man who slaps you on one cheek, give him the other cheek too" (Luke 6:29-30 NJB)

The damage they are inflicting on themselves is far greater than the damage they are doing to you. Give them the opportunity to hoist themselves on their own petard. This is why I never raised a hand or expressed anger at any of my four now adult children. It would've damaged me far more than it possibly could've benefited them. Fortunately, they all respond well to reason.

(03-09-2011 07:23 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  “I say this to you: love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you.” (Matthew 5:44 NJB).

Not so odd. Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

Like I said in my preface, this is kinda orthogonal to the point Mark keeps trying to make that Jesus was an asshole. Yes he was, who isn't? By not recognizing any text as sacred, I get to pick and choose those teachings which I find compelling while rejecting those which are bullshit. Not only do I think I can I do this all by myself, I think I have to.

Just for the record, I don't imagine the genuine historical figure Jesus, if he ever existed, was an asshole. I think he was a youngish Jewish zealot who tried to start a war with Rome and lost, and that's about all we can know for sure about him.

The mythical character portrayed in the gospels certainly talked like an asshole at times and he certainly wasn't the benign wisdom sprouting preacher of love and benevolence churches try to portray him as.
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12-09-2011, 01:21 PM
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(11-09-2011 02:09 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Who's going to defend Jesus when you're gone?
No one needs to defend Jesus. Nothing you do or say can hurt him.

How you see his words depends on the purpose for which you read them. If you are trying to understand him I am sure you can do that without my help. If you have made up your mind that what he teaches is wrong then there is nothing I can say that will make you change your mind.

The information in ancient libraries came from real minds of real people. The far more complex information in cells came from the far more intelligent mind of God.
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12-09-2011, 01:54 PM
 
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(12-09-2011 01:21 PM)theophilus Wrote:  
(11-09-2011 02:09 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Who's going to defend Jesus when you're gone?
No one needs to defend Jesus. Nothing you do or say can hurt him.

How you see his words depends on the purpose for which you read them. If you are trying to understand him I am sure you can do that without my help. If you have made up your mind that what he teaches is wrong then there is nothing I can say that will make you change your mind.

Uh, i thought taking his name in vein upsetted his day....sure i read that somewhere. He and his dad have thin skin and short tempers. Its quite evident that Sticks, Stones, His name used wrongly, Bumping Uglies wrong and just about everything else that constitutes the human experience bothers him.

If you need a reference, just read the Old Testament....then Fast Fowared to Matthew 5:17 for clarity.

Dennis
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12-09-2011, 09:42 PM (This post was last modified: 12-09-2011 09:51 PM by Mark Fulton.)
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(12-09-2011 01:21 PM)theophilus Wrote:  
(11-09-2011 02:09 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Who's going to defend Jesus when you're gone?
No one needs to defend Jesus. Nothing you do or say can hurt him.

How you see his words depends on the purpose for which you read them. If you are trying to understand him I am sure you can do that without my help. If you have made up your mind that what he teaches is wrong then there is nothing I can say that will make you change your mind.

Re "No one needs to defend Jesus. Nothing you do or say can hurt him."

I agree. It's impossible to hurt someone once they're dead LOL


Re "How you see his words depends on the purpose for which you read them."

Well, that's obviously why you and many others interpret Jesus' words. I, at least, take him on face value. If he threatened to burn me in hell for being a bad boy, I reckon he meant it. Whether I believe he's capable of carrying out his threats is another issue.

Re "If you have made up your mind that what he teaches is wrong then there is nothing I can say that will make you change your mind."

Gee Theo, that's rather defeatist of you. Jesus is God right? Think of the joy in heaven if you convert me. Think of the browny points you'll get Theo. You might get an upgrade from business class to first class if you save my wicked ass. Big Grin
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13-09-2011, 10:40 AM
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(12-09-2011 09:42 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Gee Theo, that's rather defeatist of you. Jesus is God right? Think of the joy in heaven if you convert me. Think of the browny points you'll get Theo. You might get an upgrade from business class to first class if you save my wicked ass. Big Grin

I can't convert or save anyone. All I can do is tell you what God has revealed through the Bible and then how you respond is up to you.

The information in ancient libraries came from real minds of real people. The far more complex information in cells came from the far more intelligent mind of God.
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13-09-2011, 11:06 AM
 
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(13-09-2011 10:40 AM)theophilus Wrote:  
(12-09-2011 09:42 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Gee Theo, that's rather defeatist of you. Jesus is God right? Think of the joy in heaven if you convert me. Think of the browny points you'll get Theo. You might get an upgrade from business class to first class if you save my wicked ass. Big Grin

I can't convert or save anyone. All I can do is tell you what God has revealed through the Bible and then how you respond is up to you.

All god revealed in the bible is that he cant get his story of creation straight. He has a problem with kids (Abraham's son, 1st born of Egypt, his OWN son). And that he's got such terrible human traits as Jealousy and Anger..and if you cross him he zaps you dead, over the the smallest of reasons.

Thats worthy of praise? Sounds pretty sloppy and clumsy to me.

D
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13-09-2011, 05:00 PM
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(13-09-2011 10:40 AM)theophilus Wrote:  
(12-09-2011 09:42 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Gee Theo, that's rather defeatist of you. Jesus is God right? Think of the joy in heaven if you convert me. Think of the browny points you'll get Theo. You might get an upgrade from business class to first class if you save my wicked ass. Big Grin

I can't convert or save anyone. All I can do is tell you what God has revealed through the Bible and then how you respond is up to you.

Do you believe that if more people understood the bible in the same way you do the world would be a better place?
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13-09-2011, 07:17 PM
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
One of my favourite Jesus nasty moments is when he drives the demons out of 1 or 2 possessed men(1 or 2 depending on whose account you read) and sends the demons into 2000 pigs who race off into the sea(or a lake) and drown.

Of course, the Jews hated pigs, but to the gentiles the pigs would have been their livelihood for the next 5 years. No wonder they drove Jesus out of town, it's a wonder they didn't stone him to death.

So did Jesus compensate them? Not a chance! He was just happy that he proved how powerful he was. Stuff the villagers,let them starve!

"To think of what the world has suffered from superstition, from religion, from the worship of beast and stone and god, is
almost enough to make one insane."

Robert G. Ingersoll
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14-09-2011, 02:13 AM
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(13-09-2011 10:40 AM)theophilus Wrote:  
(12-09-2011 09:42 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Gee Theo, that's rather defeatist of you. Jesus is God right? Think of the joy in heaven if you convert me. Think of the browny points you'll get Theo. You might get an upgrade from business class to first class if you save my wicked ass. Big Grin

I can't convert or save anyone. All I can do is tell you what God has revealed through the Bible and then how you respond is up to you.

Don't admit that too loudly in church. You'll get a long sideward glance from the dude up the front who's trying to build up his flockBig Grin
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14-09-2011, 02:27 AM
RE: "Jesus" really wasn't such a great guy!
(14-09-2011 02:13 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(13-09-2011 10:40 AM)theophilus Wrote:  
(12-09-2011 09:42 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Gee Theo, that's rather defeatist of you. Jesus is God right? Think of the joy in heaven if you convert me. Think of the browny points you'll get Theo. You might get an upgrade from business class to first class if you save my wicked ass. Big Grin

I can't convert or save anyone. All I can do is tell you what God has revealed through the Bible and then how you respond is up to you.

Don't admit that too loudly in church. You'll get a long sideward glance from the dude up the front who's trying to build up his flockBig Grin

Yeah and that's what it's all about. Build the flock, build the flock of brainless sheep, keep the coffers filled, protect the jobs of those that prey(sic) that the mindless ones keep coming and perpetuate the myth, the scam, keep them in fear of their afterlife, promise them all that they seek to comfort them in their quest for perfection of afterlife, no matter how full of shit their life on Earth is.

What a machine, the Christianity conveyor belt!

"To think of what the world has suffered from superstition, from religion, from the worship of beast and stone and god, is
almost enough to make one insane."

Robert G. Ingersoll
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